cam gear change

[DaveBPT]

Just figured out the the cam gear on my '30 is loose( fiber gear ). What is the consensus on changing both the cam and crank gears? If I change the crank gear I will need to lower the oil pan. Is it safe to do that without supporting the engine somehow?

Dave

[CarlG]

I would change out both the cam and crank gears. Get a matched set from Dan. He makes both aluminum and bronze gears. I prefer the bronze one.

TIMING GEARS
1. No known website: Dan McEachern (510) 532-8228 (Californaia)

[tbirdtbird]

let us know how you make out

[CarlG]

Originally Posted by tbirdtbird

...Carl, if you have changed the crank gear while still in the motor we would love to hear how you did it

Engine was out of the vehicle both times, but the crank was still in the engine. Used a 3-leg puller, no heat. Could have done it with the engine in the car, but the radiator would have had to come off.

[tbirdtbird]

it doesn't seem like there is enough room behind the gear for the legs......

[TerryH]

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Just a suggestion, but if you do not want to go to that much trouble, the newer laminated timing gears seem to work much better than the older fiber ones. I had mine recently replaced with one, and our local Model A mechanic, Jim Nichols, has not had any issues with them over several years. Only took a couple of hours vs pulling the engine. He also told me he had installed some metal ones over the years that were noisy, and the owners had them removed. I know the ones Dan makes are very well regarded, but I certainly did not want to pull my engine for that. If you are needing to pull it anyway, probably makes good sense.

[H. L. Chauvin]

Hi Dave,

Think for a moment.

Every Model A owner can agree that every individual's Model A situation can be very different ..... one's age, one's capabilities, condition of existing metal crank gear, mileage driven per year, engine in car or engine out of car, just to name a few.

FWIW, in your particular unknown case, I would suggest you should never hesitate to call someone like Mr. Walt Bratton about his specially advertised fiber timing gears for the type of durability you are seeking and expecting.

After 20 years of asking him questions, his answers were always found to be most sincere & truthful.

Like why ask a Hemorrhoid Doctor for a prescription "opinion" for your particular glass lenses just because the Hemorrhoid Doctor has one pair of glasses ...... why not ask an Optometrist who sells glasses year round and hears about hundreds of eye glass failures every year.

Hope this helps to find what you are looking for.

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by tbirdtbird

be warned that it is extremely difficult to remove the crank gear if the crank is in the motor. Two tapped holes should have been provided so that a puller could be used, but that never happened.

If you attempt to remove it and fail/chew up your old gear then you are stuck and will need to remove the engine/crank from the car.

I have changed out the cam gear only on several customer cars without any trouble. Of course we checked the crank gear to be sure it wasn't chewed up first.

Whatever you do, don't heat the gear unless you want to warp it or melt your babbitt

Carl, if you have changed the crank gear while still in the motor we would love to hear how you did it

X 2
I've never removed the crank gear unless the crank was out of the engine.
Even with the crank out I've had a lot of trouble removing some because they were so tight. I've installed laminated gears without replacing the crank gear, and had no trouble nor noise. The engine I'm working on now is getting a new aluminum gear from Bert's and it fits correctly with good clearance. I had to sand the rust off the crank gear, but it shined up like new. Unless the crank gear is damaged or has rust pits I leave it in place, especially if the engine is still in the car.

This is a picture of my crank gear after I sanded the light surface rust off. They like to rust when the engine sets for years without being run.

[George Miller]

I have used lots of original crank gears. The fiber gear does not wear the crank gear that much. The old original crank gear is probably better than a new gear from who knows where.
The crank gear is very hard to get off. unless you get it from Dan I would leave the crank gear on. Dans gears are the best. Of course if it is damaged you will have to change it.

[DaveBPT]

Thanks to all for the advice. The crank gear is in good shape and I'm not up for borrowing trouble. Tom, what year engine is in the picture? The front looks different than mine which is supposed to be a '30.

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by DaveBPT

Thanks to all for the advice. The crank gear is in good shape and I'm not up for borrowing trouble. Tom, what year engine is in the picture? The front looks different than mine which is supposed to be a '30.

It still has the original block number, which I think was 1929. It's covered up now for the winter, but I can't think of anything in my picture that is different than a 1930. I know some webbing changed, which can't be seen in my picture, but that would be on the inside.

[CarlG]

Originally Posted by tbirdtbird

it doesn't seem like there is enough room behind the gear for the legs......

If you look at Tom's picture in post #8, there is plenty of room to get behind it with a puller. I was using one of my Dad's "ancient" pullers that has a very narrow lip on the legs. I've used it several times successfully as have others in our club.

[tbirdtbird]

"one of my Dad's "ancient" pullers that has a very narrow lip on the legs."

that must be the secret!

[Patrick L.]

When the engine is still in the car there is room for a puller, a big-ass puller. I also don't recommend driving the new gear on. I use a couple lengths of pipe and 'press' the hot gear on with the crank bolt. This has been mentioned here many times in the past.

However, the engine does have to raised quite high for enough clearance and loosening/removing some bell housing bolts is required. It doesn't hurt to remove the rear linkage.

[DaveBPT]

Tom,
Looking again at the picture I see what I thought was a difference. The pan is off that engine. Should have been more awake when I first looked at the picture.