1932 5W VIN please help

[rotorwrench]

OK, "VIN Certification Waived" only means that there was not a necessity to get certification for the VIN as presented to the state authorized person who verified it. In Texas you can use a pencil rubbing of a frame number to get a confirmation. Certification would only be necessary if there was no number found on the frame. There must be a number on it somewhere or the guy in Texas had a relative at the DMV. Also, if an entity of the state of Texas (for example) such as a local county impound yard wants to auction off an unclaimed used vehicle, they can use just about anything they want as a number for a title. I've seen this happen before. It's basically a state issued title for the purpose of the state liquidating property that they don't want to get the proceeds that they can collect to pay any expenses or fines.

I'm not implying that this is what you have here but this is a possibility. I've seen stuff like this happen before. I'm just not sure what the procedure is on how they deal with it.

[Jim in Wisconsin]

I'm from Wisconsin, and the title for my 33 has just the 6 digit number with no prefex or stars in a box called "identification no." In another box called "type-gross weight" it says 2DR.
There would be no way to tell if it was a sedan, coupe, roadster or if it had a v8 or 4 cylinder.

[noel_808]

Thanks fellas, learning a lot in this forum, much appreciated

[noel_808]

Rotorwrench, yeah, there is a VIN plaque on the firewall, some here said that would suffice with the cop but the motor control is saying needs to be on the frame in two spots.

[deuce lover]

Noel,Right under the bracket for your steering support on the frame in front of the firewall is the spot where most 32 frames are stamped.George in Kapolei has a 32 sedan.He is also a member here on FordBarn.Go see him and look at that spot on his car.

[Mart]

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I just noticed in the old pic of the front end, the shocks are upside down.

Nice to be able to see the old pics, though, it shows the car has history.

I don't think there is anything in the old pics that would be usable to identify the original frame number or location or whether a 4 or an 8.

Can you tell if the frame is original? Was it swapped out for a repro frame at some point?

Good point made above re the steering bracket. It might be worth going back (carefully) to bare metal in that area to try and locate the original numbers (unless it is a repro frame).

If you look where the cowl hoop body mount pulls down to the top corner of the frame rail, the original rails are flattened slightly there to give the body mount clamping bolt a flat surface to pull against. This detail is often omitted on a repro frame.

Mart.

[Kerk]

On my 32 the number was under the frame webbing at the fire wall leg support. Cut the webbing so it could be seen but not completely. kerk

[noel_808]

deuce lover, thanks, I will try to find him. I live in a town next to Kapolei and go to the saturday night meet ups.

Thanks again Mart, Yeah, the pics definitely helped. In another pic, you can see he repainted the old rails and the flattened spot is there.

I posted a pic of the paint removal I did, that bracket is in a PITA spot and I can't take it off without removing the exhaust header, the horizontal bolt would butt against the header. I figured that spot could be the one but I figured to leave it thinking the numbers most likely wouldn't fit in just that area so I just stopped before I get into more unnecessary disassembly.

Kerk, yeah, the webbing (welding/welting) in the corner was pushed back as far as I could see and I couldn't determine if it was a number or the body just mashing either the fabric or a washerover years. It looked unrecognizable so I didn't try to lift it anymore.

Thanks for the support, I will post the aftermath later

[Mart]

In the picture above, you can see the frame is gennie. the flat spot I was describing is easily visible and the frame side rail is patinated enough to show it is not a repro.

i might be seeing what I want to see, but there is a circular indentation in that rail just inboard and slightly behind the body hoop bolt location (flattened area) that looks like the bottom half of an "8".

Probably just my imagination, but keep digging.

Mart.

[noel_808]

Ended up removing the bracket and lo and behold there it is! Part of an 8 then double arrow with a clearly visible 1 then a barely visible 4. Not what i have from wisconsin (16xxxx) so No I’m contemplating to go all in and lift up the body from the frame. Thing is, it already seems like the Wisconsin number would be OK to use instead, thinking it over...
Also I thought that the 1, 6 and 9’s were different, this 1 looks like the old type.

Does anyone know around what series of numbers or when they started using the different design? I read somewhere that the early numbers may have the old stamp but that double arrow is legit. V8 5w!

[noel_808]

Double arrow!

[deuce lover]

Looks like the "1" is the begining of the V8 Vin #.In the swap early V8 section is an ad for the set of number stamps for sale.You could restamp the frame.

[Mart]

I wouldn't restamp it.

Interesting to see an early style "1" on it. I can't remember when the changeover period was, but I did read about it on another thread on this forum. I have also read from (DavidG I think) that when it comes to early Fords, nothing is cast in stone.

Good point made above, that "1" shows it was originally built as a V8 car.

Never tried this, but I did read on this forum where the application of some sort of acid can help "lift" older stamped numbers. It shows where the metal has been deformed below the surface even though the old top surface has been ground away.

Why would you get a repro title? It's a steel body with an original chassis and pictorial evidence to back up it's history.

At least you have found something.

I know this car is not the sort of thing we normally like to deal with on this particular forum, which is more stock or mildly hopped up original cars, but I, for one, have found it interesting dealing with this car. You can see the history right there in the frame rails.

Now if only we can get you to drop a nicely warmed over flatty between the rails.....

Mart.

[Hoop]

This all appears to be the result of a very clumsy attempt to re-title an old car with a missing title.

It starts with buying an old title. Then grinding off the original serial numbers, maybe all of them if the body is off.

The guys who recommend buying a repro data plate and stamping it ... well, it may "fool some of the people some of the time, but it won't fool all the people all of the time."

Ford Barn and the HAMB both prohibit the advertising/sale of old titles, not just because it is illegal, but because in cases like this, someone gets screwed.

BanjoCutOff.jpg

This is my favorite ... bought this chassis from a guy who was building a "streetrod." The steering wheel was in the way as he removed the body. Funny, I removed the steering wheel nut and the center popped off by hand.

(There's a right way ... and a wrong way.)

[JSeery]

Originally Posted by Mart

Never tried this, but I did read on this forum where the application of some sort of acid can help "lift" older stamped numbers. It shows where the metal has been deformed below the surface even though the old top surface has been ground away. Mart.

There are several methods to "raise" the original stamped numbers. It is almost impossible to grind them to the point that they can not be recovered. One method uses a battery and steel wool others acid. A search on the Barn and on the HAMB should return threads on various methods and lots of discussion on the topic. I also would not recommend attempting to alter the numbers in any way (including duplicating them). There are also threads on this topic and stories of what can happen if this is detected!

[Charlie Stephens]

Originally Posted by noel_808

Ended up removing the bracket and lo and behold there it is! Part of an 8 then double arrow with a clearly visible 1 then a barely visible 4. Not what i have from wisconsin (16xxxx) so No I’m contemplating to go all in and lift up the body from the frame. Thing is, it already seems like the Wisconsin number would be OK to use instead, thinking it over...
Also I thought that the 1, 6 and 9’s were different, this 1 looks like the old type.

Does anyone know around what series of numbers or when they started using the different design? I read somewhere that the early numbers may have the old stamp but that double arrow is legit. V8 5w!

Go to http://www.vanpeltsales.com/FH_web/f...lnumbers.htmBe sure to read to the bottom.

Charlie Stephens

[Mart]

This thread discusses the font style.

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=231215

In this case the trans was stamped with the new font and the frame seems to have old font or a mixture of old and new.

If the frame number in the link above is higher than the one in this thread, it could very well be that the old style digit stamps were still being used.

Mart.

Mart.

[rotorwrench]

Certain type & dilution of acid will bring up a visible signs of impact and associated hardening of the stamp characters due to the change in the material density of the steel where it was punched in. There is enough there to get a good result as done in the forensic sciences.

If the number on the body plate mentioned previously matches the title, I would try to go that route first. That Texas title is telling and they may consider it a state issued title number. You can always attempt to bring up the numbers later if you wish but procuring a title for those numbers may be problematic.

[noel_808]

Feels like an episode of CSI

[JSeery]

Originally Posted by noel_808

Feels like an episode of CSI

That's true!