1946 Ford 1-ton 17" rim problem

[ebruns1]

Hey Fellas,

Thought I would share my new project and ask for advice at the same time! I just bought this '46 tonner with a re-built engine that I thought would be simple to get up and running. It needs new tires and one rim looks "iffy" so I thought i'd replace them all. Boy was I surprised to find that the 5x6 7/8 bolt 17" rims were going to be impossible to replace with a modern rim! Here's some photos so you see what I'm talking about. Is that a "split rim widow-maker"? I was following another thread on here about a similar problem, but those rims look different than mine. Is there a modern substitute out there? I know I can have custom rims cut, but at $400+ ea. that's out of the question. And I'd rather have a more commonly available rim and tire size so I can get them serviced if necessary. What do you guys think I should do? Any and all suggestions welcome.
PS - want a driver, not a concours show truck if that matters.
PPS - if I swapped out the rear, is it possible to swap the front hubs to match?

[truckdog62563]

It is not a widow maker. The design is called the Firestone RH where the widow maker is the Firestone RH-5°. Similar name, entirely different rim. The RH is safe and serviceable if undamaged. Several guys here watch for them and could probably help if you need a replacement.

No modern replacement wheel exists, shy of having customs made. Axle swaps to period half ton or 48-52 F-2/F-3 axles have been done. Others that have physically done these swaps can better describe any fine points that will be encountered. Stu

[expavr]

" but at $400+ ea." ???? The cost to fabricate the 16" Light Truck rims (photo attached) I'm using on the Tonner was around $125.00/each. That included cutting the center section out of the 17" rim on a lathe, re-welding it to a 16" radial type rim and balancing the new assembly. A company in SoCal that did some fabrication for Stockton Wheel built them. If money is a factor I would recommend that you get your rims sandblasted, magnafluxed and if they pass inspection use them. I used the 17" rims with bias ply polyester tires from Coker for 4+ years before switching over to the radials. The ride was OK under 50 MPH, but at 50+ MPH they wanted to wander and got a little too "goosey" for my tastes, especially while trying to keep up with traffic on the freeways. That and when the locking rings starting to show some hairline cracks the decision to switch over to radials was easy. A tip: Take care with the locking rings when dismounting the tires. If not done right they can be tweaked and made unusable.

[ebruns1]

Wow, great information guys! Thank you VERY much! I also forgot to mention that half the special lug nuts are missing. Does anyone know a source for both the replacement LH and RH lug nuts? I'm not even sure what size they are, but look to be around 1 1/4". I'll need about 6 of each, the PO only had 2 or 3 on each rim.

The $415 quote I got was to drill a new blank rim to the hub and bolt pattern from a new 19" Budd rim. At the time I thought it was a Budd rim and that's what they quoted. No one seems to have a stock rim with the 5 on 6 7/8 Firestone bolt pattern, unless you guys know of one?

I would like to use my original rims as you suggest if they pass inspection, I know at least one is bad/heavy rusted at seam. Maybe they could weld it for me. I'm not opposed to going your route and cutting the centers out and having them put on a modern radial type rim but it looks like a 16" as you did is not going to clear my original hubs. I would need to stay with a 17" or larger"

[47 flatbed]

I was in the same situation with my one ton. I wanted to keep it fairly original, but I wanted a driver. So I bolted up a disc brake conversion up front. Out back I shortened a 2005 f150 limited slip axel 12" the 8.8 bolted directly to the original drive shaft. I changed rear axel for a more driver friendly ratio. And disc brakes.

[ebruns1]

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PS - I see MAC's has a right and left lug nut, 3/4 x 16 thread. Is that the correct part? Looks like it takes a 1 1/2" drive socket.

[Bob C]

The Ford parts book shows the thread as 3/4"-16, which is the same as the big trucks, but the nut appears to be unique to the 1 ton. RH thread 82Y-1120 LH 82Y-1121.

Bob

[expavr]

On the 40 Tonner the front drums are 12" dia and the rears 14" dia. The clearance of the 16" radial rim on the 14" dia drum was close - 3/8". The radial rim width is important for determing the backset to be used when attaching the center to the rim. I chose to use a 7-8" radial rim that wil fit most light truck tires and the backset wouldn't look strange when mounted on the truck. There are also 17" radial rims available, but the truck tire selection for that size rim was very limited when I had mine made up and the OEM 17" center section was too small and would have needed rework to be usable. Stockton Wheel sold a wheel that matched the bolt pattern on our trucks, but had no provision to mount the hubcaps. You might check with them to see if they still offer them.
Les Williams

[51504bat]

There has been discussion about changing the front spindles over on the FTE. I think it was for the 1 1/2 tons but I don't remember for certain. I think it involved the spindles from a mid 80's Ford F-250 and it was a fairly straight forward upgrade. This would give you 8 lugs up front which allows for a wide variety of wheels. Of course you'd have to change the rear end as well but you also get the ability to get a more freeway friendly ratio. Just a thought.

[GB SISSON]

Any ag tire or truck shop will change these tires no problem. I don't have any good spares right now, but they come up for sure. As for modern gear I swapped out the rear axle in my '59 f350 with a sterling 10 1/4 from a '92 f350. Super easy. Then I converted the front hubs to match the 8 lug pattern as the '53-'66 350s have an oddball big six lug pattern. I drive this rig to the mainland and on the interstates. From the mid '80s to the late '90s I daily drove a '38 tonner. This had the rare 4.11 rear axle which was only available in '38 models and would do 70+mph on the mainland. Still never any trouble with the stock tire and wheel combo. This is just my experience and I have always discarded wheels and rings with any severe pitting. Nothing else looks as good as those stock hubcaps on the proper wheel. As you can tell, I'm a big fan of these wheels with those those 34" tall skinny tires.

[ebruns1]

Great info all around fellas! Many thanks. Now I can't wait until the weather get a little warmer (above freezing) so I can go pull those wheels and get them checked out. If they all check out OK with the lock rings and the rust has not made them unsafe I'm leaning towards keeping them as original. I love the look of the tall tires on those rims as a few have said here. I do have one problem however...I only have 3 hubcaps for it. Has anyone seen a decent one for sale? How would I even search on Craigs for it since these are unique rims? I wouldn't even know what search terms to use. Other than visually searching every ad this could be like finding a needle in a haystack!!!

[GB SISSON]

As for the hubcaps, There's a guy here that showed about 25 of them laid out and displayed for sale. I think four were NOS and beautiful. I may be able to locate the post or maybe someone here remembers it.

[expavr]

Originally Posted by GB SISSON

As for the hubcaps, There's a guy here that showed about 25 of them laid out and displayed for sale. I think four were NOS and beautiful. I may be able to locate the post or maybe someone here remembers it.

Gary
I remembered the same thing, but couldn't find it. I think they might have been included in a list of parts at an auction.
Les

[GB SISSON]

I found an old pm from him. nospartsman put up the thread and photo. I have his phone #, not sure if it's ok to post it so send me a pm or maybe he will show up .

[ebruns1]

Here's something I didn't see anyone mention...

Would a 48-54 F2-F3 front axle swap over to my '46 tonner? I see the "48+ have the more common 8 x 6.5 lug bolt pattern. Anyone know if the track width is about the same? I know it won't be strictly stock anymore...but since the tonner rims and parts are unique on this it might be a viable solution. I know the rear would be simple, what are your thoughts on a later year front end? I think if I could swap out the axle, or even just those spindles it would make all my problems disappear. (Well, maybe not all...haha!)

[expavr]

Does the 48-54 F2-F3 8X6.5 lug pattern wheel allow for the use of a hubcap? If not Stockton Wheels can fabricate wheels with the 5X6 7/8 lug pattern with plain centers - no caps. The 16" wheel costs $235.00 unpainted. The 17" wheel costs $270.00 unpainted. It seems like you will be investing $ either way without the benefit of using the hubcaps.

[41Joe]

You can also look at wheel adapters. I have bought some off Craigslist before. Check out Adaptitusa.com. They might be able to make custom ones for you. I believe they are basically $50 each, and you can run any wheel you can find.

[Barry-ct]

The 48-52 F-2 or F-3 rims have the little bumps in the center to allow for hub caps. I don't know if the early caps like what you need will fit because of rear axle hub protruding too much. You can get the caps for the 48-52's in repo, but they're different looking from the earlier ones.

[GB SISSON]

If you look at FTE (ford truck enthusiasts) site Willowbilly 3 has a '40 tonner panel someone swapped in '50 style F3 axles. He's gonna use scout axles, but he could help with how his was.

[ebruns1]

I'll take some close up shots of the rims tomorrow and maybe you guys could let me know if you think they are too pitted to salvage. If you think they might be OK I"ll pull them off and take over to the blaster to see what he'll charge me to clean them up. I think that would help me figure out what my best course of action will be going forward. Thanks again for all the great info fellas! Stand by for photos...