The Ford Barn

Shoebox · 06-27-2015, 03:05 PM

Ok, so in the beginning my charging system was working.....but the front bearing in the gen was making noise. So I blew the generator apart and installed new front bearing, NOS armature, new brushes and rear bushing, and painted up real nice. The regulator has been on the car a long time but is not original and had an added wire from terminal on side to a case bolt on the generator, apparently a ground (generator has no ground terminal). It was mentioned here on the Barn that regulators with a side ground terminal such as this often just had a short lead going to a mounting screw of the regulator. Having just also installed a new wiring harness from Naragansett Reproductions (everything else electrical on the car works fine) I eliminated the added lead from reg. to gen. and made up a small lead going from the Reg. terminal to one of the mounting screws. I did the polarizing of the gen. but no charging. I'm sure at the end of the day it's going to be some sort of ground issue......... what do you guys think???

Shoebox

chap52 · 06-27-2015, 03:50 PM

You mentioned that you polarized the generator. Not doubting your understanding of the process, but you might read http://starautoelectric.com/page25.php . I had not done this process in years and had to take a quick refresher course to make sure I did it right.
Good luck, keep us posted.

Old Henry · 06-27-2015, 04:26 PM

For some reason the ground connection is so critical between the generator and the regulator that there needs to be a ground wire specifically going between the two as was originally wired rather than relying solely on a ground through the engine - to ground strap to body - to ground wire from body to regulator as you have connected. I'd try installing one of those and see if it helps.

Shoebox · 06-27-2015, 04:34 PM

Hey Chap,
Believe me, no problem doubting my understanding, that's why I'm here

I am going to revisit my polarizing, my efforts were done at the generator. I did a lot of searching here on the Barn on this subject just now, some variations however the VAST MAJORITY recommend disconnecting the Field wire (to avoid possible burning of reg. points) and momentarily touching to reg. Battery terminal. The link you showed was written by someone who sounds like he knows what he was talking about EXCEPT he said to jumper the Batt. terminal to the D terminal ??? and "under no circumstances touch the F terminal. This confuses me, there is no D terminal and everyone else says to touch F to B.

I'm not going to do anything till later tonight but I'm inclined to go with the majority recomendation of F wires to B terminal.

Comments welcom

Shoebox

JSeery · 06-27-2015, 04:46 PM

What year car are we dealing with here. I think Ford used a ground connection between the generator and the regulator starting in 41. The generator can be grounded through the housing, engine, etc to the frame and the regulator through the body to the frame. BUT there has to be a good ground path all the way and it is still better to have the dedicated wire.

Shoebox · 06-27-2015, 05:00 PM

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Hey JSeery,
Sorry for the year omission, this is a 39 Mercury, original and 6v pos. ground. There was no direct reg. to gen. wire in 39, none present in my new original harness, BUT this reg. is not the original and it has a grd terminal on passenger side and someone did add that direct wire at some time.

I have no problem making up such a wire if that is what we gotta have, just waiting to see if there are any more comments on my polarizing procedure.

Thanks!

Shoebox

JSeery · 06-27-2015, 05:20 PM

When Ford first switched to the regulator they did not use the dedicated ground wire. Apparently they soon decided they need it! I'm sure you could get it to work without it, but again, all the ground paths have to be good. Ford determined that it was better to use the ground wire. Might run a temporary ground connection and see how much difference it makes.

koates · 06-27-2015, 05:50 PM

Shoebox, The British call it the "D" terminal which stands for Dynamo. American Fords it is the "A" terminal for armature, so all the same terminal. If the generator was working electrically OK apart from the noisy bearing before you rebuilt it then maybe there is a problem inside the generator and the regulator should be OK as it was OK before the work was done. Yes maybe a repolarise of the gen is required. Regards, Kevin.

flathead48 · 06-28-2015, 06:42 AM

I would not use a jumper I would unhook the F wire and quickly touch it to the B post. Just my opinion.

06-27-2015, 03:50 PM	#2
chap52 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Marana Arizona Posts: 1,776	Re: Generator/Charging Problem You mentioned that you polarized the generator. Not doubting your understanding of the process, but you might read http://starautoelectric.com/page25.php . I had not done this process in years and had to take a quick refresher course to make sure I did it right. Good luck, keep us posted.

06-27-2015, 04:26 PM	#3
Old Henry Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Orem, Utah Posts: 5,762	Re: Generator/Charging Problem For some reason the ground connection is so critical between the generator and the regulator that there needs to be a ground wire specifically going between the two as was originally wired rather than relying solely on a ground through the engine - to ground strap to body - to ground wire from body to regulator as you have connected. I'd try installing one of those and see if it helps. __________________ Prof. Henry (The Roaming Gnome) "It is good to have an end to journey toward; but it is the journey that matters, in the end.” *Ursula K. Le Guin in The Left Hand of Darkness

06-27-2015, 04:34 PM	#4
Shoebox Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Holmen,Wisconsin Posts: 787	Re: Generator/Charging Problem Hey Chap, Believe me, no problem doubting my understanding, that's why I'm here I am going to revisit my polarizing, my efforts were done at the generator. I did a lot of searching here on the Barn on this subject just now, some variations however the VAST MAJORITY recommend disconnecting the Field wire (to avoid possible burning of reg. points) and momentarily touching to reg. Battery terminal. The link you showed was written by someone who sounds like he knows what he was talking about EXCEPT he said to jumper the Batt. terminal to the D terminal ??? and "under no circumstances touch the F terminal. This confuses me, there is no D terminal and everyone else says to touch F to B. I'm not going to do anything till later tonight but I'm inclined to go with the majority recomendation of F wires to B terminal. Comments welcom Shoebox __________________ I went, I saw, I bought the T shirt 51 Ford Deluxe Tudor 32 Ford roadster 39 Mercury Towncar

06-27-2015, 04:46 PM	#5
JSeery Member Emeritus Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Wichita KS Posts: 16,132	Re: Generator/Charging Problem What year car are we dealing with here. I think Ford used a ground connection between the generator and the regulator starting in 41. The generator can be grounded through the housing, engine, etc to the frame and the regulator through the body to the frame. BUT there has to be a good ground path all the way and it is still better to have the dedicated wire.

06-27-2015, 05:00 PM	#6
Shoebox Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Holmen,Wisconsin Posts: 787	Re: Generator/Charging Problem Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Hey JSeery, Sorry for the year omission, this is a 39 Mercury, original and 6v pos. ground. There was no direct reg. to gen. wire in 39, none present in my new original harness, BUT this reg. is not the original and it has a grd terminal on passenger side and someone did add that direct wire at some time. I have no problem making up such a wire if that is what we gotta have, just waiting to see if there are any more comments on my polarizing procedure. Thanks! Shoebox __________________ I went, I saw, I bought the T shirt 51 Ford Deluxe Tudor 32 Ford roadster 39 Mercury Towncar

06-27-2015, 05:20 PM	#7
JSeery Member Emeritus Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Wichita KS Posts: 16,132	Re: Generator/Charging Problem When Ford first switched to the regulator they did not use the dedicated ground wire. Apparently they soon decided they need it! I'm sure you could get it to work without it, but again, all the ground paths have to be good. Ford determined that it was better to use the ground wire. Might run a temporary ground connection and see how much difference it makes.

06-27-2015, 05:50 PM	#8
koates Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Melbourne Australia. Posts: 2,079	Re: Generator/Charging Problem Shoebox, The British call it the "D" terminal which stands for Dynamo. American Fords it is the "A" terminal for armature, so all the same terminal. If the generator was working electrically OK apart from the noisy bearing before you rebuilt it then maybe there is a problem inside the generator and the regulator should be OK as it was OK before the work was done. Yes maybe a repolarise of the gen is required. Regards, Kevin.

06-28-2015, 06:42 AM	#9
flathead48 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Saratoga Springs, NY Posts: 1,110	Re: Generator/Charging Problem I would not use a jumper I would unhook the F wire and quickly touch it to the B post. Just my opinion.