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Old 03-14-2020, 11:28 AM   #21
Dan McEachern
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

Another reason you can't shim between the 4 mounting holes is that the rear cam bearing seal relies on those two surfaces being in contact. Shims on the cam side for sure would compromise that seal. Then you will be screaming at your engine builder that the rear main is leaking when its the cam bearing.
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Old 03-14-2020, 12:31 PM   #22
jb-ob
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

Dan,


Since most block to clutch housing gaskets are made today from thick cardboard in stead of paper, I'm not expecting a problem.
I'll get back to you.
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Old 03-14-2020, 12:55 PM   #23
Jack Shaft
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

But you can gain some adjustment usings horseshoe shims and gasket ..one or the other,or none..I have none on mine,no horseshoes,no gasket,just sealant..
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Old 03-14-2020, 01:28 PM   #24
Russ/40
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

Herm, your most patient and very helpful. I appreciate the generous giving of your time to clarify my many questions. I was having a problem with both operations with the same two adjustments. The concept of essentially training the material to come into alignment made the light come on in my head.
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Old 03-14-2020, 01:28 PM   #25
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

Herm,


Who gets the job of humping that 65 pound flywheel on & off the crank flange during the shimming process ?


If from your experience (I don't doubt) that most/all crank flange to flywheel surfaces are no longer factory 'true', why not a fly cut to both ?


(And avoid the hernia surgery.)


jb
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Old 03-14-2020, 03:37 PM   #26
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

I have been told to work on 1,3 and 9. forget about 6. Once you bolt the housing up it will take care of 6. Makes the process a whole lot easier.
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Old 03-14-2020, 11:31 PM   #27
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

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Originally Posted by David R. View Post
Herm, thanks so much for taking the time to go into such a detailed explanation and adding the excellent photos. I had to read through it a couple times, but after I got it it seems pretty simple, (in theory that is). What type shims do you use, as the horse shoe type seem to only come in .010 ?
.003, .002, and .001 thousandths thickness. You can use old main shims, cut down, fronts, and centers, as they are .002, and .003's. McMaster-Carr carries .001, and .002 in 12" sheets.

Write down what the thickness of the finished shim pack are, right, and left, just in case, a pack would fall.

Herm.
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Old 03-14-2020, 11:41 PM   #28
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SO, whether doing the 9 & 3, or the 12 & 6, the same two top shim packs are used.?
Yes, But!

9 & 3 can be 2 different thickness of shim packs.

12 & 6 will be equal, when adding, or subtracting, from the stack.

Herm.
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Old 03-15-2020, 12:31 AM   #29
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Herm,


Who gets the job of humping that 65 pound flywheel on & off the crank flange during the shimming process ?


If from your experience (I don't doubt) that most/all crank flange to flywheel surfaces are no longer factory 'true', why not a fly cut to both ?


(And avoid the hernia surgery.)


jb
When grinding the rear crank flange, you should have just gotten done grinding, all 3 mains. Then is the time to grind the cranks, rear flange. There will be no better time, that the crank journals, will align with the flange, any better. By using a crank grinder, no set up time, it is already done, and it will do a smoother , more accurate job.

The flywheel, does not have a part to play in setting the flywheel housing. They are set on once, and bolted down, and checked for off center, and then for wobble. The one in pictures shows 0, in 1 full circle. The wobble shows, .001 thousandths, meaning, correction would be .000-50, 1/2 thousandths.

If you grind a crank square, and on center line, and align bore square, set the flywheel housing square, grind the flywheel square, you can eliminate a lot of engine problems.

Herm.
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Old 03-15-2020, 12:43 AM   #30
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I have been told to work on 1,3 and 9. forget about 6. Once you bolt the housing up it will take care of 6. Makes the process a whole lot easier.
Well, Daren, I Agree it would sure would make it easier.
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Old 03-15-2020, 02:21 AM   #31
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

Correction, One should be 12.
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Old 03-15-2020, 07:29 AM   #32
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Herm,


Like others, thanks for sharing. I'm always in your audience reading your posts. I've gained a much better understanding.


I have a very early brass car collector that allows me to use their shop. After watching me fuss with some A parts, they complimented my efforts by asking if I knew what I had when finished ?


"It still just a Ford ."
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Old 03-15-2020, 08:40 AM   #33
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

I would also like to ask Herm why brass shims, I have steel shims, isn't that OK to use. Also someone mentioned doing this in the car. Is that possible? Jack
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Old 03-15-2020, 09:36 AM   #34
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It is common to do this repair on heavy trucks in frame,just be careful when turning the crank you don't 'force' the thrust clearance.
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Old 03-15-2020, 05:35 PM   #35
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

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I would also like to ask Herm why brass shims, I have steel shims, isn't that OK to use. Also someone mentioned doing this in the car. Is that possible? Jack
Steel shims are quite alright, I just don't have any in the shop, as we don't use them for any thing. But I have a lot of brass that we use every day.

In the Car? I won't say anything about why it can't be done perfect, and I think most of you know why. I will say, if it had to be done that why, I couldn't do it at all, but I am not them.

Herm.
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Old 03-15-2020, 06:36 PM   #36
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I have been told to work on 1,3 and 9. forget about 6. Once you bolt the housing up it will take care of 6. Makes the process a whole lot easier.
Daren, this is my opinion.

9, 12, and 3 getting squared is good, but the bottom has a tendency to be off the worst. 0 to maybe 16? When the bell housing tightens up, yes it will pull together, at the bottom, but when that happens, you are stressing the other 3 points. You now have 4 points, out of alignment.

The flywheel housing adjusting is just as important, as any job on Building an engine. If you torque a head wrong, the metal moves, and you have a leaker. If you torque it right, it doesn't leak.

If you don't square a flywheel housing, the pilot bearing, the ball bearing in the front of the transmission case. I have seen cases destroyed from alignment problems, pressure on your rear main Babbitt, and can cause rough clutch operation. Of course, there other things that can cost you your money, but which one would you chose, one you knew about, and didn't think it was that important, or one you knew nothing about yet.

Thank's, Daren,

Herm.
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Old 03-16-2020, 10:49 AM   #37
goodcar
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

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Originally Posted by Kohnke Rebabbitting View Post
.003, .002, and .001 thousandths thickness. You can use old main shims, cut down, fronts, and centers, as they are .002, and .003's. McMaster-Carr carries .001, and .002 in 12" sheets.

Write down what the thickness of the finished shim pack are, right, and left, just in case, a pack would fall.

Herm.
Ace Hardware and Hobby Lobby sell brass sheets in various thickness.
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Old 03-16-2020, 11:36 AM   #38
Bud
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

I had to shim my crank flange because the original rebuilder did not grind it square. It was out .0020". I used a half-circle shim captured by the flywheel screws to fix the problem. It can't get out anyway. It still took quite a while to get the flywheel housing squared up, but I got there in the end.
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Old 03-16-2020, 07:37 PM   #39
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

Herm I follow your thinking. Just how far out would you have to be to have the problems you are talking about. If you get 9, 12, and 3 within one, two thousands you are going to have to leave it up to the clutch housing to finish the rest. You would be chasing your tail. I find it hard to believe Henry went through this procedure on any of his engines...Time is money.
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Old 03-16-2020, 08:01 PM   #40
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Default Re: Flywheel Housing Alignment

Henry was working with new parts !

I've wondered about checking in the car, and a light bulb justed turned on !! Thanks Herm

........................the engine is mounted by the housing .................. Duh
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