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Old 11-04-2020, 10:07 PM   #1
325w
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Default Fond these in an attic

Found several boxes of thes in an attic of a recently purchased house. Is their any value to them.
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Old 11-04-2020, 11:00 PM   #2
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Default Re: Fond these in an attic

Yes they have value. Someone will want them.
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Old 11-05-2020, 07:57 AM   #3
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Default Re: Fond these in an attic

Do not shine them up, .03' s are where it's at plus os rod dia make these quite valuable.
Unless the elements got to them somehow I'd price at $50 per box. I'm an 8BA guy but I'm tempted....true unobtainium. To verify I would mike each shell to be sure what is in the box is what it says on the box.

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Old 11-05-2020, 08:12 AM   #4
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Default Re: Fond these in an attic

Yes, I use that type of bearings, but not that size.
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Old 11-05-2020, 09:07 AM   #5
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Default Re: Fond these in an attic

I used to use a lot of full-floater bearings with 91A/21A rods . . . these are not particularly rare or used by many folks. The reason is the oversize on the rods - I usually run STD on the rod size. What condition are the bearings in and how many boxes do you have?
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Old 11-05-2020, 12:22 PM   #6
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When checking them over you shouldn't get oils/acids from your fingers on them as it may cause corrosion.
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Old 11-05-2020, 05:37 PM   #7
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Default Re: Fond these in an attic

I have seen many of these new but old stock bearings sadly lots of them have the bearing surface eaten away from the covering material used way back then to protect that surface. Looking them over to see the condition would be a good idea.
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Old 11-05-2020, 08:33 PM   #8
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Default Re: Fond these in an attic

Charlie NY would be a guy that would know! And Ronnie's advice is pretty much key here.
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Old 11-06-2020, 12:11 AM   #9
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For Info: These are bearings designed to be used with what were originally Ford 221 cubic inch engines - from about 1939 to 1942. These 221 cubic inch engines used a smaller rod journal size than the Mercury or most industrial WWII engines of that era (which were 239 cubic inches and used 29A rods and 2.138 full-floating bearings).

All connecting rods in those years used "full floating" bearings - where the bearings rotated/floated in BOTH the rod and the crank journal - in other words they were not "tanged" to hold the rod-bearings stationary in the rod. So, this meant that the inside of the big-end of the rod was a floating bearing surface - just like the crankshaft journal. It was critical that the bearing was setup to easily "float/spin" on both the rod big-end bore and on the crank . . . hence the name "full floater" bearings.

Where these 81A bearings became popular was NOT in racing applications for the 221 Ford, but when the late 49-53 Mercury engines came out with a 4.00" stroke crankshaft (with the larger 2.138 journal size). The old flathead hotrodders came up with an easy way to create a "stroker" motor - without having to weld-up a crankshaft or have a custom billet one made.

The "hot ticket" back in the day was to take a 49-53 4.00" stroke Mercury crank and have it "offset ground" to increase the stroke to 4.125" - and you did this by reducing the size of the journal to approximately 2.00 inches - but also moving the journal centerline further OUT in the stroke. You now took a 4.00" stroke crank and made it into a 4.125" stroke crankshaft.

Then, you used the old 221 cubic inch Ford 91A/21A rods and the 81A bearings for the smaller journal. For the original full-floater bearings to correctly "float/spin", one has to hand-fit them to the specific rods and crankshaft . . . not many folks know how to do this these days. But, back in the day, this combination of the early rods, the smaller journals, the stroked crankshaft and the full-floater bearings were what dang near ALL the serious race engine builders ran . . .

Today, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to invest in 91A/21A rods, rebuild them and then run full-floater bearings . . . as the end combination will probably cost just as much as running a new set of SCAT/EAGLE H-Beam rods and modern Buick insert bearings.

So, sadly for old goats like me . . . you won't see many full-floater stroker motors being built . . . except by a few of us that still love to build stuff like it was . . . "back in the day".

So there yah go . . . a little babble about the ole days of flathead lore . . .

Last edited by Bored&Stroked; 11-06-2020 at 12:18 AM.
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Old 11-06-2020, 05:43 AM   #10
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Default Re: Fond these in an attic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bored&Stroked View Post
For Info: These are bearings designed to be used with what were originally Ford 221 cubic inch engines - from about 1939 to 1942. These 221 cubic inch engines used a smaller rod journal size than the Mercury or most industrial WWII engines of that era (which were 239 cubic inches and used 29A rods and 2.138 full-floating bearings).

All connecting rods in those years used "full floating" bearings - where the bearings rotated/floated in BOTH the rod and the crank journal - in other words they were not "tanged" to hold the rod-bearings stationary in the rod. So, this meant that the inside of the big-end of the rod was a floating bearing surface - just like the crankshaft journal. It was critical that the bearing was setup to easily "float/spin" on both the rod big-end bore and on the crank . . . hence the name "full floater" bearings.

Where these 81A bearings became popular was NOT in racing applications for the 221 Ford, but when the late 49-53 Mercury engines came out with a 4.00" stroke crankshaft (with the larger 2.138 journal size). The old flathead hotrodders came up with an easy way to create a "stroker" motor - without having to weld-up a crankshaft or have a custom billet one made.

The "hot ticket" back in the day was to take a 49-53 4.00" stroke Mercury crank and have it "offset ground" to increase the stroke to 4.125" - and you did this by reducing the size of the journal to approximately 2.00 inches - but also moving the journal centerline further OUT in the stroke. You now took a 4.00" stroke crank and made it into a 4.125" stroke crankshaft.

Then, you used the old 221 cubic inch Ford 91A/21A rods and the 81A bearings for the smaller journal. For the original full-floater bearings to correctly "float/spin", one has to hand-fit them to the specific rods and crankshaft . . . not many folks know how to do this these days. But, back in the day, this combination of the early rods, the smaller journals, the stroked crankshaft and the full-floater bearings were what dang near ALL the serious race engine builders ran . . .

Today, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to invest in 91A/21A rods, rebuild them and then run full-floater bearings . . . as the end combination will probably cost just as much as running a new set of SCAT/EAGLE H-Beam rods and modern Buick insert bearings.

So, sadly for old goats like me . . . you won't see many full-floater stroker motors being built . . . except by a few of us that still love to build stuff like it was . . . "back in the day".

So there yah go . . . a little babble about the ole days of flathead lore . . .

Dale what were guys doing back them for pistons on a 4.125 stroke. I know nowadays a simple phone call to Egge or such resolves that issue, but what about back then?
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Old 11-06-2020, 05:46 AM   #11
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Default Re: Fond these in an attic

I still use the floaters ,even in my276 eng with 2.139 journals, they are great bearings and long lasting.
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Old 11-06-2020, 09:25 PM   #12
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Dale what were guys doing back them for pistons on a 4.125 stroke. I know nowadays a simple phone call to Egge or such resolves that issue, but what about back then?
There were a couple methods:

1) Companies like Jahn's, J&E (which used to be Jahn's) and Art Spark's ForgedTrue all made stroker pistons in the 50's for these combinations. I used to always run Jahns cast 3-ring pistons . . . and Grant rings . . . seemed that everybody ran these. The modern Ross forged piston is pretty much a spitting image of the original ForgedTrue design . . . though the ForgedTrue pistons were a bit lighter (really nice piston).

2) Another option was to run 4.00" stroke pistons and allow the piston to "pop up" 1/16 of an inch and then have the chambers in the heads reworked to move the chamber UP to allow for the pop-up piston. I've seen a few of these situations - but not a whole lot. My bet is in most cases they figured out the heads wouldn't fit and only then decided to have the heads "fixed".

Note: On using 4.00" stroke pistons - you better not have a "relieved" block as the top-ring will probably be too close too or actually showing in the relief - not good. Also, one really wants the top-ring to be where it is supposed to be (in relation to the dome) as too much heat into it (if too close) tends to damage the ring. So - you should really use the CORRECT pistons for the crankshaft stroke you're using.

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Old 11-07-2020, 08:33 AM   #13
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Default Re: Fond these in an attic

Great info
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Old 11-07-2020, 10:51 AM   #14
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I still use the floaters ,even in my276 eng with 2.139 journals, they are great bearings and long lasting.
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