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Old 03-07-2019, 09:41 AM   #1
Smitty
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Default Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

Do the Kwik Way boring bar fixtures correctly locate the bar in the horizontal position as referenced by the main datums but vertical positioning would need to be figured in order to place the crankshaft in proper location for timing gear mesh? Is this correct?
http://www.fordgarage.com/pages/kwboringbarfixtures.htm
Thanks, Steve
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Old 03-07-2019, 01:00 PM   #2
Jim Brierley
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

There are 2 fixtures, one at each end, that locate the bar. First you mount the bar to the pan rails, using the appropriate steel rails. (I made my own out of square tubing, and the length I wanted) then bolt these fixtures to the block via the main bolts, slide the bar in and secure the 4 stanchions. Not sure if stanchions is the right word?
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Old 03-07-2019, 01:24 PM   #3
BRENT in 10-uh-C
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

The vertical stanchions are actually called Bar Bearings by Kwik-Way, and they attach into the Bridge which has a form of a collect to hold the bar securely after being located.


As Jim suggests, the Model-A/B fixtures have a pin that locates off of the .505" datum hole that controls lateral location of the boring bar, and the fixture is machined where the boring bar is clamped into the fixture and that controls the vertical location of the bar. The fixtures are what is key to quickly locating the boring bar on a K/W LBM.
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Old 03-07-2019, 10:15 PM   #4
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

So in a Model A block you would use 2 bar bearings..How many bridges would you need in the setup, all 4? Will any 1.250 bar work with this setup?
S
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Old 03-08-2019, 03:54 AM   #5
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

Four bar bearings, four bridges. With 3 main bearings you place one on each outer edge
of the crankcase and one on either side of the center bearing.
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Old 03-08-2019, 12:01 PM   #6
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

And any 1.250" will work. Another important item is the matching micrometer.
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Old 03-08-2019, 12:53 PM   #7
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

I have KRW setup with the drawback being the standard size reamer and bar. Attempting to have the bar set up with adjustable cutters. Using a TA micrometer 1.250 mic.
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Old 03-08-2019, 04:27 PM   #8
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

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Originally Posted by Smitty View Post
I have KRW setup with the drawback being the standard size reamer and bar. Attempting to have the bar set up with adjustable cutters. Using a TA micrometer 1.250 mic.

While I don't use a bar micrometer on my LBM, I don't think you are going to be able to use the LBM mic on a KR Wilson bar.
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Last edited by BRENT in 10-uh-C; 03-09-2019 at 08:33 AM.
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Old 03-09-2019, 10:50 PM   #9
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Brierley View Post
There are 2 fixtures, one at each end, that locate the bar. First you mount the bar to the pan rails, using the appropriate steel rails. (I made my own out of square tubing, and the length I wanted) then bolt these fixtures to the block via the main bolts, slide the bar in and secure the 4 stanchions. Not sure if stanchions is the right word?
They are called " Bar Bearings " Mr. Jim.

Herm.
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Old 03-10-2019, 10:58 AM   #10
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

Thanks Ora, I might have known that at one time? A long time ago!
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Old 03-11-2019, 06:43 AM   #11
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

Ok, here is the $10,000 question: Should Babbitt bearings if properly installed hold up for a good amount of mileage? Reason I ask is I have had main bearing failure on a couple of motors. Mains on these motors were not peined, set up way too tight ( I had to back off to get the crank to be able to rotate). If I tried to set proper clearance but crank would also not rotate. Had to use a rear main cap from another motor because the rear cap was butchered so badly.


Ironically I have an old engine with extremely worn main bearings, perhaps original but not a piece of broken out babbitt in the entire motor.


I drive this car 6-7k year
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Old 03-11-2019, 07:18 AM   #12
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

I have found that there isn't much you can do to "save" bad babbitt job, and there isn't much you can do to hurt a good job ---I have seen a lot of original babbitt in engines with enough cylinder wall wear to know it went for more than 50,000 miles, and still had factory shims

The kwik way lbm mic, and the aamco 400 mic can be used on the converted KRW fixture, but the mic may not be calibrated to read directly, you will have to bore a test hole and see if a correction factor is needed
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Old 03-11-2019, 12:19 PM   #13
Jim Brierley
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

I've found that mains hold up very well, better than rods.
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Old 03-11-2019, 09:47 PM   #14
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

That is what I am kind of thinking..if mains are properly done and car is driven sensibly and cared for I should think it would last. There are a lot of hacks out there passing off as Model A experts.
Good mechanics are few.
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Old 03-12-2019, 08:26 AM   #15
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

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Originally Posted by Smitty View Post
That is what I am kind of thinking..if mains are properly done and car is driven sensibly and cared for I should think it would last. There are a lot of hacks out there passing off as Model A experts.
Good mechanics are few.




While that is potentially a true statement, I tend to believe the bigger issue is many Model-A hobbyists do not want to pay for the time it takes a "good" machinist to do a quality job. The 'hacks' stay in business because they are serving a hobbyist that generally does not want to pay for quality even though that is what they are expecting. When you think about it in that realm, it proves there are plenty of these customers available to keep the 'hacks' in business ...or these hacks would be out of business.


The second side of this is many 'hacks' do not have quality machines to do the quality work. The bottom line is they cannot afford to buy modern equipment with the wage they are making on a 'low-end' rebuild pricing. Therefore they make-do with what old & tired equipment they presently have and cut corners wherever they can to save time & costs.
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Old 03-12-2019, 10:53 AM   #16
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

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Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C View Post
While that is potentially a true statement, I tend to believe the bigger issue is many Model-A hobbyists do not want to pay for the time it takes a "good" machinist to do a quality job. The 'hacks' stay in business because they are serving a hobbyist that generally does not want to pay for quality even though that is what they are expecting. When you think about it in that realm, it proves there are plenty of these customers available to keep the 'hacks' in business ...or these hacks would be out of business.


The second side of this is many 'hacks' do not have quality machines to do the quality work. The bottom line is they cannot afford to buy modern equipment with the wage they are making on a 'low-end' rebuild pricing. Therefore they make-do with what old & tired equipment they presently have and cut corners wherever they can to save time & costs.
I know of one of those "HACK" so Called Shops.. My car was there for some work and was told by the owner that the engine needed to be rebuilt, it was done ??. When went back to get car it would not even run !! Oh, by the way here is your bill $62,000.. Do you want us to push it into your trailer or do you have a cable hook up ??.... P.M. Me for Name of Shop & Details with lots of Pictures..
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Old 03-13-2019, 11:27 PM   #17
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Default Re: Kwik Way Boring Bar Fixtures

Do a search on Centering a crankshaft in a Model A block and read great ideas and thoughts of the experts there such as Herm Koenke.
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