knowing when my car was made

[reggiedog]

HI;
I'm looking for what month my car was made and I also know that late models didn't come out until July so I know my car was made after that as I have the tear drop firewall but the frame and engine say March so I want to know as to when the car was actually made.

I know the year of the car as it is a Late 31 Deluxe Tudor Sedan and the frame numbers come out to March but I have been told the it wasn't built then or put together and I have been told that it could of been three four months before the car was built, and I was told that if you have the long 6 inch body block in the back you car was built a certain month also but I can't find anything on that or as to if my car was built in August or September of 31 as some people have told me that my car was built in August of 31 but I'm one of these people that want to know for sure when my car was made month wise and I would like to know as what day but I know that is not possible.

Thanks let me know Reggiedog

[Gary WA]

Originally Posted by reggiedog

HI;
I'm looking for what month my car was made and I also know that late models didn't come out until July so I know my car was made after that as I have the tear drop firewall but the frame and engine say March so I want to know as to when the car was actually made.

I know the year of the car as it is a Late 31 Deluxe Tudor Sedan and the frame numbers come out to March but I have been told the it wasn't built then or put together and I have been told that it could of been three four months before the car was built, and I was told that if you have the long 6 inch body block in the back you car was built a certain month also but I can't find anything on that or as to if my car was built in August or September of 31 as some people have told me that my car was built in August of 31 but I'm one of these people that want to know for sure when my car was made month wise and I would like to know as what day but I know that is not possible.

Thanks let me know Reggiedog

do you have the frame number and does it match the motor number?

[Herb Concord Ca]

Look on the body side rail, not the frame, on the drivers side for a number beginning with one or two letters followed by a series of numbers. The letters identify where the car was built. This number may also be located on the crossmember just past where the wooden floor boards sit.
If you find the letters, the MAFCA site will cross the letters to an assembly plant.

[reggiedog]

Gary
Yes I have both of them and they match

[reggiedog]

Herb,
That's on the first brace one letter and about 5 numbers but I could never figure it out as to what it meant, as some people told me it was the production figures but I have no clue as to what those numbers are for as the first letter is A and about 4 or 5 numbers after it.

[reggiedog]

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Herb;
I think my car was made in the Milwaukee Plant as it has a (R) before the Richmond Plant was ever there as the Richmond Plant didn't open until Late August of 31 and yes I know my car could of been made there, but one problem I know the person that bought the car brand new and he said he bought it in Milwaukee, WI as I think before the Richmond Plant was there the Milwaukee Plant was using the code Letter (R) for there Plant as I know other people that have the letter (R) in there cars as those cars where built in 28/9 so Milwaukee had to have the letter (R) for there Plant for a while that is until the Richmond Plant opened.

As at a point in time the Milwaukee Plant was building One Ton Trucks in that Plant as well and I have the proof of that one as I'm writing a book on the Milwaukee Plant now and have been for years now so I know a lot about the Milwaukee Plant more then the normal guy would know as I have spent over 12 years researching just that Plant in Milwaukee.

[reggiedog]

As I have the 6" body Block in the back so when was the first put out I know it was in 31 but what month was it put out as right now I think my engine was made in May but not for sure on that as well but I was told you count past that by four months so that would put my car into September sometime if that is correct as I have a engine number as *A4692727* so when was that made I think it was made in May but I'm not for sure on that one what do you guys think it is as I need help badly with this to figure this out.

[Sunny the Model A]

http://modelahouse.com/cgi-bin/enumbers/numdate according to this, your engine was built on Wednesday, May 27, 1931. my engine number is a4730543, and it was built on Monday June 22, 1931.

[Sunny the Model A]

and for the record, the indented firewall and sidebowl carb was phased into production in mid may 1931, right around may 22 give or take. so your car would be correct

[reggiedog]

Sunny,
You see you have that much and I don't have that at all and that's what I'm trying to find out but how can I find that out, as I tried to call the Benson Research Center but they don't answer there phones as I have tried serval times and still nothing.

[reggiedog]

Sunny I got it my engine was made on Wednesday May.27,1931 but the only thing I don't know is what line was it made on but that don't matter so that would make my engine a September car being built, but when in September is the thing now I wish there was a way to find that out as the standards book say go past the engine being built 4 months and that would make it September but when is the thing now is there a way to find that out.

[rotorwrench]

With so much water under the bridge, it is near impossible to get an exact day no matter what branch assembly plant may have been involved. Most major assemblies were sent in batches from the Rouge in box cars on the railroads. There can be from 2 weeks to two months from the time an engine is completed and tested until it is dropped into a frame depending on where it was sent. Bodies were assembled and then numbered after completion as a general rule. Many stampings on bodies would have been done after the body was completed but before it would have been dropped onto the frame. In the case of subcontracted bodies like the Fordors and Cabriolets for example, they would have been stamped after completion by the applicable body plant before being shipped out to the branch assembly plants. Ford assembled bodies would have been stamped after completion but would likely have made it onto a frame sooner than a subcontracted body in a lot of cases.

The characteristics of a particular car will be all a person has to go by. The engine number was stamped onto the frame as soon as it was in the frame but that only covers the engine and frame if they match. Bodies are easily traded from one frame to another so a person has to know more of the history of the car to know whether it is all original or whether it was assembled from parts by a previous owner. The waters are easily muddied. If several characteristics indicate an early car and then other later characteristics show up then you can see what I mean. Pluck's frame research on his site is complicated on how many changes there were over the production era of the model A. Body characteristics can be found in some service bulletins and in other books like "The Ford Model A as Henry Built It" which was authored by guys that worked at Ford back in the day. The Judging Standards have a lot of information.

[mcgarrett]

From what I've read, all Model A engines were built at the Rouge plant in Dearborn, Mi. and then shipped to various plants around the country by rail awaiting installation into a car or truck. After a train ride, which could take several days, some engines could sit in plant warehouses or rail cars for several weeks before finally being installed. The serial number stamped onto the frame at the time the vehicle was being assembled was also stamped onto the engine block which was selected from existing engines on-hand at the time it was being installed in a vehicle, so it is VERY difficult to know exactly when the engine was built.
Maybe others here on the Barn have better info.

[mcgarrett]

Sorry for the redundancy, rotorwrench was quicker on the keyboard!

[Keith True]

I bought an indented firewall 31 coupe,it is May of 31.I also got the bill of sale when sold new in late June of 31.I had every registration and insurance slip from 31 to 82.All the paperwork was in my room when my house burned.That car was in the shed though,but another one was in the cellar.

[ModelA29]

and...... let's not forget that in the 90+ years these cars have survived they have become mix masters. Options have been added and questionable parts replaced with better condition used or repro parts. Without factory details of how or when a car left the factory it's all guess work and boils down to how the last restorer wanted it to look. There is no way certain to prove that a certain body left the factory in it's current chassis. You can disprove it by change dates that are known but you can only assume your car is how it left the factory.

[Keith True]

There is a late 31 steel top pickup near me with a narrow bed.Family bought it new,and used it until the late 50's and parked it in the barn.The family would never get rid of it,but there was no old car interest in the family until the last 20 years or so.The boys that have it,(60 years old)have been studying about A's for years now.They have been trying to reconcile that narrow bed with the steel top,a production that didn't exist.I pointed out something that their grandfather had pointed out to me about 50 years ago.There is a faint curved line,a slight dent on the back of the cab.That was where the original wide bed contacted the cab when the truck was rear ended in 32 or 33.They couldn't lay their hands on a wide bed back then,so they used a narrow bed.The grandkids didn't know,and I only knew because I was told by the guy that smacked his head on the back of the cab when they got rear ended.

[Gene F]

Originally Posted by Herb Concord Ca

Look on the body side rail, not the frame, on the drivers side for a number beginning with one or two letters followed by a series of numbers. The letters identify where the car was built. This number may also be located on the crossmember just past where the wooden floor boards sit.
If you find the letters, the MAFCA site will cross the letters to an assembly plant.

I have a 28 Tudor, and have never been able to find those markings on my car.

[rotorwrench]

Engines were stamped after they passed the operational test with the big electric motors that turned them. If they passed the amp load check of the big electric motor and there were no leaks then the engine was stamped with a serial number and sent on it's way to one of many assembly plants around the US and the world. If the engine didn't pass then it was routed back to a reclamation shop that would either attempt to repair the engine or it would be disassembled and salvage the good parts or recycle them in the company foundry.

Ford of Canada made their own engines and they had a unique serial numbering system to tell them apart from US production. Stuff made in Cork, Ireland used the serial number lots provided by the Rouge. The Dagenham UK plant didn't crank up till October 1931 and the AA trucks were the first vehicles out the door.

PS: Not all assembly plants stamped their bodies. Many didn't start stamping till late in the game. Wood bodied cars were built mostly by subcontractors. The subcontractors did number their units as a way to track for any complaints by Ford or by the end user. It was easy to stamp information into the wood cross member. They also used their own body plates to tell folks who built the body.