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Old 07-01-2019, 09:53 PM   #41
Tinker
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

So your issue is you didn't over heat but lost fluid? If you leave it alone and don't add coolant then drive it hard again, do you over heat?

I don't think the 4lb cap came into the mix till 53 or so. I could be wrong.

Yes adding a 7lb cap could blow out a "old" rad. Pressure.

I don't think this is a pressure issue, as much as a volume issue. Just my 2cents.

Flow in the rad could be an issue. But did you try to run it hard after it puked. It can only take so much fluid volume. Over filling will find a way to dump. Reason for the overflow tube, but it just ran onto the ground normally before the pickup.

There is only a volume amount suggested by ford for coolant and oil. The gauges tell you if you over heat. Not if it's too much or too little on both. You have to watch that.


Having a heater to the cab helps to divert volume as well.




.

Last edited by Tinker; 07-01-2019 at 10:20 PM.
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Old 07-02-2019, 12:03 PM   #42
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

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Originally Posted by Tinker View Post
So your issue is you didn't over heat but lost fluid? If you leave it alone and don't add coolant then drive it hard again, do you over heat?

I don't think the 4lb cap came into the mix till 53 or so. I could be wrong.

Yes adding a 7lb cap could blow out a "old" rad. Pressure.

Thanks for the response, I'm taking the rad in today to have it flow checked, and to discuss possible modifications.

I don't think this is a pressure issue, as much as a volume issue. Just my 2cents.

Flow in the rad could be an issue. But did you try to run it hard after it puked. It can only take so much fluid volume. Over filling will find a way to dump. Reason for the overflow tube, but it just ran onto the ground normally before the pickup.

There is only a volume amount suggested by ford for coolant and oil. The gauges tell you if you over heat. Not if it's too much or too little on both. You have to watch that.


Having a heater to the cab helps to divert volume as well.




.

I have a heater and the coolant continually cycles through it (no shut off valve). According to the guy that was following me, the overflow puked each time I got to the top of a climb. In seeing how much coolant I lost, And being 350 miles from home, and thinking it was possible a head gasket issue, I chickened out as I didnt want to hurt the engine. So I can't answer your question of whether it would continue to puke if driven hard.

When I checked the coolant level once got to our destination, there was no coolant in the upper tank, and it seemed to take about a quart added to fill the core below the upper tank, that seemed pretty low to me.
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Old 07-03-2019, 05:54 PM   #43
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

To close the loop and follow up on this one...the rad checked out fine. So this took me back to the engine and the possibility of head gasket failure (or start of failure). So while the coolant was already drained, 48 bolts later and looks like we have the answer. The head gasket was leaking into the combustion chambers (likely worst under higher engine load)...and apparently could not be duplicated at low load in the shop.

So, I've included a bunch of pictures to show.

For all you sharp eyed viewers, you will notice there are cracks that run between the upper mid bolt and the lower water jacket hole in between cylinders 1 & 2, 3 & 4, 5 & 6 and 7 & 8. I believe they were there when the engine went together, and I believe I was told that they wouldn't be a problem. What do you guys think? Do they need to be stitched together/repaired or are they fine as is? I plan to use the graphite composite gaskets this time...copper can be used for pennies!
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Old 07-03-2019, 08:33 PM   #44
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

This one doesn't look too good. Pin it.
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Old 07-03-2019, 08:54 PM   #45
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

Jess, why just that one?
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Old 07-03-2019, 08:54 PM   #46
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

Has anyone used the Time-serts that are referred to in this youtube to repair similar cracks?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7dDZgflHKw

Like this...

https://www.amazon.com/TIME-SERT-16-...s%2C313&sr=8-3
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Old 07-03-2019, 10:27 PM   #47
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

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Jess, why just that one?

Only obvious one I saw. If others then, cracks into cylinders or valves aren't great.


My 36/38 run about just over the rad. Not much in the upper tank but I do top it off from time to time. Runs cool on my short trips 10-30 miles.

Last edited by Tinker; 07-04-2019 at 12:05 AM.
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Old 07-04-2019, 12:32 AM   #48
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

Glad to see you solved the problem which is what you suspected originally, but curious as to why the coolant tests didn't show the results. I have a very similar crack (the one @Tinker pointed out) between one of the head bolt threaded holes and coolant passage and was also told not to worry as these types are common. One of my rebuild books says the same. Machinist is wrapping up the end of this month with my short block, and I will check with hi again on Friday. Hard to tell from the sequence of pics, but wouldn't the crack into the cylinder head be the more worrisome?
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Old 07-04-2019, 12:38 AM   #49
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

I thought the one I pointed out was a casting hole in the compression area... not a crack. Maybe both. Hard to tell from pictures on the internet. But could have a lot of cracks, worry some or not. maybe a magnaflux and pressure test on the block. Cracks from a head bolt to the water jacket is usually considered benign for a regular engine.

A decent way to stop a crack is by pining it. Just have to follow the rabbit down the hole.

Maybe someone suggested looking to see if compression bubbling in the water was evident, I did not.
The copper gasket shows some areas of being burnt out too. Try a best composite next maybe.


.

Last edited by Tinker; 07-04-2019 at 01:26 AM.
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Old 07-04-2019, 01:18 AM   #50
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

Crack from head bolt to cooling hole. my 38 before milling.



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Old 07-04-2019, 02:28 AM   #51
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

The "part number" cracks usually ainīt much of a problem...makes sure the sealant on the stud is good...
Using big bore gaskets narrows the sealing surface in that area to.
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Old 07-04-2019, 02:52 AM   #52
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

I'd leave the "Part Number" cracks alone.
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Old 07-04-2019, 08:52 AM   #53
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

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Glad to see you solved the problem which is what you suspected originally, but curious as to why the coolant tests didn't show the results. I have a very similar crack (the one @Tinker pointed out) between one of the head bolt threaded holes and coolant passage and was also told not to worry as these types are common. One of my rebuild books says the same. Machinist is wrapping up the end of this month with my short block, and I will check with hi again on Friday. Hard to tell from the sequence of pics, but wouldn't the crack into the cylinder head be the more worrisome?
I am glad to have found the issue, but was also curious about why my coolant tests in the shop did not show any signs of the failure as well. I discussed this with the rad shop owner (good knowledgeable guy that gave me his time) when I took the rad in. He figured (and it makes sense to me), that under the load of climbing the hill, the engine was making a bit more heat, working a bit harder, there may be some differential heat expansions (aluminum heads, copper gaskets, cast iron block, steel headbolts) etc. Under that load was when the problem is going to start showing up. Once everything cooled down in my shop, everything re-sealed. He said that he had seen it before while chasing similar symptoms. It made sense to me.

Sorry about the sequence of the pictures (I had trouble with figuring out how to post them, and how to post them in a size that might be helpful). I have more pictures but didn't want to overwhelm the post. The heads are not cracked, one of the head photos shows the gasket sitting on it and the marking on the gasket is the telegraphed crack imprinted from the block.
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Old 07-04-2019, 09:18 AM   #54
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

You nailed it on the big bore gaskets comments...my block is .080" over so I had to use the big bore gaskets.

I had not seen the "parts number" reference to those cracks before (looked it up online...I get it, and like it!). My machinist at the time (that had magged the block and declared it good to go before machining), told me not to worry about the cracks in between the head bolts and the water jackets. After having the issue at hand, I was second guessing the recommendation.

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Old 07-04-2019, 02:57 PM   #55
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

.080 is just over the .060 that is STD gasket recomendation...i would be tempted to check how much the firerings on a STD gasket would go in over the deck...and that way get a wider seal area around the part between cylinders if you can use the STD gasket...
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Old 07-05-2019, 08:50 PM   #56
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

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You nailed it on the big bore gaskets comments...my block is .080" over so I had to use the big bore gaskets.

I had not seen the "parts number" reference to those cracks before (looked it up online...I get it, and like it!). My machinist at the time (that had magged the block and declared it good to go before machining), told me not to worry about the cracks in between the head bolts and the water jackets. After having the issue at hand, I was second guessing the recommendation.



Is this just a dark spot in the picture of yours?
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Old 07-05-2019, 09:10 PM   #57
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

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Is this just a dark spot in the picture of yours?
Sneaky bastage camera playing tricks on our eyes. I hadn't noticed it previous to your post. I just ran down to the shop to verify...the dark spot on the photo doesn't exist anywhere but in that photo.
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Old 07-05-2019, 11:01 PM   #58
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

Well that's a good. Maybe just a speck of indian head permatex.
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Old 07-06-2019, 08:25 AM   #59
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

Those cracks were included by Ford at no extra charge. You should see my block. Not to worry.
Having said that and looking at your picture of the head I believe you have other issues. There is no way a 500 mile motor should be sooted up and fuel washed like that. The plugs look reasonable from what I can see.
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Old 07-06-2019, 10:38 AM   #60
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Default Re: 59AB Cooling System Advice Needed from the Experts (not an overheating issue)

You should not have any problems running standard bore gaskets. My .080 over 52 Merc engine has them. I didn’t give it a second thought when assembling that I would need “big bore” gaskets.
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