What points for the point condensor retro?

[Tim Armstrong]

I have a set of points that need replacing, they are the points and condenser conversion that most Model A parts people sell. Does anybody know what points to use as a replacement in this set up ?????

[Mitch//pa]

to answer your question they are ford v-8
standard part # FD 8182 or 8183 for the points
FD 77 condensor
these numbers can be cross referenced to other brands

as will be mentioned the original style works well

[larrys40]

Return or discard them! Go get the stock Model A set of points. You can adjust them, align them... and they will function much better than the junk ( so called improved) set it sounds like you purchased.

Those are terrible to adjust... and are absolutely No improvement!

Go buy a genuine set and use a burn out proof condenser made by A&L, so by brattons and snyders.

Larry Shepard

[larrys40]

BY the way nice looking 400A I looked at two 400A bodies yesterday...
Larry

[Purdy Swoft]

I agree with Larry 100% The V8 points and condenser setup is nothing more than a make shift rig. I had nothing but trouble, trying to use the V8 setup. The V8 condensers are giving a lot of trouble, not only with the model A.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

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We've heard these SAME old statements about 39 times in the past!
I like the "modern" points, with a long pig tail lead. They go a loooong time for me, without cleaning/filing or resetting the point gap, everyone's gonna' run what they want to anyhow, GO FOR IT! Bill W.

[Patrick L.]

If you have the 'modern' upper plate and not having issues with it, then why not keep it. I don't have a problem with them. The main thing is too just make sure to buy the quality points/condenser.
If you wish to have a spare distributor, then a proper original is fine.

[jrelliott]

I have a listing of all the electrical parts(points old and modern, coils, brushes, bearings etc.) with modern numbers (NAPA, etc.) if interested send me an email to [email protected] and will send it to you. This will make finding the parts easier.

[Purdy Swoft]

Originally Posted by BILL WILLIAMSON

We've heard these SAME old statements about 39 times in the past!
I like the "modern" points, with a long pig tail lead. They go a loooong time for me, without cleaning/filing or resetting the point gap, everyone's gonna' run what they want to anyhow, GO FOR IT! Bill W.

I suppose they will last forever if the model A doesn't run and they will never need to be filed or reset.

[Rex_A_Lott]

Originally Posted by Tim Armstrong

I have a set of points that need replacing, they are the points and condenser conversion that most Model A parts people sell. Does anybody know what points to use as a replacement in this set up ?????

If you dont remember the part numbers, just ask for points and condenser for a 1972 ford pickup, with a 360. Ask for the heavy duty Echlin stuff if you are at NAPA. Yes, there is a difference.
Its easy for me to remember, its the same stuff I put in Pop's old truck. Good Luck!

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Originally Posted by Purdy Swoft

I suppose they will last forever if the model A doesn't run and they will never need to be filed or reset.

LOL LOL LOL---Minerva wuz a screamin' NINNY & I averaged 500 to 600 miles a month, year around & NEVER even looked at the points or plugs!! Later, I installed a single point Mallory dist, just for driving convenience, especially in busy city traffic. Bill W.
(That same old distributor, with them old USED, no account "modern" points will have a shot of oil & a rub of cam lube, & will be poked into Vermin's head, TOMORROW!!! I'm agonna' git Vermin fired up, SOON!)

[Kevin in NJ]

Condensor wise you are better off with th A&L unit.

The mustang guys have reported problems with the condensors. They are being bought low bid even by large companies.

The burnout proof are likely made with a better quality condensor for the extra few cents it costs. So you are unlikely to got a bad unit.

[Purdy Swoft]

The cheap China points are also junk, they tend to short out against the distributor housing. I'm not referring to the use of the wireless lower plate. The points will short against the distributor housing where the wires connect , even without the use of the wireless lower plate. I try to tell it like it REALLY is. I have nothing to gain, either way.

Some don't want to admit what a make shift rig the V8 points actually are, after they made the mistake of trying them in the first place.. If USA parts were used (if there are any) the price of the jury rigged upper plate would be so expensive, nobody would use it. The cheapest China parts fail quickly . Some will always chime in, Get the more expensive points. The more expensive V8 points cost two to three times more than the good original points that work and are easy to adjust. The make shift rig doesn't even use the cam screw that is used for adjustment in the V8 distributor that they were designed for.

People with NO mechanical experience get suckered in. The cheap parts fail and they buy the more expensive China parts. After they've bought the more expensive China points, the cheap condenser fails. By this time they have so much time and money in the make shift rig that they feel compelled to try and get by with it, After all, the pressure is still on to use the V8 set up.

Most that have used the V8 setup have had problems. More and more people that got suckered in see what a mistake the V8 setup is. Ford hasn't used points in forty years and when they did, it wasn't the cheap knock off parts.

[Purdy Swoft]

Originally Posted by BILL WILLIAMSON

LOL LOL LOL---Minerva wuz a screamin' NINNY & I averaged 500 to 600 miles a month, year around & NEVER even looked at the points or plugs!! Later, I installed a single point Mallory dist, just for driving convenience, especially in busy city traffic. Bill W.
(That same old distributor, with them old USED, no account "modern" points will have a shot of oil & a rub of cam lube, & will be poked into Vermin's head, TOMORROW!!! I'm agonna' git Vermin fired up, SOON!)

It must have been really a long time ago if you really got such good service from the V8 setup. I first tried V8 points in my AA in 1990. They would sometimes run for a month or two. If I got too busy in the shop and didn't drive the AA for a couple of weeks, It wouldn't crank. I could run out to Bama auto parts and buy and install another set of points and it would run for a while again. At that time the V8 condensers wasn't the problem, the points were. When the AA quit in the highway in a place that I couldn't pull over, it had to be towed, that was it for me, I went back to the original set up and haven't looked back.

After spending most of my life with model A's I feel qualified to tell it like it really is. I try to actually help people with their model A problems here.

[Ron/IA]

The main reason (in my opinion) Model A owners convert to the "modern" point/condenser set up is for convenience. It is somewhat easier to change them. However, with forethought, one can make the original points and condenser very easy to change.

By grinding the spring post on the original style of points, they can be changed without having to remove the upper plate. As for changing an original style condenser, just invest in a "screw-holding" type screw driver to help with putting the end screw in. (The type driver where the tip expands, not the type that clips onto the screw.)

I have always felt the original point setup to be far superior in adjusting gap and alignment.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Purdy,
I must have "lucked" out & got some really good points & condensor. I also have a long shaft distributor with all new original stuff & a burn out proof condensor for a spare. Later, I'll put it in, as I'm keeping Vermin quite "BONE" stock. SCARY! I'm becoming a Purist of sorts! Bill W.

[Purdy Swoft]

With original style points, the only time that I couldn't file and reset to make it home was the ONE time that the rubbing block fell off. It is not often that I replace points. I've been running the same original style points from Brattons since 1999 in our 31 tudor.

The long one piece distributor shaft isn't original but is another cheap repro part that JC use to sell. The distributor isn't in perfect alignment with the gear on the camshaft. The two piece intermediate shaft gives a universal joint effect for the distributor. More than once in the past fifty yearts, I've seen the long one piece shaft cause the distributor housing to. break. The first symptom is noticed at idle. The engine will idle like the spark is advanced, then it will start to chick ah lunk like the spark is retarded. After close inspection the distributor will be noticed to be jiggling. When this happens, tightening the set screw on the side of the head doesn't help because the distributor housing will be cracked where the main body meets the shaft. Just my experience. I don't recommend the one piece shaft. You can get by with the one piece shaft, it just won't run just right after the distributor housing cracks, no so with the V8 points. When the V8 points or condenser fails they will HAVE to be replaced. Hopefully when they fail you will have a place tro pull off the road, so as to replace them.

[Rex_A_Lott]

Originally Posted by Tim Armstrong

I have a set of points that need replacing, they are the points and condenser conversion that most Model A parts people sell. Does anybody know what points to use as a replacement in this set up ?????

I finally made it out to the shop, and these are the numbers I use in the one I have converted:
CS755- points
FA82 - condenser
These are NAPA Echlin numbers. Stay away from the cheap junk.

I guess I've just been lucky ( knock on wood), but this stuff works for me, in the distributor I fixed myself. I also have another car with the original set up that works good.
I recently took out a modern setup that was F'ed up and went back with a complete "new" old style distributor, thinking it should last me a long time. Once I get the one I took out straight , I should have a good spare.
Be sure to check that you are getting consistent gaps on every lobe of your point cam. The one that I had was different every time it fired and the new points only lasted about 100 miles after I got the "new to me" car home and started driving it.
I hope you can get by with a simple point/condenser replacement.
Keep in mind, no matter which setup you use, you will probably need to go back and reset the gap after you drive it a bit and the rubbing block wears in. You'll know, cause the time will be retarded and it will run like its in a bind. If you run it like this long, it will burn the new points up, cause the gap is too small.
Good Luck!

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Purdy,
I understand your reservations about the long shaft one. Maybe I just happened to get a straight one. After discovering it was a long shaft, I put it back in, fired it up,& even loosened the locking screw & that sucker DIDN'T even wobble one iota. The ONLY thing wrong with it was the point arm pivot post was loose where it was riveted over, under the upper plate. YES! you already know, "TAP-TAP-TAP" & IT WUZ PERFECT! LOL Tapper Bill

[Purdy Swoft]

Bill,
It ain't the long shaft thats out of line. The problem is where the distributor mounts in the head isn't in perfect alignment with the gear in the center of the camshaft. The two piece shaft gives a slight universal joint effect. I bought stuff from Warshawsky and JC Whitney back in the day and liked the one piece long shafts. After a while I noticed that either the bushings in the distributor housing wore out quicker or the housings cracked when I used the long one piece shaft. I later read in one of the model A books about the slight mis alignment of the distributer and how the two piece original style shaft gave a universal joint effect. I now use only the originjal style two piece shaft. I don't try to make the fit of the shaft connection too tight. There will be and probably needs to be a little backlash.. As you know, when the timing is set leave all of the backlash in the counter clockwise direction when the cam screw is tightened with the trailing edge of the rotor tip aligned with the number one contact in the cap. If you use original style points, I bet Vermin will crank the first try. If not , well Purdy tried to tell you.