Flathead city, Gary Howard, Grants Pass, Or

[Bored&Stroked]

Originally Posted by 19Fordy

Obviously, Mr. Howard is a modern day horse thief.

He's lucky we aren't living in the 1800's with the justice system of the wild west.

Yeah - he'd have a bad case of "rope burn" around his skinny little neck, or he would die from "lead poisoning" - via a Winchester.

[V8COOPMAN]

Like I've said before, he has only one bad habit...…...BREATHING! DD

[tubman]

What's really depressing is that we have two threads going about two different crooks going on simultaneously. At least people have some places to go (here and the H.A.M.B.) to check these jerks out. I know that before I'd spend even a moderate amount of money with someone with whom I had no experience, I'd do a bunch of internet searches.

[Aarongriffey]

I’m in CA. About 10 years ago I tried to buy an 8 BA engine from a guy in Minnesota that is always selling old a Ford used stuff.
After he did nothing about shipping it and I called him a few times I called the credit card company, they got us all on the phone at once.
I had a choice of gettting my money back or the seller agreeing to send the motor. I got a credit right away. End of story.
A

[53F250]

Has anyone started legal proceedings on Flathead City?

[Paul Bennett]

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I sent an email to presidents of Oregon V8 clubs attempting to learn about legal actions but received no replies. Gary Howard owes me $4000. I was able to get $2250 returned from VISA uncontested by Howard. Shame as he could have provided engines just as easy as not. On my visits to Grants Pass, he did have engines in various states of build and apparently did provide a few people with engines, but not many. And not me.

[Tim Ayers]

Originally Posted by tubman

What's really depressing is that we have two threads going about two different crooks going on simultaneously. At least people have some places to go (here and the H.A.M.B.) to check these jerks out. I know that before I'd spend even a moderate amount of money with someone with whom I had no experience, I'd do a bunch of internet searches.

True.

[53F250]

So how do we get him shut down for good - or take possession of what in the shop?

[paul2748]

I wrote to the Oregon Attorney General about another vendor in Oregon that screwed me. He had his office visit the vendor and I got my money back. Contact that office, fraud division.

[frnkeore]

I have a little bit of a update on this. I was in GP last Sunday, talking to a guy that does automotive machine work. He knows Gary and has delt with him.

He said that it's been long know, in the GP area of his dishonesty and that he is no longer in business. From what I've read here, I suggested that maybe he took in peoples parts to work on and then sell them off. He did not disagree with me!

He doesn't know where Gary is but, knew that he had legal issues. So, I would suggest that people contact the State of Oregon and see if anyone can provide his lawyers name. You might even try a records search at the Josephine County Court, to see if you can find his attorney/s. But, I'm afraid that they may want to know where he is at, too!!

This guy is the second one that is in the automotive business that knew him, Gary bought stuff from both and neither had anything good to say about him.

I do hope that guys can find him but, I also fear he may monitor this forum and a private detective may be the only option.

[JSeery]

I would think if you have wanted too long on these type of issues it would be difficult to recover much. With numerous people out fairly large sums of money Gary most likely couldn't come up with it if he wanted to (which I doubt he would consider if he did have the money!).

[cas3]

and, just because you win a judgement in court, that doesnt necessarily mean you get your money. to collect, YOU have to hire the sheriff to go to the bank. then, no funds=no check for you.

[philipswanson]

Don't know about Oregon law but in CA, the sheriff will not go to the bank with you. You have to sue him again for not paying up. If he has a house, you can get a lien against it if he ever sells it. Other than that, you are probably out the money.

[deuce_roadster]

And unless you are a lawyer yourself, all this will cost you even more money.

[qmdv]

Originally Posted by deuce_roadster

And unless you are a lawyer yourself, all this will cost you even more money.

Oregon Small Claims court. 10,000 max and the statute of limitations is 6 years. No attorneys in small claims court. Just you and mr flathead builder.

California is the same but a bit different. Last time I did it was about 25 years ago. Other guy did not show up. I got a judgement against the guy. Recorded my judgment and filed liens. About 8 years later he tried to borrow against a motel he had in the Bay Area and my lien surfaced. Got judgment plus interest sent to me by the title company. In my case I did not have to leave town cus this is where we entered into the contract. Boy it felt so good to be victorious. Best part is they were pissed

[1952henry]

I was in the Crater Lake regional club when I lived in sw Oregon. Gary lived up the road from a member. He had a nice shop and assembled engines. Looked legit. Later this same member gave him engines parts etc. Many $$$ worth. Fellow needed something and got the full bill despite earlier generosity.
As far as a judgement, for a few $ you can have a lien filled with court clerk. That doesn't go away. If there is an estate, you are listed as a creditor. That was my experience as a landlord with a deadbeat renter. Renter declared bankruptcy and I got invited to participate in hearing. I sued a fellow for some property in small claims. Got a judgement, which was ignored. Filed a lien, and got satisfaction in a few days.

[qmdv]

Originally Posted by 1952henry

I was in the Crater Lake regional club when I lived in sw Oregon. Gary lived up the road from a member. He had a nice shop and assembled engines. Looked legit. Later this same member gave him engines parts etc. Many $$$ worth. Fellow needed something and got the full bill despite earlier generosity.
As far as a judgement, for a few $ you can have a lien filled with court clerk. That doesn't go away. If there is an estate, you are listed as a creditor. That was my experience as a landlord with a deadbeat renter. Renter declared bankruptcy and I got invited to participate in hearing. I sued a fellow for some property in small claims. Got a judgement, which was ignored. Filed a lien, and got satisfaction in a few days.

I doubt in this case (not honoring a contract) a lien would be enforceable without a judgment. If it were then I could file a lien against someone I do not even know. Gary may be a real jerk and dishonest as all get out but he is still guaranteed the opportunity to face his accuser and give his side of the story. My guess he would not show up and then you get that judgment. Then you file the lien. A paralegal can be a big help here.

[1952henry]

To be clear, in both cases I had a judgement. I hope you didn't infer that I didn't have judgements. I don't think you can randomly file liens anywhere.

[cas3]

in my life i have had 3 wins in court. each time you have to renew the judgement or a lien every seven years, or its gone. 1st no good bum i sent the sheriff twice, got nothing and figured out that bum would never amount to nothing in his life, so i wisely quit. 2nd bum i also sent the sheriff a couple times and got nothing, but finally about 5 years later he wanted a home loan, not available until i was paid. he offered me half what he owed, and at the wise advice of my lawyer "somethin is better than nothin" so i took it. bum #3 never paid a dime, and i have let it run out... dont care to worry about it. hopefully i have gotten smarter and there will be no #4. i have to add for fun, in all 3 cases the judge said "i find that mr swanson is a reliable witness, and mr --- is not. while you cant take that to the bank, i feel good with the memory

[tubman]

Originally Posted by cas3

in my life i have had 3 wins in court. each time you have to renew the judgement or a lien every seven years, or its gone. 1st no good bum i sent the sheriff twice, got nothing and figured out that bum would never amount to nothing in his life, so i wisely quit. 2nd bum i also sent the sheriff a couple times and got nothing, but finally about 5 years later he wanted a home loan, not available until i was paid. he offered me half what he owed, and at the wise advice of my lawyer "somethin is better than nothin" so i took it. bum #3 never paid a dime, and i have let it run out... dont care to worry about it. hopefully i have gotten smarter and there will be no #4. i have to add for fun, in all 3 cases the judge said "i find that mr swanson is a reliable witness, and mr --- is not. while you cant take that to the bank, i feel good with the memory

"cas3" - This corresponds to my experiences 100%. It seems that the courts don't want to make a decision, but would rather "compromise" and make everyone unhappy. No wonder there are so many "Lawyer Jokes".