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01-08-2015, 09:53 AM | #1 |
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Master cylinder conversion
Guys-
I am in the process of converting a '36 to hydraulic brakes. I have been using floaters on the brakes for some time but it seems like they have a constant demand for being adjusted which is no long "fun." While searching the archives I came across an excellent response to a question that "Mart" made in regards to a dual chamber m/c set-up: "If a supplier were to arrange a 1-1/16" dual cylinder with built in residual valves, nice easy to access reservoir and a three bolt fixing like the original, then kit it out with outlets so a 1/4 pipe would screw straight in, plus a port for the brake light switch then they would sell like hot cakes to the early ford squad." (7-28-14) Anyone ever find something close or possibly a "workable" 1-1/16" m/c like Mart suggested? Thanks Tom |
01-08-2015, 10:07 AM | #2 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
I'm not sure you can find a dual MC with the 1 1/16 bore. They do make an adapter that goes from 3 bolt to 2 bolt for the 39 pedal assemble ,so you can use the dual MC. It moves the MC back about 3/4". There are adapters that will screw into the MC that will allow the 1/4" lines. Some dual cylinders have residual valves and some do not. It would take some research and a parts house with some knowledgeable people willing to help to find a cylinder with the correct specifications to use with the adapter.
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01-08-2015, 10:55 AM | #3 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
Hi all; I ran across a old Ford with a dual master cyl and the big 5/16' tubing ports. It was a drum/drum early '60s Cadillac. We found a new/ rebuilt one in the NAPA catalog, and it all worked great. Newc
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01-08-2015, 11:15 AM | #4 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
Tom,
I recently went through this. The only 1 1/16" mc I found was from Wilwood. Unfortunately, it just didn't move enough fluid to work correctly and I ended up using a 1 1/8" one from Summit. When I say 'correctly', I spent a lot of time studying how a mc works and what is SUPPOSED to happen if one circuit fails. So, while the 1 1/6" mc worked OK under normal circumstances, it would NOT work in the event of a failure of either front or rear brakes. There was just not enough pedal travel in my '36. IMO, I think the 1 1/8" one works great. The pedal effort/travel is fine for me. But Mart is correct. Plumbing is a nightmare all to itself. I spent a lot of time on the Net and at the local parts houses trying to get all the fittings I needed. It was not fun. Heard
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01-08-2015, 02:33 PM | #5 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
Drum/drum Mustang works for me. It's not an easy 10 second swap, and requires some adapters for the 1/4" lines, but it works very well.
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01-08-2015, 04:30 PM | #6 | |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
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Quote:
So when you get it all built ie " smaller MC. adapter plate, and pluming fittings made " please send all info with drawings in detail, and all parts numbers..ect...... thanks ..........OLD...........BILL |
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01-08-2015, 06:34 PM | #7 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
Plus 1 for Mustang MC. Drum Drum and built in residual pressure valves.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/DH...n/?prefilter=1 |
01-08-2015, 08:15 PM | #8 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
John-
Thanks for the reply. Looking over the Summit web site you referred to brings up a question. The ports appear to be on what would be the inboard side. Is there a model that has the posts on the other side? If not, how did you hook-up the brake tubing? In my situation the brake lines will be on the outboard side (frame side) of the car. Again, thanks for the quick reply. Tom |
01-08-2015, 08:18 PM | #9 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
I used the Mustang Drum Drum on 2 of my projects, my 30Model coupe and my dragster, just make sure the leverage linkage that moves the rod to MC is short, If you have to long a linkage you'll have to push the pedal harder. Walt
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01-09-2015, 03:59 PM | #10 | |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
Quote:
I fitted a 1" dual master on my truck, this being the mustang size that's ment to be the ticket. Pedal travel was to much for my liking. When fiddling with it I cracked open the union to the rear brakes to see what would happen in a leak on one circuit situation, well the pedal went almost to the floor! Not good, has any one else tried this? It appeared to me that as I thought, that mustang one is to Small. And if they all travel this far some cars are basically gonna be left with no brakes when one circuit leaks. I say some as a lot of hotrods don't have the same amount of travel available on the pedal. What's on mine now? A stock Ford single master, bolts in easy, plumbs easy, bleeds easy, looks right has the correct size bore, pedal travel is like I like them, about 1 1/2". If it fails, the hand brake (e brake) is spot on and works great. Better than rely on some thing that won't actually work when you most need it. Martin. |
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01-09-2015, 04:33 PM | #11 | ||
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
Quote:
Quote:
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01-08-2015, 11:05 AM | #12 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
Newc - like this one? 1962-66 Cadillac Master Cylinder
http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/more...564&cc=1320297 https://www.opgi.com/cadillac/CE10703/ http://www.summitracing.com/parts/dh.../make/cadillac Last edited by Tinker; 01-08-2015 at 11:12 AM. |
01-09-2015, 12:29 AM | #13 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
Use a 1967 Mustang cyl. drum drum.
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01-09-2015, 08:46 AM | #14 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
That's what I use, the 67 Mustang. Need to watch, they come both drum/drum and disc/drum.
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01-09-2015, 03:00 PM | #15 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
10-1373 is a 1" bore drum/drum master similar to the Mustang; but with the ports on the opposite side.
Should use 1/4" lines too; not the 3/16" lines that are in the picture. |
01-09-2015, 03:07 PM | #16 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
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01-10-2015, 12:41 AM | #17 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
While the application pressure ends up equal with either size lines, the 1/4" lines flow more during application and release. Not so fussy with discs; but more so with drums.
Look how they plumbed production cars before they went to diagonal split or four disc set-ups. 1/4" main lines feeding into 3/16" branches. Early Ford Lockheeds really like 1/4" all the way just the way Henry built them. |
01-09-2015, 03:07 PM | #18 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
Good info rich! The only thing to possibly be careful of with a 1" bore in this case is the fact that it's going to require a longer pedal stroke to displace an equal volume of fluid as that displaced by a 1-1/16" bore, especially if one side of the cylinder ever fails. That can be a problem with the pedal geometry in these old Fords. Just sayin'! DD
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01-10-2015, 07:44 PM | #19 | |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
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01-09-2015, 03:12 PM | #20 |
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Re: Master cylinder conversion
I just helped a friend change out the brakes and master cylinder on his 45 pickup. He now has F-100 brakes all around. We used a 1" bore dual cylinder. I hope it will work. He is installing the fronts today.
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