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Old 06-08-2017, 10:01 AM   #1
fixitphil
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Default Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

First time Post: My A has used the engine number as the VIN. If I change engines what happens to the VIN?
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Old 06-08-2017, 10:04 AM   #2
95GOOSE
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

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Originally Posted by fixitphil View Post
First time Post: My A has used the engine number as the VIN. If I change engines what happens to the VIN?
I'd like to know this as well.
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Old 06-08-2017, 10:13 AM   #3
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

That answer can vary greatly by state. Including your location (even a general location) would help get you better answers.
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Old 06-08-2017, 10:18 AM   #4
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

Solutions to this have varied. Some grind down the pad and re-stamp the old numbers. Some attempt to raise the body and get officialdom to accept the frame number as the VID ("VID Confirmation" its called here in Cow Hampshire and they send an officer to your house.)

Some make an aluminum plate showing the removed engine number (similar to VID attachments found below the windshield on modern cars) and attach it with pop rivets just below the "Ford Motor Company" plate on the firewall.

The chassis number is probably the hardest to do and the least likely to stick officially. Its not like the number can be confirmed at any sale or transaction - or even a car accident/insurance claim.

I would give the pop rivet plate a try. You don't have to say you put the plate there yourself. Or that it even matches the chassis number (MANY Model As are on their second or third engines and officialdom didn't pay that much attention until car title became an issue. )

Here in Cow Hampshire I still use the chassis number and have a blank engine - but I have not sold the car or had an accident with it.

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Old 06-08-2017, 11:54 AM   #5
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

Some have stamped the engine number on the visible surface of the drivers side engine mount, where it and the engine number can be easily viewed by lifting the hood on that side. This is close enough to the frame location to satisfy the inspection and avoids having to lift the body.
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Old 06-08-2017, 12:07 PM   #6
henry's 31
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

In Georgia you have to fill a form with the Vin Number and you take it to the local DMV to make the change effective. But like stated above, every state is different.
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Old 06-08-2017, 12:35 PM   #7
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

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In Georgia you have to fill a form with the Vin Number and you take it to the local DMV to make the change effective. But like stated above, every state is different.
YES, Henry, every state has different sized "HOOPS" to jump through, if you're "FAT", you might not make it
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Old 06-08-2017, 12:56 PM   #8
Tom Wesenberg
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

I would use a temporary engine while I rebuild the original engine to reinstall.
If the original block is total junk, then the new block would get the same number as the junk block.
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Old 06-08-2017, 01:05 PM   #9
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

In Cow Hampshire one does not need a title to sell or register a car WITHIN STATE more than 10 years old.

My 1930 AA Chassis (with 26K original miles) was sold to a buyer in Texas - and part of the deal was I would provide a NH Title for it - which would speed immeasurably his getting a replacement title in Texas.

Getting a replacement title in New Hampshire is a simple matter of filling out a form - waiting for up to six weeks for a title search to be done based on your submitted VID, and then having an officer of the court (local Police Officer) "verify" the VID.

She called (woman officer) looking for an appointment to do the verification. "Come on over now if you want" I said. A cruiser backed into my driveway a few minutes later.

She was very thorough. She did ask me where the number was located. "Every antique car is different" she confessed. At my suggestion she looked at both the engine number AND the frame number (which were identical) using a drop light held at different angles. The numbers I would consider "better than average" based on how they appeared. She did ask me what I considered to be the number based on what I saw. I think she was verifying both her eyes AND mine lest there be any disagreement which might hold up paperwork. I suggested a "rubbing" of the engine number just to be sure - which I did for her. We both read the engine rubbing to the same number conclusion.

And that engine number became the number. A few weeks later I had the NH replacement title which I forwarded to the buyer in Texas (and got my $150 withheld from the price as that is what he thought it would cost him to process a Texas replacement title.)

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Old 06-08-2017, 01:46 PM   #10
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

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Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg View Post
I would use a temporary engine while I rebuild the original engine to reinstall.
If the original block is total junk, then the new block would get the same number as the junk block.
I have saved my original junk block just in case anybody ever questions the provenance of the number. It works well as a doorstop for the barn and it is unlikely to be stolen.
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Old 06-08-2017, 02:09 PM   #11
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

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Originally Posted by ursus View Post
I have saved my original junk block just in case anybody ever questions the provenance of the number. It works well as a doorstop for the barn and it is unlikely to be stolen.
Ursus,

Best answer I've heard yet!

Another solution would be to buy one of Tod's new blocks and stamp the old number on the new block.

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Old 06-08-2017, 02:12 PM   #12
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

well Joe,
we arent all as lucky as you folks in NH.

you have one of the easiest titling states in the nation.

cant do what you suggest in about 45 of the other states.
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Old 06-08-2017, 02:17 PM   #13
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

Based on what California used to do I would expect that the DMV would want to place a VIN tag of their own on the door jam (and a couple of places on the frame). Call your DMV and ask them. Long ago you just filled out a form at DMV changing to the new number. There is probably an easy way to accomplish what you want and taking short cuts will just get you, or the next owner, in trouble.

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Old 06-08-2017, 04:10 PM   #14
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

As I have posted before, any time you have a body off and can verify the frame number and it matches the engine number (or not) call for a VIN inspector to get a letter of verification - which was free in SC. Get a new VIN verification if you change the engine.

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Old 06-08-2017, 04:40 PM   #15
Barry B./ Ma.
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

The engine number became the VIN when the engine was placed in the frame and that should always be the VIN for that car even if the engine has been replaced at least that's how I see it. I go by the frame number and that should be on the engine pad and if it isn't it should be restamped on the engine.
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Old 06-08-2017, 05:44 PM   #16
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

If you car is stolen and the engine removed how do you prove ownership?
I am going through this with the Tudor I just bought. I'll have to lift the body to expose the frame number.
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Old 06-08-2017, 06:43 PM   #17
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

IF you ever have a car STOLEN, you'll be glad most states are PICKY about this stuff!!!
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Old 06-08-2017, 09:59 PM   #18
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

Years ago when I brought a car in from out out state, the Washington State Patrolman noted the VIN was the engine number. Then he told me to see if I could find a number on the frame, bring the car back in and they would change the VIN to that number. After that he said if I couldn't find a number anywhere, that they would assign a VIN number to the frame.
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Old 06-08-2017, 10:18 PM   #19
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

Some purchase a plate with their VIN on it for the firewall, while others find an engine re-manufacturer able to supply their VIN with the rebuilt engine.
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Old 06-08-2017, 10:25 PM   #20
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Default Re: Engine Serial Numbers as VIN

In Pennsylvania the VIN is on the title. I never have been asked to verify a VIN. I did notice that my VIN has been ground off the motor. Should I try to re stamp the # on the motor?
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