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Old 07-03-2014, 07:22 PM   #1
Craig E. Luton
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Default Hydraulic brakes on a 36 pickup

Back in 2002 I had my son-in-law install hydraulic brakes on my 36 pickup. So far we had to rebuild the brake cylinders one time and replaced them twice. I am on the second master cylinder now. Dot 5 brake fluid was used in the system. The truck sits through the winter because of the cold and snow. The last time I drove the truck the brakes went out instantly while I was driving home.
Any ideas on the problem? Could the dot 5 brake fluid be a problem?
Thank you
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Old 07-03-2014, 09:55 PM   #2
alanwoodieman
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Default Re: Hydraulic brakes on a 36 pickup

dot 5 is great, been in my 40 wagon since 1992, but there can be problems-it is super slick, has very little viscosity (small molecules) will leak just about everywhere unless new copper "o" rings are installed, just rebuilt master cylinder more for my peace of mind than anything else-slight wear on the cup and NO rust anywhere--what caused all od your problems-did you use repro brake cylinders-where did you get them? answer a few more questions and maybe we can help you find the problem
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Old 07-03-2014, 10:00 PM   #3
Charlie Stephens
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Default Re: Hydraulic brakes on a 36 pickup

A little more detail on "the brakes went out instantly" might help. Did you blow a line and spring a leak with fluid all over. Did the pin fall out of some of your linkage? Did you push on the pedal and it was solid and didn't move? I have run Dot 5 fluid in my '32 roadster since 1985 and have been happy with it. I must admit it was a problem at first to get it to stop leaking.

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Old 07-04-2014, 09:02 AM   #4
George/Maine
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Default Re: Hydraulic brakes on a 36 pickup

Some times the new lining are to long.
The check this pull the drums and measure from 3 to 9 o'clock should be close to ID of drum.
If you adjust the shoes out 1/8 less then drum and can't put the drum on most likely
the ends of shoes are to long. Grind on angle till drums go on. Say 1/2" from first rivet.
If this is the case the cylinders can't return to closed position. And will leak.
because the pistons are out to far.
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Old 07-04-2014, 09:08 AM   #5
DICK SPADARO
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Default Re: Hydraulic brakes on a 36 pickup

A couple things about wheel cylinder issues is poor wheel cylinder design or cracked outer seals and if the vehicle was driven in wet before storage and moisture is trapped in the brake area. Next is if the vehicle is stored in a damp building or on dirt floor it is a good idea to place a plastic tarp on the floor and drive the vehicle over it. This acts to block any humidity moisture from being trapped under the vehicle and finding its way to brake fluid.
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Old 07-04-2014, 11:58 AM   #6
Craig E. Luton
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Default Re: Hydraulic brakes on a 36 pickup

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I said it was 02 that the hydraulic brakes were installed but after checking my receipts it was 03 that they were installed.
Alan, I purchased the master and brake cylinders the first time from C&G, I don’t know if they were American or Foreign made.
Charlie, "the brakes went out instantly" I drove the truck to my neighbors a little over ½ mile away, stopped and parked the truck. When we left, I pushed the brake pedal and it went all the way to the floor.My son-in-law inspected it and told me that the master cylinder was leaking. I purchased another master cylinder form Mac’s (American made). The last wheel cylinder I purchased was from Napa and it was foreign made. My tires were/are soaked in brake fluid.
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Old 07-04-2014, 12:46 PM   #7
JSeery
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Default Re: Hydraulic brakes on a 36 pickup

The master cylinder and wheel cylinders themselves (the casting) are probably fine if you could find some good quality rubber cups and seals to rebuild them with. We always rebuilt the brake parts back in the 50s and 60s, but quality rebuild parts are now harder to find (at least as far as I know).
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Old 07-04-2014, 12:56 PM   #8
Kevin in NJ
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Default Re: Hydraulic brakes on a 36 pickup

Did you save all your original parts?
By late 36 the mechanical brakes were a thing of beauty.

Depending on your climate you have no hope of keeping your juice brakes working year to year. We (my family) used to own a 39 Ford with 40,000 miles and all original.

Every year or so something would mess up with the brakes. We tried everything (except the only cure I now know of) from all NOS parts to silicon fluid. No matter what something messed up in the rear wheels.

We did not drive it in the winter. Really we did not drive enough. We live in southern NJ and tend to experience wide temperature variations. This sets up the brakes to be able to push fluid through relaxed seals ( the modern drum brakes have a check ball for a reason) as the temps change. The same principle you get with wood drums making whiskey. This causes the fluid to suck moisture and dirt and because they are not used they do not get to clean themselves.

Do not feel bad this applies to all cars with drum brakes that are not driven enough. One year my 65 Mustang mucked up a rear cylinder and it got me thinking. So, I made the mistake of asking a bunch of car owners at a car show. I found about 1/2 the cars there likely had one or more wheels with non-functioning brakes. Several owners knew and had not done anything about it for years. Needless to say I have decied it is best to let other antique cars in front of you.

Saddly many wrongly believe that they need juice brakes to stop. The rod based mechancial brakes are equal to juice brakes in stopping power- When they are properly rebuilt. They are safer then juice brakes because you can expect decades of flawless operation with rare adjustments to account for wear. My brothers 31 coupe has 40 years of continuous operation on his brakes.

The only cure for juice brakes is frequent driving of the car. That means at least once a month year round. Anything less and you are asking for failure.
I will also say if you keep the temps constant on the car you should be good to go. I know of a very wealthy guy (the guy who runs Carlisle) and he has his vett collection in a temp controlled garage and he never has any problems with his brakes.

If you take time to look at the V8 service bulletins you will see the late 36 brakes system was the best mechanical system produced. They had moved to a full floating system with wedges front and rear. With drums that are in tolerance and shoes properly ground to the drums you can expect excellent stopping with no worries about failures (assuming you did not forget a cotter pin somewhere).

If you are going to insist on keeping your juice brakes you ought to seriously consider switching to a dual master cylinder so you do not get a total loss of brakes.

Your real safety and reliablity will be with the original brakes using the last version of brake adjuster hardware for full floating shoes.
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Old 07-04-2014, 02:57 PM   #9
Craig E. Luton
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Default Re: Hydraulic brakes on a 36 pickup

Kevin; I am in Montana in the Rocky Mountains, very dry here with long cold winters. Craig
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