Early Production '57 Ford Data Plate Questions

[yblock57]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

I assure you the cipher I gave is correct.

The exact info to cipher all plates was deleted from the 1949/59 FORD PASS CAR MPC - FINAL ISSUE.

See attached for excerpts from pre-mid 1957 PATENT PLATE info - this particular reading describing a Retractable HDT. There appears to be deviations between different model lines.

This is the source of the info that needs to be found,, not a BIRD Restorer's opinion.

Your PRODUCTION CODE reads for your particular 57 as -

1) 26L - BUILD DATE
2) 98 - DISTRICT SALES
3) 5 - 2.91 RR AXLE
4) C - F/M (All Were 3S)

Kultulz for the win! Thanks for posting this and figuring out the last piece of the puzzle. [emoji1303]

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by dmsfrr

Here are a couple links to separate sources (not T-Bird) that describe the 'Production Code' used on mid-50's Ford data / patent plates for various cars until mid April of '57.

https://www.1954ford.com/page3.php

https://1956-ford.com/images1956ford...ate-decode.pdf

And image 1 below from the Crown Victoria Assn website showing similar information...

In these various examples, plus the one from CTCI, the Production Code is consistently described as being: digits for the day of the month, a letter code for the month, and digits for a (presumably) daily production number.
Some of these plates have usually 2 characters between the date and daily vehicle number that is the Dealer sales area code. Image 2 below.

If you have additional or different information concerning the makeup of the 'Production Code' on this style of data/patent plate I'd welcome seeing it.



It was because of the '55/'57 Thunderbirds that much of the original Ford vehicle information from the mid/late 50's was saved.
"While employed at Ford Motor Company, (Lois) Eminger discovered that original invoice copies were being destroyed when no longer needed. ... Eminger felt this information might be of importance to people down the road, so she asked for permission to save these copies for future reference, and permission was granted by Ford for her to do so."
https://automotivemileposts.com/tbir...57eminger.html

Yes the charts on the CTCI / Thunderbird website don't specifically include other Ford car models, but the information corresponds directly with the original Ford documents mentioned in the previous paragraph.
"...we have Thunderbird invoices for the 1955 models after serial number 232214 and substantially all of the 1956 and 1957 models available ..."
https://www.ctci.org/invoice-sales/

FYI, approximately 99% of '55/'57 T-Birds were built in Dearborn.
.

Originally Posted by dmsfrr

In these various examples, plus the one from CTCI, the Production Code is consistently described as being: digits for the day of the month, a letter code for the month, and digits for a (presumably) daily production number.

Some of these plates have usually 2 characters between the date and daily vehicle number that is the Dealer sales area code. Image 2 below.

If you have additional or different information concerning the makeup of the 'Production Code' on this style of data/patent plate I'd welcome seeing it.

It was because of the '55/'57 Thunderbirds that much of the original Ford vehicle information from the mid/late 50's was saved.
"While employed at Ford Motor Company, (Lois) Eminger discovered that original invoice copies were being destroyed when no longer needed. ... Eminger felt this information might be of importance to people down the road, so she asked for permission to save these copies for future reference, and permission was granted by Ford for her to do so."
https://automotivemileposts.com/tbir...57eminger.html

Yes the charts on the CTCI Thunderbird website don't specifically include other Ford car models, but the information corresponds directly with the original Ford documents mentioned in the previous paragraph .
"...we have Thunderbird invoices for the 1955 models after serial number 232214 and substantially all of the 1956 and 1957 models available ..."
https://www.ctci.org/invoice-sales/

FYI,approximately 98/99% of '55/'57 T-Birds were built in Dearborn, not Detroit.
.

Now let me ask you this as your testosterone level is hitting peak and I am concerned about your heart.

You see no differences in the numerous produced early 57 PATENT PLATES PRODUCTION CODE NUMBERS AND SEQUENCE differences?

You cannot compare an early 57 PLATE with an earlier year PLATE without having the exact manufacturer year information.

I have found only one true example of the coding and that will have to be found in it's entirety in a much earlier catalog printing. What your experts are going on is based only on incomplete facts and documentation. Maybe the subject was never noticed or drew interest before this exchange.

Concerning DETROIT and/or DEARBORN, you say tomato and I say tomatoes. They are just like PREGO, it's all in there.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by yblock57

Kultulz for the win! Thanks for posting this and figuring out the last piece of the puzzle. [emoji1303]

Well, it was no win. I am just trying to rid the hobby of OLD WIVES TALES. I still have to find the correct original information in it's entirety.

Now did you read the description of 2 and 3 after the EXTERIOR PAINT CODE?

[yblock57]

From what I read, the 2 stood for tu-tone paint. They explained it would be a ‘3’ for tri-color cars, but that has to be ‘59 & up. Never seen or heard of a tri-color ‘57.

EDIT:

Fella on the 57 site clarified;

“The 2 after the paint code is for the second formula for mixing the paint, "Coral sand" had 3 formula changers during the 57 model run.”

Interesting that they changed paint formulas. Wonder if that changed the shade as well? Learn something new everyday.

[dmsfrr]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

...
Your PRODUCTION CODE reads for your particular 57 as -
1) 26L - BUILD DATE
2) 98 - DISTRICT SALES
3) 5 - 2.91 RR AXLE
4) C - F/M (All Were 3S)

Back in the original post is an image of a November '56 data plate for a '57 model year car. Image 1.
The question asked in that original post was how to break down the "Production Code" number on the right side of the second line.

After other examples were presented, you included a March 19, '57 dated patent plate example with decoding notes that include the following items in the Production Code: Date, Dealer Code and Item Number. Image 2.
The previous examples also had the same Production Code breakdown.

An updated data plate style used after the middle of April '57 was also shown to now include the Transmission and Axle codes instead of the "Production Code". Example in image 3.

Please provide realistic evidence of Dealer Sales District "98" and how Transmission and Axle codes can be found on an early '57 plate where they don't exist. Image 2.

[KULTULZ]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Please provide realistic evidence of Dealer Sales District "98" and how Transmission and Axle codes can be found on an early '57 plate where they don't exist. Image 2.

You are not hearing what I post. Please turn your volume up.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by yblock57

From what I read, the 2 stood for tu-tone paint. They explained it would be a ‘3’ for tri-color cars, but that has to be ‘59 & up. Never seen or heard of a tri-color ‘57.

EDIT:

Fella on the 57 site clarified;

“The 2 after the paint code is for the second formula for mixing the paint, "Coral sand" had 3 formula changers during the 57 model run.”

Interesting that they changed paint formulas. Wonder if that changed the shade as well? Learn something new everyday.

Interesting. We now have one one poster with a different position.

Now I also need to find a 1957 FORD PAINT COLOR CHART...

I think we see now why FORD changed the PATENT PLATE STYLE.

[KULTULZ]

PAINT CODE - 2 EXPLAINED

I fell for this interpretation -

SkylinerRon

RE; The 2 or 3 after the paint code.

The 2 denotes TuTone paint. 1st letter body color, 2nd top color.

The 3 denotes Styletone paint. 1st letter top and below the side trim, 2nd middle of body.

Ron

SOURCE - http://57fordsforever.com/smf/index....6.0#quickreply

This is the correct answer -

Lou

The 2 after the paint code is for the second formula for mixing the paint, "Coral sand" had 3 formula changers during the 57 model run.

The production code meant different things at different plants, at Dallas I believe it was a part of a dealer code, the full dealer code would have had the numbers for the sales district in front of them. The "C" meant the 3rd car in this order (A dealer got a discount on shipping if he ordered a truck load of cars at a time, a truck load being 4 cars or in some cases 5 cars .)

I thought it had to do with formulation but CRS is taking its ugly toll. - REFER TO POST #13 - (Covering My Butt)

TAKE NOTICE -

The production code meant different things at different plants

This may explain the many anomalies ( college word) among the plates.

Interesting subject and discussion.

[rotorwrench]

Without factory production code verification, those last digits with the C at the end are just a guess. FoMoCo didn't specifically have any transmission or rear axle information till mid 1957 after the April change to the plate format. A mechanic had to look at the differential for stamping or a tag to verify ratios. The Characteristics of the housing told the rest of the story on transmissions and rear axle.

A lot of Fords stampings meant something to the plant that produced it but the water gets muddy to anyone on the outside. I like to see proof positive but a lot of times there is none.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

Without factory production code verification, those last digits with the C at the end are just a guess. FoMoCo didn't specifically have any transmission or rear axle information till mid 1957 after the April change to the plate format.

That statement is not any more factual than my stating the TRANS-AXLE CODE(s) is included in the PRODUCTION CODE. It needs an IMO.

A mechanic had to look at the differential for stamping or a tag to verify ratios. The Characteristics of the housing told the rest of the story on transmissions and rear axle.

These tags were not that informativeon the early units, so from 1957 to 1962 the tag just referenced axle ratio. In 1963, Ford included more information.

Above text copied from here - https://www.diyford.com/ford-axle-hi...differentials/

A lot of Fords stampings meant something to the plant that produced it but the water gets muddy to anyone on the outside.

And that was most likely the reason FORD changed the format.

I like to see proof positive but a lot of times there is none.

I showed partial info. One needs to find FORD SOURCED cataloging before mid-1957 to understand fully the older system.

The PATENT PLATE info also varied between CAR LINES, PRODUCTION DATES and ASSEMBLY PLANTS. Without actual period FORD documentation, true verification cannot be established. But one can use common sense to cipher it out.

[dmsfrr]

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

Without factory production code verification, those last digits with the C at the end are just a guess. FoMoCo didn't specifically have any transmission or rear axle information till mid 1957 after the April change to the plate format. ...

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

That statement is not any more factual than my stating the TRANS-AXLE CODE(s) is included in the PRODUCTION CODE. ...

KULTULZ, Yes his statement is more factual. And is confirmed by the several examples from several sources that include specific descriptions of the 'Production Code' on the pre-April '57 style plate. Including one you provided, with the plate dated March '57. Attached below...

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by dmsfrr

KULTULZ, Yes his statement is more factual. And is confirmed by the several examples from several sources that include specific descriptions of the 'Production Code' on the pre-April '57 style plate. Including one you provided, with the plate dated March '57. Attached below...

You forgot to post IMO ...

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by dmsfrr

KULTULZ, Yes his statement is more factual. And is confirmed by the several examples from several sources that include specific descriptions of the 'Production Code' on the pre-April '57 style plate.

Including one you provided, with the plate dated March '57. Attached below...

Jim, it is Jim correct? Gary here -

The photo in question was a partial plate shown in an eBay ad describing (showing) early patent plate info. It had an accompanying photo that had a paragraph cut off that would most likely explain this whole thing. That is the info I am after. If I have to buy an old print CATALOG I will do it as it will also answer many more questions other than this one being discussed.

Not all is at it seems.

You have to understand FORD and BIRD were not identical and the BIRD restorers only show BIRD specific info. That have no interest in anything but the 55/57 BIRD.

[KULTULZ]

UPDATE - NEW INFO FOUND REGARDING POST #28 -

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

PAINT CODE - 2 EXPLAINED

1956 Ford Car Exterior Paint Colors

Single-Tone Colors Conventional Two-Tone Colors Style-

Tone Two-Tone Colors Spring Colors

This is from a 1956 FORD PAINT CHART. Whether 57 is the same I don't know yet but hopefully will.

CONV 2-TONE had to be a lower trim level than STYLE-TONE TWO-TONE -

STYLE-TONE had two separate and distinctive paint applications/formats (See 1957 FORD EXT COLOR CHART within this thread)

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by yblock57

Howdy —

Trying to decode Dad's data plate. Searched around on here and google and all the data plate examples show the later production decoders. His was built in November '56 from what can tell. Getting hung up on the production code at the end... .it's not labeled like the later plates with 'Date' 'Trans' 'Axle'. Any help filling in the blanks appreciated!


Here's what I have;

D = 312 4v
7 = 1957
D = Dallas Plant
V = Victoria Body — Fairlane 500
130591 = 30,591th vehicle assembled
63A = Fairlane 500 Club Victoria
ZE = Coral Sand lower body/Colonial White upper body
2 = tu-tone?
L = Colonial Vinyl and Brown Tropical-Leaf or Brown Silver-Shadow Fabric
26L = 26th November
98 = ?
5 = 2.91:1 Axle?
C = Fordomatic (3-speed)?

OK, I found the 57 EXT COLOR CHART ...

Can you show a photo of the 57 as I don't want to post anything without being 100% positively sure as the natives are getting restless ...

This is getting as bad as trying to break the ENIGMA CODE ...

[yblock57]

Sure thing;
57_fairlane_500.jpg

[KULTULZ]

!!! DAMN !!!

I just asked for a photo. You didn't have to make me cry. That car is more beautiful than DOLLY PARTON.



Any who, the paint scheme is STYLE-TONE. I think the character 2 distinguishes it from the CONVENTIONAL TWO-TONE. Yours is what the one poster @ 57fordsforever described as THREE-TONE, but actually is TWO-TONE applied in a different format.

More info and PAINT CHART is here - http://jerrysclassiccars.com/1957_ford_paint_codes.html

I am waiting for some early info and as I figure it our, I will update this thread.

You tell your daddy I said he has class ...

[Late model]

This may add to the solution, or confusion. I believe this is the original published version of the 1957 Ford serial plate.
It's from my original 1955-1956-1957 Ford Parts manual Form 7516, printed September 1956, or earlier. It’s not uncommon for manufacturers to release Service and Parts manuals even before the first piece of equipment goes down the line.
This plate definitely is different from Y Block57A’s plate. It has 8 patent numbers instead of the 14 in his plate and there are a number of other differences between the plates including 985C vs the 47 in the last part of the production code.
It could very well be a 56 plate reworked for a pic to get the manual out to the dealers.

Don

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by Late model

This may add to the solution, or confusion. I believe this is the original published version of the 1957 Ford serial plate.

It's from my original 1955-1956-1957 Ford Parts manual Form 7516, printed September 1956, or earlier.

It’s not uncommon for manufacturers to release Service and Parts manuals even before the first piece of equipment goes down the line.

This plate definitely is different from Y Block57A’s plate. It has 8 patent numbers instead of the 14 in his plate and there are a number of other differences between the plates including 985C vs the 47 in the last part of the production code.

It could very well be a 56 plate reworked for a pic to get the manual out to the dealers.

Don

THANX for the plate info.

The troubles seems to lie in the ASSEMBLY PLANT(s) using different coding on the same plate style. The one you show (FORD CATALOGING) shows a plate from DEARBORN ASSY. You can plainly see the difference(s) between this plate and the one being discussed, DALLAS ASSY.

I have captured several plates and all of the examples I have from a limited number of ASSY PLANTS shows different coding style for each.

It's from my original 1955-1956-1957 Ford Parts manual Form 7516, printed September 1956, or earlier.

It’s not uncommon for manufacturers to release Service and Parts manuals even before the first piece of equipment goes down the line.

You're correct in the printing date and its showing an early 57 PLATE. FORD even issued PRELIMINARY WSM's as some dealers got early delivery.

Now, how much for your catalog? ...

FORGOT- (as usual)

Is the CATALOG bound or loose leaf?

[KULTULZ]

TRUE TRI-TONE

SHOWN ON 1958 EDSEL

SOURCE - www.edsel.com