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Old 09-02-2019, 07:27 PM   #21
bobgc
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

I like what I see in the pictures. I have a t-5 but was reluctant to put it in as I was told you have to convert to open drive, that means spreading the wish bones on the rear. Obviously you don't have to.
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Old 09-02-2019, 07:35 PM   #22
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

For the regular guy gearing is the most sensible to utilize power. I've said you could make a 8hp briggs go 200mhp with the right transmission. Oh course this is not true, but gearing.

Looks great! Worst part about the earlier way was cutting the frame up and losing the torque tube. new 2019 corvettes use torque tubes. F150 versions were/are available also. Maybe as 3sps become less available to buy, this might free up some.

Coop, were does the shiftier end up in the cab for the sample you shared?


.

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Old 09-02-2019, 07:51 PM   #23
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

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Looks great! Worst part about the earlier way was cutting the frame up and losing the torque tube. new 2019 corvettes use torque tubes.


Coop, were does the shiftier end up in the cab for the sample you shared?


.

Tinker...If you're not familiar with my "T5 W/TORQUE TUBE" link (click the hi-lited link at the bottom, left of this post), I should have mentioned that this T5 is in Heard's '35 pick-up. The car and truck chassis are identical, and the relative position of the shifter is similar in a car or pick-up with regard to the seat. The picture below (as well as many others) can also be seen if you click my "T5" link below in this post. This is a T5 that we put together utilizing the very short Jeep main shaft and tail shaft housing, along with the Camaro close-ratio gear set (2.95 1st gear) and a .63 O/D ratio. DD


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Old 09-02-2019, 07:59 PM   #24
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

Pretty slick setup.
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Old 09-02-2019, 08:53 PM   #25
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

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Ron.....Do you know WHICH T5 you have? There are so many variations with the gear ratios, many of which have a ridiculously low 4.03 1st gear, along with pretty wide spacing between gears. Ideally, it's a close-ratio gear set with the 2.95 1st gear to keep the revs tightly-grouped in the relatively-narrow torque band on that flatty. Generally, if the input shaft has 26-splines, it's gonna be the close ratio set. Remember, any T5 case can be re-fitted with any of the different gear sets (gear ratios). But the gear sets must be swapped as a complete set....no way to individually tailor ONE PARTICULAR gear's ratio....complete gear sets only. DD
A properly modified and tuned flathead will have a very flat torque curve from 2000 rpm to 3500 rpm.
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Old 09-02-2019, 10:30 PM   #26
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

I don't want to be this guy but buy a few books. JWL's and Rons on flatheads. Maybe pick up some manuals too. If you are doing 3sp trans then Van pelt.


or not.


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Old 09-03-2019, 02:05 PM   #27
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A properly modified and tuned flathead will have a very flat torque curve from 2000 rpm to 3500 rpm.

Hey Flatjack….Every combination of parts used and mods employed will obviously produce optimum torque ranges that will vary to some degree, BUT I UNDERSTAND YOUR POINT. The point I was trying to make is that you want to keep your RPMs (while rowing thru the gears) comfortably within the limits of whatever your particular torque range may be, without dropping the RPMs below the lower limit when you shift to the next higher gear. Using YOUR torque figures, and when utilizing a 3-speed trans, it might be a possibility that you could shift from 1st gear to 2nd gear at 3,400 RPMs. It's also entirely possible that when making the shift that the RPMs may drop to somewhere below 2,000, whereas utilizing the extra gear that a 4-speed offers would obviously make your RPM drop LESS, to a more-desirable RPM well-above your lower limit. Virtually all 3-speeds have too much of a spread between gears for optimum torque utilization.....where acceleration rate is a factor. Go drive somebody's car with a Muncie 4-speed or a T5 and the difference becomes remarkably obvious. DD
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Old 09-03-2019, 03:04 PM   #28
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My T-5 came from an 87 Mustang with the HP 302 engine. The car was in a serious wreck, but the driver and Passenger survived. I likr the ratios fpr tins application. 4/10 in the rear. I just replaced the Dana 44A with a Dana 35 Major weight savings, unfortunately I have to install a Locker. Fortunately I have a few friends that run the off road with Jeeps. I don't think the flathead will hurt it.
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Old 09-03-2019, 04:06 PM   #29
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

Ron, does it have the tag on it still? There are charts where you can look up the gear ratios from the tag number.
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Old 09-03-2019, 09:34 PM   #30
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Not sure about the tag. It;s amazing how a thread on street engines, can shift to transmissions. Not that I mind. However I think that modifying the trans to work with the original rear is going backwards and is an unnecessary expense. The original rear isn't much better than the trans your replacing. The cost of a late open drive rear isn't that much and you get a modern rear and brakes. I like the Dana/spicer 35 It' light,which improves ride and comes in a bunch of gear ration and you can buy a bolt pattern adapter now the reliability factor of your vehicle goes war
y up. Don't forget to mill the heads. get more torque.
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Old 09-03-2019, 09:56 PM   #31
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

Ron, there should be a metal tag connected to one of the cover bolts. Without the tag it is difficult to tell what you have and they are often missing. You can determine the gear ratios by turning the input and output and carefully counting the rotations. Or just removing the cover and counting the gear teeth.

An 87 mustang should have a 3.35 1st gear and .68 OD behind the 5.0. The 4 cyl engines had much lower gearing.

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Old 09-03-2019, 11:14 PM   #32
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I've had the trans for several years, and had the gear ratios written down some place and the opinion was it would make a good start. The engine will be a 258 with some extensive porting and a Earson D410 cam. I hope to pull the torque curve up over 5k. Might work, might not, we'll see????
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Old 09-04-2019, 07:21 AM   #33
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

The best factory gear set is still used in the T5Z Ford Racing version of the T5. It has the 2.95 first. I take this transmission and then put a .80 or so overdrive gear in it - which keeps all the gear spreads where I want them. The only challenge is that this transmission is NOT cheap, so it is not about saving money by any means. I'm probably heading this route in my 34 roadster . . . but that project is further "back in line" behind the rest! LOL
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Old 09-04-2019, 07:52 AM   #34
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

Quote:
Originally Posted by V8COOPMAN;
Go drive somebody's car with a Muncie 4-speed or a T5 and the difference becomes remarkably obvious.
Well spoken, for sheer drivability a 4 speed or a 5 speed were made for the flathead. I put a T-10 and a Granada [Ford] automatic rear in 25 years ago, long before many had thought about the conversion. The T-10 and Granada are basically "bolt-ins".
Once I drove it never once thought about reinstalling the OD.
The auto gear makes for a very comfortable [2600rpms] 70MPH car. The drop-in center section makes for an easy gear change if desired.
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Old 09-04-2019, 09:56 AM   #35
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

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The best factory gear set is still used in the T5Z Ford Racing version of the T5. It has the 2.95 first. I take this transmission and then put a .80 or so overdrive gear in it - which keeps all the gear spreads where I want them. The only challenge is that this transmission is NOT cheap, so it is not about saving money by any means. I'm probably heading this route in my 34 roadster . . . but that project is further "back in line" behind the rest! LOL
Not cheap is currently correct, but a few years back I could purchase T5z's from a Ford dealer for really low prices and with free shipping to the dealer! Purchased several of them and have two left. They were cheaper new than you could build a good unit. But, those days are gone.

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Old 09-04-2019, 10:05 AM   #36
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

the Ford T-10 to the dealer was $205, back in the 60's.
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Old 09-04-2019, 10:30 AM   #37
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

FYI, a pre 1990 Ranger rear axle from a 4x4 should be a factory Traction Loc that is 56 5/8 from mounting flange to mounting flange. It should be a 3.73 or 4.10. The four cylinder ratio may be 3.45, same width but with small brakes.
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Old 09-04-2019, 01:30 PM   #38
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

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The best factory gear set is still used in the T5Z Ford Racing version of the T5. It has the 2.95 first. I take this transmission and then put a .80 or so overdrive gear in it - which keeps all the gear spreads where I want them. The only challenge is that this transmission is NOT cheap, so it is not about saving money by any means. I'm probably heading this route in my 34 roadster . . . but that project is further "back in line" behind the rest! LOL
The basic gear set number for that is 202. You have to add the .8 OD yourself.
I have had one like that in my car for 20 years.

The cheapest way to arrive at all of this is buy or exchange the internal parts at a transmission shop or, if you wish, just have them assemble one with the 202 gears. You will get all of the late synchros etc also. While you are at it you can add a second tail shaft bushing in line with the original. This gives the slip joint more bearing surface. Put a street "L" in the fill plug hole facing up with a pipe plug in it. This will raise the lube level a half inch which helps parts longevity. It helps oil the slip joint also.
Also makes it a LOT easier to fill.

Transmission shops always have good used gears so you can save a few bucks by using these also.
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Old 09-04-2019, 01:39 PM   #39
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

All this makes perfect sense, but it seems to me like you need to keep working back and out if going with a different trans.

A built flathead with a modern trans equals more speed and acceleration. More speed and acceleration means you'll need a stronger rear with a better ratio.

More speed and acceleration also means you'll need to stop better, so upgrading the brakes is a consideration.

I guess it would make sense to start with all these parts first vs. retro fitting.

Just throwing my worthless opinion into the mix....
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Old 09-04-2019, 01:46 PM   #40
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Default Re: STREET MACHInES, Engines, gearing and etc

[QUOTE=Ol' Ron;1795297]Not sure about the tag. It;s amazing how a thread on street engines, can shift to transmissions. Not that I mind. However I think that modifying the trans to work with the original rear is going backwards and is an unnecessary expense.

OK Old Ron
How about a stock cam shaft in a 276 Cu. In. 59 AB engine used for street driving???. Do I really need a different (( hotter, bigger, faster, cam)). I Never get more than 100 miles from home. Car is a 1946 ford coupe that has 81,000
miles on the engine and car. Engine is coming out this month, I have 4" crank turned and ready to go. I also have pistons, rings, new valves and Guides, Gaskets. NOW IF I KEEP THE LIFTERS AND CAM ALL TOGETHER and not mix the lifters up, MAYBE I can reuse the Cam. MAYBE THIS IS A VERY BAD IDEA.??? WHAT SAY YOU???. This thought is not money driven, But the car now starts easy, even in the winter, and is pleasant to drive. No slipping the clutch or always keeping the RPM up. I have been driving 46-48 fords for most of 65 Yrs., and I know what it is like to drive a flathead ford that is not lazy. I would really like to hear Old Rons, and others thoughts on this. Has any one here ever run a stock cam with a 276 Cu, In. engine, one carb and stock heads. I would like to thank all you guys for this site, and all the knowledge that is here. David
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