The Ford Barn

rusted · 06-21-2018, 02:13 PM

Car has been setting for about 6 years. Grandson and I have been working on it and now trying to start it. If I open and close the points with my finger, spark every time. When I turn the key on and crank it with the starter, it sparks once and that is all. No spark when we hold the coil wire near a head bolt. Will a coil or condenser go bad from setting?

Bob C · 06-21-2018, 02:39 PM

Points could have corrosion from sitting that long, clean them.

Bob

ryanheacox · 06-21-2018, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob C

Points could have corrosion from sitting that long, clean them.

Bob

+1 Have to clean mine every year before getting it out for the season

Tom Endy · 06-21-2018, 02:56 PM

Another area where corrosion can form is at the stationary point block where the point screws into the block. I had a distributor that checked out with an ohm meter, but would not allow current to pass. When the stationary point was unscrewed the threads were found covered with corrosion.

Tom Endy

rusted · 06-21-2018, 03:28 PM

We cleaned the points. No different than before. Good spark opening and closing points with my finger. 6.25 on both sides of amp gauge and both sides of coil with key on. Grandson is learning troubleshooting and how to scratch his head in frustration.

chap52 · 06-21-2018, 04:00 PM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

rotor?

rusted · 06-21-2018, 04:37 PM

Why am I not getting spark from the coil wire to a head bolt? with the key on, 6.25 volts on each side of the coil. We may just take the distributor out and clean everything as Tom suggested.

GRutter · 06-21-2018, 04:42 PM

Check Point Gap.
When you open with your finger, you are opening more than the cam will move the points.
It might be that the cam is not opening the points, therefore no spark. I would think that if you can generate spark by manually opening the points, the problem is in your distributor. Also check rotor and be sure that the spring is making contact with the button on the distributor cap.
Good luck with your diagnotstics

Tom Endy · 06-21-2018, 05:41 PM

What I think I am understanding is that you are getting a spark at the points, but not from the high tension lead. The fact that there is a spark at the points means that the primary of the coil is intact. If you are not getting a spark at the high tension lead it means the problem is in the secondary of the coil. Try a known good coil.

Tom Endy

rusted · 06-21-2018, 06:11 PM

Tom, will coils go bad from not being used? As soon as I can get a good coil I will try it. Are all 6 volt coils the same or do I need one from one of our vendors? By the way, the grandson cannot believe that smarter people than grampa , from all over the country can help get this thing running.

Corley · 06-21-2018, 06:19 PM

Just to be clear, where are you seeing a spark? If at the points only, then you probably have a bad coil. If from the high tension coil wire to a head bolt, I'd go for the condenser. It's probably neither, but those are good guesses. Do the points perhaps bind and not make/break reliably? Are they adjusted properly?

Chuck Sea/Tac · 06-21-2018, 06:26 PM

Intermittent spark can also be from a bad or weak spring connection on the post the point swivel on.

rusted · 06-21-2018, 09:19 PM

Corley, I am getting spark at the points when I open and let them close with my finger. If I turn the key on, the first time the points open when being turned with the starter, I only get one spark and no more. I can see the points open and close, they are set at 20 thousand and clean. I cannot get spark from the coil wire to a head bolt. I got another coil tonight and will try it in the morning. The grandson now knows how the points and spark to the plugs work. He is learning!

w.michael · 06-21-2018, 11:06 PM

A weak, failing battery will do this. The battery seems OK because it will turn the engine over with the starter, but there is not enough juice left to power the ignition. Try turning the engine over with the crank instead of the starter, with the switch on, and see if you get a good spark from the coil wire.

W. Michael

Tom Wesenberg · 06-22-2018, 12:00 AM

My 28 Model A did the same thing after being parked during 6 weeks of wet and humid weather. Good spark at coil wire when I opened the points by hand. I cleaned the points several times and still had good spark at coil wire when opening the points by hand, but no spark when the starter spun the engine. I hand cranked it, and it fired right up on the first pull. After it ran a couple minutes, everything was fine.

rusted · 06-22-2018, 07:48 AM

We installed a new battery.getting a good hot spark at the points but not the coil wire. Going to put the new coil in today.

Corley · 06-22-2018, 08:06 AM

You will fix it, you are within 2' of the problem. Good luck!

rusted · 06-22-2018, 11:50 AM

We will let you know what the problem was WHEN we find it. We won't give up!

rusted · 06-23-2018, 11:03 AM

GREAT NEWS! Put a new coil on and as soon as I turned the key on we seen a jump in the amp gauge that we hadn't seen before. Stepped on starter and in 8 to 10 revolutions she fired right up. The grandson cannot wait for his first driving lesson. Thank you for all your help in finding the problem.

SDJason · 06-23-2018, 11:09 AM

Just curious - any idea how old the coil was?

rusted · 06-23-2018, 07:01 PM

I don't know how old the old coil was. I would guess at least 25-30 years.

SDJason · 06-23-2018, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rusted

I don't know how old the old coil was. I would guess at least 25-30 years.

Thanks; I was curious because I had a similar experience shortly after getting my car - replaced the coil, and the engine suddenly just started working like it should. I have no idea how old it was, but it definitely had a "patina" to it.

Tom Wesenberg · 06-24-2018, 10:55 AM

Age (unless they are in the weather) shouldn't cause a coil to fail. I'm still using my original 1928 coil.

DHZIEMAN · 06-25-2018, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rusted

Car has been setting for about 6 years. Grandson and I have been working on it and now trying to start it. If I open and close the points with my finger, spark every time. When I turn the key on and crank it with the starter, it sparks once and that is all. No spark when we hold the coil wire near a head bolt. Will a coil or condenser go bad from setting?

Take point file, (really small flat thin file) and do a couple of strokes between the points. If that does not solve the problem, you will need to further examine the problem as far as the distributor point plate and work out from there.

06-21-2018, 02:13 PM	#1
rusted Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 88	spark, but not in the right places Car has been setting for about 6 years. Grandson and I have been working on it and now trying to start it. If I open and close the points with my finger, spark every time. When I turn the key on and crank it with the starter, it sparks once and that is all. No spark when we hold the coil wire near a head bolt. Will a coil or condenser go bad from setting?

06-21-2018, 02:39 PM	#2
Bob C Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: So Cal Posts: 8,751	Re: spark, but not in the right places Points could have corrosion from sitting that long, clean them. Bob

06-21-2018, 02:56 PM	#4
Tom Endy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Southern California Posts: 3,131	Re: spark, but not in the right places Another area where corrosion can form is at the stationary point block where the point screws into the block. I had a distributor that checked out with an ohm meter, but would not allow current to pass. When the stationary point was unscrewed the threads were found covered with corrosion. Tom Endy

06-21-2018, 03:28 PM	#5
rusted Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 88	Re: spark, but not in the right places We cleaned the points. No different than before. Good spark opening and closing points with my finger. 6.25 on both sides of amp gauge and both sides of coil with key on. Grandson is learning troubleshooting and how to scratch his head in frustration.

06-21-2018, 04:00 PM	#6
chap52 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Marana Arizona Posts: 1,776	Re: spark, but not in the right places Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) rotor?

06-21-2018, 04:37 PM	#7
rusted Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 88	Re: spark, but not in the right places Why am I not getting spark from the coil wire to a head bolt? with the key on, 6.25 volts on each side of the coil. We may just take the distributor out and clean everything as Tom suggested.

06-21-2018, 04:42 PM	#8
GRutter Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Mint Hill, North Carolina Posts: 386	Re: spark, but not in the right places Check Point Gap. When you open with your finger, you are opening more than the cam will move the points. It might be that the cam is not opening the points, therefore no spark. I would think that if you can generate spark by manually opening the points, the problem is in your distributor. Also check rotor and be sure that the spring is making contact with the button on the distributor cap. Good luck with your diagnotstics

06-21-2018, 05:41 PM	#9
Tom Endy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Southern California Posts: 3,131	Re: spark, but not in the right places What I think I am understanding is that you are getting a spark at the points, but not from the high tension lead. The fact that there is a spark at the points means that the primary of the coil is intact. If you are not getting a spark at the high tension lead it means the problem is in the secondary of the coil. Try a known good coil. Tom Endy

06-21-2018, 06:11 PM	#10
rusted Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 88	Re: spark, but not in the right places Tom, will coils go bad from not being used? As soon as I can get a good coil I will try it. Are all 6 volt coils the same or do I need one from one of our vendors? By the way, the grandson cannot believe that smarter people than grampa , from all over the country can help get this thing running.

06-21-2018, 06:19 PM	#11
Corley Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Battle Ground WA Posts: 293	Re: spark, but not in the right places Just to be clear, where are you seeing a spark? If at the points only, then you probably have a bad coil. If from the high tension coil wire to a head bolt, I'd go for the condenser. It's probably neither, but those are good guesses. Do the points perhaps bind and not make/break reliably? Are they adjusted properly? __________________ Corley ----------------- Subscribed to the KISS principle!

06-21-2018, 06:26 PM	#12
Chuck Sea/Tac Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Between Seattle & Tacoma Posts: 2,354	Re: spark, but not in the right places Intermittent spark can also be from a bad or weak spring connection on the post the point swivel on.

06-21-2018, 09:19 PM	#13
rusted Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 88	Re: spark, but not in the right places Corley, I am getting spark at the points when I open and let them close with my finger. If I turn the key on, the first time the points open when being turned with the starter, I only get one spark and no more. I can see the points open and close, they are set at 20 thousand and clean. I cannot get spark from the coil wire to a head bolt. I got another coil tonight and will try it in the morning. The grandson now knows how the points and spark to the plugs work. He is learning!

06-21-2018, 11:06 PM	#14
w.michael Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: North Carolina Posts: 418	Re: spark, but not in the right places A weak, failing battery will do this. The battery seems OK because it will turn the engine over with the starter, but there is not enough juice left to power the ignition. Try turning the engine over with the crank instead of the starter, with the switch on, and see if you get a good spark from the coil wire. W. Michael

06-22-2018, 12:00 AM	#15
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: spark, but not in the right places My 28 Model A did the same thing after being parked during 6 weeks of wet and humid weather. Good spark at coil wire when I opened the points by hand. I cleaned the points several times and still had good spark at coil wire when opening the points by hand, but no spark when the starter spun the engine. I hand cranked it, and it fired right up on the first pull. After it ran a couple minutes, everything was fine.

06-22-2018, 07:48 AM	#16
rusted Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 88	Re: spark, but not in the right places We installed a new battery.getting a good hot spark at the points but not the coil wire. Going to put the new coil in today.

06-22-2018, 08:06 AM	#17
Corley Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Battle Ground WA Posts: 293	Re: spark, but not in the right places You will fix it, you are within 2' of the problem. Good luck! __________________ Corley ----------------- Subscribed to the KISS principle!

06-22-2018, 11:50 AM	#18
rusted Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 88	Re: spark, but not in the right places We will let you know what the problem was WHEN we find it. We won't give up!

06-23-2018, 11:03 AM	#19
rusted Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 88	Re: spark, but not in the right places GREAT NEWS! Put a new coil on and as soon as I turned the key on we seen a jump in the amp gauge that we hadn't seen before. Stepped on starter and in 8 to 10 revolutions she fired right up. The grandson cannot wait for his first driving lesson. Thank you for all your help in finding the problem.

06-23-2018, 11:09 AM	#20
SDJason Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 442	Re: spark, but not in the right places Just curious - any idea how old the coil was?

06-23-2018, 07:01 PM	#21
rusted Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 88	Re: spark, but not in the right places I don't know how old the old coil was. I would guess at least 25-30 years.

06-24-2018, 10:55 AM	#23
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: spark, but not in the right places Age (unless they are in the weather) shouldn't cause a coil to fail. I'm still using my original 1928 coil.