The Ford Barn

mrcorvair · 06-16-2014, 11:11 AM

I just purchased a 46 convertible. The top is down. I am unfamiliar with hydraulic tops. I want to be able to manually raise the top so I can start trying to find out why it isn't working. How can I do that?
How do I go about figuring out what is wrong? Thanks in advance for your help.

Vic Piano · 06-16-2014, 12:02 PM

If you want to manually work the top, you have to release the struts. Remove the back seat and interior quarter panels to gain access to the struts (you might be able to do this with the quarter panels in place but removing them makes things easier). You'll see where the shaft connects to the top irons. Release them and you'll be able to put the top up and down manually. As for the hydraulics, you should first remove the reservoir on the bottom of the top pump. Originally, the factory filled these with brake fluid. I would recommend purging any fluid in the system and replacing it with ATF. There are fluid level markings on the side of the canister, when you are ready to "test" the unit, fill the canister to the first level.

I would recommend removing the top motor, etc. disassembling it and checking everything. the motor is a standard starter motor. The valve body that controls the up and down motion of the top, should be cleaned and inspected for pitting. All the internal parts for the pump (valve body) are available however, if the body is pitted inside, the pump may not hold prime. I had this problem with our '47 Convertible and, because I'm not hell bent on restoring it "as Henry Built it", I installed a late model Mustang top motor under the back seat. (the car is 12 volts) and I put a toggle switch under the dash.

bobH · 06-16-2014, 01:41 PM

Vic, I'm also not 'hell-bent', and I'm with both you and mrcorvair. I've got a 47, and the factory power top is a pita in my opinion. I'd like to eliminate the sluggish & vague operation, and leaks. Would you please share any more details on what you did, what you used for that 'late model Mustang top motor' ? Any particular vintage Mustang I might be looking for ?
Thanks

Vic Piano · 06-16-2014, 01:59 PM

bobH, PM sent.

mrcorvair · 06-16-2014, 02:20 PM

Thanks for your informative answer Vic. I'm a beginner when it comes to this.
I assume the device mounted in the engine compartment on the drivers side of the cowl is the motor/pump combination. There would be 2 cylinders in the back.
Assuming this is correct is the repair of this covered in any document?
With some kind of guide I believe I could do this. Thanks again Vic.

Vic Piano · 06-16-2014, 02:52 PM

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In our series of "How To" videos that we did several years ago,(Vic's V8 Video's) we featured one called "From Tops to Tires". In that video we rebuilt the OEM pump from my '47 Convertible. They are relatively easy to rebuild however, the problem is with the valve body, Originally the factory filled the hydraulic pumps for the tops and power windows/seat with brake fluid... Because brake fluid retains moisture, over time the aluminum cast valve body can (and will) pit. This can (and did) cause problems with the rebuild of the pump assembly in our '47. Unless you are going for a "high point" restoration... and/or, if your OEM pump proves to be no good. The Mustang pump is the way to go. Even if the OEM pump assembly will not function, you can always leave it in the car to give the impression of it being stock, while having the convenience of a modern pump (keep in mind that the new pumps are 12 volts) I installed a toggle switch under the dash next to the OEM Top push/pull handle in our '47. I'm sure there is something relating to servicing and/or rebuilding the "top" pumps, in a Ford/Lincoln/Mercury service manual, if you do some digging you should find the info.

mrcorvair · 06-16-2014, 06:33 PM

Thanks again Vic. Is that video available? I'd sure like to see it.

Vic Piano · 06-16-2014, 08:18 PM

Yes, all the videos are available however, we don't actively market them anymore. If you pm me, I'll give you the list of videos, etc.

motorman · 06-17-2014, 09:38 AM

I built 3 converts, leave the motor and cylinders off, keep the springs. Just grab the top and pull it up, faster and easier. You can get the springs from Dorman products. Sorry cannot remember the #.

Vic Piano · 06-17-2014, 11:04 AM

Not for nothing but, anyone can eliminate the electric-hydraulic mechanism and manually operate the top however, some tops, like the ones on Lincolns (for example) are not that easy for one person to put up.

While the '42 to '48 Ford/Merc tops are relatively easy to manually operate, in my opinion, I'd much rather just simply push or pull a lever (toggle switch) and watch the magic happen...

jimTN · 06-17-2014, 04:00 PM

You MUST unbutton the top sides on both sides of the car when raising the top. The snabs are behind the back side windows. If not, the top will rip. Once upon a time there were some breakaway snaps available but noone seems to kinow a source now.

06-16-2014, 11:11 AM	#1
mrcorvair Senior Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: McDowell, Va Posts: 141	46 convertible top I just purchased a 46 convertible. The top is down. I am unfamiliar with hydraulic tops. I want to be able to manually raise the top so I can start trying to find out why it isn't working. How can I do that? How do I go about figuring out what is wrong? Thanks in advance for your help.

06-16-2014, 12:02 PM	#2
Vic Piano Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Odessa, FL Posts: 7,611	Re: 46 convertible top If you want to manually work the top, you have to release the struts. Remove the back seat and interior quarter panels to gain access to the struts (you might be able to do this with the quarter panels in place but removing them makes things easier). You'll see where the shaft connects to the top irons. Release them and you'll be able to put the top up and down manually. As for the hydraulics, you should first remove the reservoir on the bottom of the top pump. Originally, the factory filled these with brake fluid. I would recommend purging any fluid in the system and replacing it with ATF. There are fluid level markings on the side of the canister, when you are ready to "test" the unit, fill the canister to the first level. I would recommend removing the top motor, etc. disassembling it and checking everything. the motor is a standard starter motor. The valve body that controls the up and down motion of the top, should be cleaned and inspected for pitting. All the internal parts for the pump (valve body) are available however, if the body is pitted inside, the pump may not hold prime. I had this problem with our '47 Convertible and, because I'm not hell bent on restoring it "as Henry Built it", I installed a late model Mustang top motor under the back seat. (the car is 12 volts) and I put a toggle switch under the dash. __________________ Imagination is more important than knowledge.

06-16-2014, 01:41 PM	#3
bobH Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: so cal, placerville, vegas Posts: 1,396	Re: 46 convertible top Vic, I'm also not 'hell-bent', and I'm with both you and mrcorvair. I've got a 47, and the factory power top is a pita in my opinion. I'd like to eliminate the sluggish & vague operation, and leaks. Would you please share any more details on what you did, what you used for that 'late model Mustang top motor' ? Any particular vintage Mustang I might be looking for ? Thanks

06-16-2014, 01:59 PM	#4
Vic Piano Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Odessa, FL Posts: 7,611	Re: 46 convertible top bobH, PM sent. __________________ Imagination is more important than knowledge.

06-16-2014, 02:20 PM	#5
mrcorvair Senior Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: McDowell, Va Posts: 141	Re: 46 convertible top Thanks for your informative answer Vic. I'm a beginner when it comes to this. I assume the device mounted in the engine compartment on the drivers side of the cowl is the motor/pump combination. There would be 2 cylinders in the back. Assuming this is correct is the repair of this covered in any document? With some kind of guide I believe I could do this. Thanks again Vic.

06-16-2014, 02:52 PM	#6
Vic Piano Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Odessa, FL Posts: 7,611	Re: 46 convertible top Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) In our series of "How To" videos that we did several years ago,(Vic's V8 Video's) we featured one called "From Tops to Tires". In that video we rebuilt the OEM pump from my '47 Convertible. They are relatively easy to rebuild however, the problem is with the valve body, Originally the factory filled the hydraulic pumps for the tops and power windows/seat with brake fluid... Because brake fluid retains moisture, over time the aluminum cast valve body can (and will) pit. This can (and did) cause problems with the rebuild of the pump assembly in our '47. Unless you are going for a "high point" restoration... and/or, if your OEM pump proves to be no good. The Mustang pump is the way to go. Even if the OEM pump assembly will not function, you can always leave it in the car to give the impression of it being stock, while having the convenience of a modern pump (keep in mind that the new pumps are 12 volts) I installed a toggle switch under the dash next to the OEM Top push/pull handle in our '47. I'm sure there is something relating to servicing and/or rebuilding the "top" pumps, in a Ford/Lincoln/Mercury service manual, if you do some digging you should find the info. __________________ Imagination is more important than knowledge.

06-16-2014, 06:33 PM	#7
mrcorvair Senior Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: McDowell, Va Posts: 141	Re: 46 convertible top Thanks again Vic. Is that video available? I'd sure like to see it.

06-16-2014, 08:18 PM	#8
Vic Piano Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Odessa, FL Posts: 7,611	Re: 46 convertible top Yes, all the videos are available however, we don't actively market them anymore. If you pm me, I'll give you the list of videos, etc. __________________ Imagination is more important than knowledge.

06-17-2014, 09:38 AM	#9
motorman Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Posts: 17	Re: 46 convertible top I built 3 converts, leave the motor and cylinders off, keep the springs. Just grab the top and pull it up, faster and easier. You can get the springs from Dorman products. Sorry cannot remember the #.

06-17-2014, 11:04 AM	#10
Vic Piano Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Odessa, FL Posts: 7,611	Re: 46 convertible top Not for nothing but, anyone can eliminate the electric-hydraulic mechanism and manually operate the top however, some tops, like the ones on Lincolns (for example) are not that easy for one person to put up. While the '42 to '48 Ford/Merc tops are relatively easy to manually operate, in my opinion, I'd much rather just simply push or pull a lever (toggle switch) and watch the magic happen... __________________ Imagination is more important than knowledge.

06-17-2014, 04:00 PM	#11
jimTN Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Powell, TN Posts: 2,519	Re: 46 convertible top You MUST unbutton the top sides on both sides of the car when raising the top. The snabs are behind the back side windows. If not, the top will rip. Once upon a time there were some breakaway snaps available but noone seems to kinow a source now.