Ontario VIN-number font style 1932

[Lidstrom]

Hello,

I was wondering if anyone can confirm the VIN-number font style on 1932 Ford’s manufactured in Ontario Canada?

As we know the Ford VIN font style changed (or at least was supposed to change) from ~1931. Obviously everyone did not get that memo, did not know where to get the stamps or just didn’t take the memo seriously.

So, Was the 1, 6 and 9 stamp replaced in the Canadian Ontario factory for the -32 model or did they continue stamp their frame rails with the old conventional looking numbers?

I’m also curious if they used the straight dash between the numbers or the double arrow type.

One last question: when looking at the small amount available pictures of factory frame VIN’s I get the impression that the number 8 stamp looks totally different in the beginning of the VIN from the ones stamped in the end? The first eight (ex. *C18- ) looks like a “snowman” in shape and 8’s stamped after the dash looks more uniformed in top and bottom and perhaps even a bit smaller in size? I’ve not seen the nr. 8-shape mentioned or discussed anywhere so I’m a bit curious about that.

Thanks for all your help.

[motordr]

Most Canadian 1932 frames did not have any serial numbers stamped anywhere on them.

[Lidstrom]

Originally Posted by motordr

Most Canadian 1932 frames did not have any serial numbers stamped anywhere on them.

Hello and thank you for your reply.

Oh, that was entirely new to me and very unexpected.
So the frame rails was totally blank with no VIN/Identification at all?

Did they only rely on engine number or body mounted VIN-plate for registration or what?

My frame has been massively repaired and I’m about to take it to a certified shop to have the VIN replaced and the identity documented/verified, a must to be able to complete registration and put it back into traffic. But because this is a restoration I would like it to be accordingly to what size/fonts that was actually used during in this era. But if there was no actual “standard” it feels unnecessary to order punch stamps for ~$400 if it’s not “correct” to what Ontario used.

[DavidG]

With respect, given that over 26,000 Canadian '32 chassis were produced, one would have had to have seen at least 1,300 of their frames in order to have a statistically valid sample size to state that "most" do not have stamped engine numbers (VINs). I've seen a fair number of them, but I can't recall one of them being without the engine number on the frame. Those that I've seen are far fewer than 1,300, so my observations are equally invalid in terms of statistical sampling.

[rotorwrench]

Canada had different VIN procedures. They used an alpha prefix after the CB or C18 followed by four number digits. When they reached 9999, they changed the alpha prefix letter. This site shows how they went. The first few years of the V8 were a bit different in the numerical sequence but by 1937, it followed that course pretty well after dropping the C18.
http://www.wnyrg.org/canvins.html

[Lidstrom]

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Originally Posted by rotorwrench

Canada had different VIN procedures. They used an alpha prefix after the CB or C18 followed by four number digits. When they reached 9999, they changed the alpha prefix letter. This site shows how they went. The first few year of the V8 were a bit different in the numerical sequence but by 1937, it followed that course pretty well after dropping the C18.
http://www.wnyrg.org/canvins.html

Yes that is very correct.
My vehicle begins with C18-D****

[DavidG]

C18R was used as the prefix after C18D-9,999 for '32 V8s and CBG was used for Canadian fours.

[Lidstrom]

Hopefully someone with an Ontario built car from this era sees this thread and can spread some light on the subject and questions in my first post. Else I will just get the old-style punches incl. star (which is much cheaper without the special characters 1, 6, 9 and/or <->) and let the shop use those. I guess at least that looks better and is more “accurate” than their standard punch tool set they use.

[DavidG]

I've one with the engine number stamped on the left side frame rail, but unfortunately for your purposes it contains only one of the numbers in question. It is 1, which is the old style.

[JSeery]

From my experience it would be difficult to be 100% sure a frame did not have a serial number stamped on them. I have seen a lot of frames you would sware were not marked, but with enough effort the numbers could be raised.

[Lidstrom]

Originally Posted by DavidG

I've one with the engine number stamped on the left side frame rail, but unfortunately for your purposes it contains only one of the numbers in question. It is 1, which is the old style.

Well perhaps that at least gives an strong indication Ontario did not replace the number punches. What year is your car?

How about the dash, is it straight simple line (-) or the double arrow type (<->)?

Also, have you noticed any different style used of the Nr. 8 before and after the dash? This is nothing that affects my case at all but I got interested for more knowledge when digging around. When ordering those Ford retro-stamps available online I notice there is only one 8 font style. I can definitely be totally wrong about this, but I get the feeling that the first digits (ex. 18-) before the dash was pre-stamped and the rest of them incl. the front and rear star is punched later down the assembly line.

[Lidstrom]

Got reply on another forum from a owner that had *C18<->R....*

So a -32 built in Canada, and assembled a little bit later than mine which is very good.
Of what I could see on the photo the “old style font” was still being used, and also very interesting the double arrow dash was also used.

I’m waiting for him to confirm if he has any 1,6 or 9’s in the last digits and what style they have.

[DavidG]

It's highly unlikely that the prefixes, be they V8 or four-cylinder were stamped ahead of the digits for the actual engine number as there was no difference between the frames for V8s and fours.


My example above has a simple dash between the prefix and the rest of the number. It is a '33 four.

[Lidstrom]

Originally Posted by DavidG

It's highly unlikely that the prefixes, be they V8 or four-cylinder were stamped ahead of the digits for the actual engine number as there was no difference between the frames for V8s and fours.


My example above has a simple dash between the prefix and the rest of the number. It is a '33 four.

Yes you are correct, that’s very unlikely.

In the photo posted on the other forum the No. 8 also didn’t look much different.
The top circle was a little bit smaller than the bottom circle but not as extreme in size difference than I imagined from looking at other pictures. In fact I believe from looking at his picture the 8 in his VIN was punched upside down.

[Lidstrom]

This is the picture posted on the other forum from a New Zealand member.
My understanding is that many/most? Fords imported to Australia and New Zealand came from Canada and same as mine he’s VIN also has the Canadian C in the beginning.

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/mobile...cdfe7f2ee7.jpg

[DavidG]

In those days Ford of Canada was the source for vehicles and components for all of the Commonwealth countries except the U.K. In the case of Australia, the bodies were made locally and only the V8 engines came from Canada (the four-cylinder engines came from Ford Motor Company, Limited [England]), which used blocks of engine numbers assigned from Dearborn with the same prefixes as used in the U.S.

[Lidstrom]

Aah, very interesting! I like learning stuff.
So the Australian frames, were they locally produces as well?
Thinking about why they also used the “C” marking on the frames in that case.

(Never mind that question, of course the frames got that marking if the engines had them).

Do you know anything about the production in Denmark as well?
I think it’s interesting my car was imported from Canada in the early 40’s when the model was manufactured and/or assembled in our very close neighbor country.

Oooor, did they also get their engines from Canada?

[DavidG]

While you do not indicate your country, given the dating and your abbreviated name, I assume that you are posing these questions in a Swedish context.


You the state the "early 40's" which I assume is an error as Canada was at war and Ford of Canada was not producing any passenger cars during that period. Denmark was an occupied country and Ford of Denmark, which was a subsidiary of Ford Motor Company, Limited (England) was certainly not producing any passenger cars. If your dating is not in error the perhaps you are referring to a used car produced prior to 1939 and imported into Sweden in the 1940s.

[Lidstrom]

Yes your are totally correct in your observations.
I’m located in Sweden, that’s also why there is a lot of Swenglish and bad grammar.
With early 40’s I meant the car was first registered for use in Sweden in the beginning of 1940. That’s as far back the Swedish paper trail goes. The title is “Ford Cabriolet” year 1932.

[DavidG]

Given that additional information, it is most probable that your cabriolet was imported into Sweden from Canada in completely built up form, just like the one that my friend Leif Fredriksson's father had.