Pulling Cylinder Sleeves and Replacing Them

[TomT/Williamsburg]

So I have this 39 engine with thick walled sleeves that need to be replaced. I have the original KRWilson tool kit to do this and a set of thick walled sleeves. So, here are my questions:

1 - once pulling the crank, rods and pistons, can this be done with the valve train in the block? A valve job has already been done on this engine and it has an Isky 77B installed with adjustable lifters ...
2 - tips on inserting thick walled sleeves?
3 - do I need to piston fit each piston in each sleeve once they are installed or are they already in spec?
4 - my intention is to use the old pistons and rods (after making sure they are OK), but can these thick sleeves be honed or bored for a larger piston?
5 - I know that once the sleeves are removed you can use an .083 piston and rings by Egge vs sleeves - pros and cons of doing this vs replacing the sleeves?

Many questions I know but before laying out my hard fixed income retiree bucks for whatever I might need, I would like your opinions ....

Thanks, gents ....

[JSeery]

IMHO You really can't do cylinder work without removing everything from the block so that it can be cleaned and worked on properly. It is most likely going to require some degree of machine work to get the new sleeves installed. Not sure what the concern is with removing the valve and cam, that is a fairly simple thing to do and well worth the effort. Once you pull the clips on the valves they remove as an assemble, then the lifters and then the cam pulls out.

[TomT/Williamsburg]

Thanks - I appreciate your response. I am just asking questions and checking what and where my options lie ....

[Bored&Stroked]

You said these are 'thick walled sleeves' - sounds like the tin-can ones to me? Normally what I would call 'thick walled sleeves' are roughly 1/8" thick . . . whereas you're talking about the fact that Egge sells a .083 piston if you pull them out . . . which makes the sleeve thickness about .040 or so (thin wall).

If these are the tin-can sleeves, then you should be able to knock them, out, freeze the new ones and knock them in (from what I know, I've never ran one of these engines). They were designed to be easily serviceable in the field. And, if tin-can, then they are supposedly "ready to run" - though I would think I'd at least run a hone through them.

Let us know what you have - maybe even some pictures.

D

[TomT/Williamsburg]

Will do, D .....

[JSeery]

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Originally Posted by Bored&Stroked

If these are the tin-can sleeves, then you should be able to knock them, out, freeze the new ones and knock them in (from what I know, I've never ran one of these engines). They were designed to be easily serviceable in the field.

Agree 100% IF they are replacement thin wall sleeves! If they are thick walled sleeves I am assuming some machine work would be required to install them.

[V12Bill]

You say you are replacing the sleeves and using the old pistons. Why are you replacing the sleeves? If they are worn (steel) then the pistons have to be worn(aluminum). If you have to buy new pistons, go to 3 3/16" and the big cubes of 239. It should not cost near as much to bore the block as it will be to buy new sleeves and have them installed. Do you have a reliable machine shop with experience to install the sleeves? They can crush if not installed properly.

[TomT/Williamsburg]

Originally Posted by V12Bill

You say you are replacing the sleeves and using the old pistons. Why are you replacing the sleeves? If they are worn (steel) then the pistons have to be worn(aluminum). If you have to buy new pistons, go to 3 3/16" and the big cubes of 239. It should not cost near as much to bore the block as it will be to buy new sleeves and have them installed. Do you have a reliable machine shop with experience to install the sleeves? They can crush if not installed properly.

Thanks for the response. The original sleeves need replacing - a good sized ridge is present. I all ready have the sleeves and I was not sure if I needed to replace the pistons. Now I know ....

As for boring, I have two places that can handle it and I might even go to a 4" crank (which I have with bearings) if I am buying pistons. Like I said, I am checking out what my options are ...

[Ronnie]

Sounds like you have the thin wall sleeves.After removing them your choice is .083" pistons honed to fit or any size after that requires boring and not hone to fit.Removing the existing sleeve all you do is run a quick weld bead down each cylinder and they will fall out when cold.

R

[TomT/Williamsburg]

I will measure the sleeves tomorrow and take a pic .....

Tom

[Bored&Stroked]

If the sleeves have a big ridge, the piston skirts are probably worn out. I'd checkout the .083 piston option from Egge - might be the best way to go and potentially the cheapest. Other options including boring the block to 3 3/16 and putting a standard set of Merc pistons in it (with the Merc crank) - this would give you 255 cubes and a big HP and torque improvement over the 221. It all comes down to time/money! Good luck!

[johnny]

If you have tin can sleeves weld a bead down their side ,they will fall out .

[TomT/Williamsburg]

Well, the sleeves look to be the tin-can style, less than 1/16 inch thick I believe.The pic is of the non-flared end of the sleeve ....

Once the old sleeves are out I can check the condition of the cylinder walls to either go with 083 pistons or bore up to the next size. If the walls will not allow that I will install the sleeves. I think I will go with the 4" crank I have depending whether the 083 pistons can come for a 4" crank I know the next bore size will but not sure about the stock bore size.

Thanks for all the help gents - I've got a plan .....

[JSeery]

Sounds like a plan!!

[TomT/Williamsburg]

Thanks, Jseery - the Fordbarn at its best!!

[Ol' Ron]

Personaly, I'd pull the sleeves, bore it to 3 3/16 and run8BA pistons.

[TomT/Williamsburg]

Originally Posted by Ol' Ron

Personaly, I'd pull the sleeves, bore it to 3 3/16 and run8BA pistons.

Thanks for the response, Ron.

This is my preference as well .... thanks!

[Bored&Stroked]

Like Ron said - I'd got to 3 3/16 and run 8CM Merc pistons in it . . . might cost a FEW extra bucks (price to bore/hone), but probably worth it for piston and ring selection.

Good luck and keep us posted on your decision and most importantly - the final results!
D

[Walt Dupont--Me.]

To put the Merc 4in. crank in that 39-40-41 -42 engine you'll have to grind about a one inch long slot on the bottom of each cyl so the rod nut will not hit the edge, also aluminum slinger on the rear of the block and the rear cap, will have to be changed to rope seal. Quite a bit of work but will be a snappy little engine. I'm building one right for a guy PA for a 39 4dr rag top, Walt

[TomT/Williamsburg]

Walt, B&S, Ron - if all goes well I will be using g 3 3/16 pistons with a 4" crank in this engine. Y'all have convinced me it's the best way to go ..... thank you!