Sanity check on lubing springs in place

[alexiskai]

I want to try to improve ride and correct a slight lean by lubricating the springs without removing them. I know the "right" way is to take the springs out and check them, but I don't want to spend the time/money.

Since I haven't done this before, I was hoping somebody could take a look at this planned sequence and tell me if I'm missing anything or creating problems. I'm planning to do the whole sequence once for the front springs and once for the rear.

1. Detach shock arms and brake rods
2. Jack up the frame maybe a foot
3. Jack stands under the frame on both sides
4. Remove hanger nuts to detach the spring from the frame
5. Remove visible grime from spring leaves
6. Apply generous treatment of Kano Penephite, possibly using a screwdriver head to get between the leaves
7. Reinstall hanger nuts carefully using a torque wrench in a cross pattern
8. Lower everything back down
9. Install oiled spring cover (from Snyder's)
10. Reattach brake rods and shock arms (good time to check the shocks too)

Does this look OK? Any improvements?

[Brentwood Bob]

Where is the containment step in your sequence? C-clamps, or logging chain would do the job. I would do with step 4.

[alexiskai]

Originally Posted by Brentwood Bob

Where is the containment step in your sequence? C-clamps, or logging chain would do the job. I would do with step 4.

Do I need to clamp the springs even though I'm not taking them out of the spring perches?

[Bob Bidonde]

Don't take the springs apart.

> Have someone rock the car side-to-side and spray the springs on both sides with SAE 10 oil. Do this a few times after driving the car;

> Buy a set of spring covers and saturate the felt pads with 140 gear oil. Install the pads, and annually replenish the gear oil.

An immediate ride improvement can be had by reducing the rear tire pressures to 28 psig, and the front tire pressures to 30 psig.

[alexiskai]

There may be some confusion, I'm not planning to disassemble the springs. I'm just trying to lift the frame away from them slightly so that I can get up as close as possible to spray them with the lubricant. They're not coming off the axles.

I know there's a lot of cautionary tales out there about the stored energy in the springs, hence the recommendation of a spreader for the rear springs. What I'm trying to figure out is, am I OK just lifting the frame off them briefly without the spreader? Or do I need to do the lubrication with the frame in place, per Bob Bidonde's suggestion?

[cjkohnast]

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Do not detach anything. Put the car on jack stands just high enough to take weight off the tires maybe an inch take an old screwdriver and drive it between the leaves. spraying between each leaf.

[alexiskai]

OK, so that is now two votes for "don't take the U-bolts off." Good to know.

[Brentwood Bob]

The center bolt can fail at any time, the best time would be when the spring is contained.

[alexiskai]

Sounds like I should just eliminate step #4, and in step #7 just tighten the hanger nuts, make sure they're even.

[jb-ob]

Alex,


Why all the work ??


1. Jack up the car placing jack stands under the front motor mounts.


2. Remove front wheels.


3. Lower the front axle until the shocks bottom out.


4. Soak the relaxed leaves with your favorite penetrating oil.


5. Jack her up & reinstall front wheels.


I used the same product, worked great for me.


JB

[alexiskai]

I like this method, guess I should decide whether it's more work to take the wheels off or just to jack the frame up another foot, seems like it would have the same effect.

[Terry, NJ]

Be Very careful of the springs! I'm sure that in the history of model A s, someone has been killed by the rear spring. I almost lost a leg to one. DO NOT LOOSEN the SPRING UNLESS YOU HAVE IT CONTAINED!
To return to the subject at hand, here's what I would do; With the body in place, loosen the center nut on the spring. Back it off no more than two turns. Now flood the little gaps between the leaves with motor oil in a squeeze can.Maybe jack the frame (not the wheels) a click or three and get as much oil in between the leaves as is possible. Then let it all down on the ground again and retighten the center bolt of the spring. This is far easier and less dangerous than messing around with the spring.
Terry

[midgetracer]

How about using one of these gizmos.

[alexiskai]

Not familiar with that gizmo, what is it?

[Chuck Sea/Tac]

I just jack one end of the car at a time up high, enough so that jackstands under the frame will let the wheels and spring hang as far down as it’ll go. Then I use like a motorcycle chain lube or Teflon silicone, or a penetrating type oil squirted all around the leaves.

[Kurt in NJ]

I use a simplified method--- take oil can, fill with atf, squirt on springs. Go for drive---- don't forget the oil hole in the hand crank bearing

[Tacoma Bob]

Penephite is designed to travel horizontally.

[alexiskai]

Originally Posted by Tacoma Bob

Penephite is designed to travel horizontally.

Is that... bad? Isn't that the reason to use it on leaf springs?

[Ranchero50]

I'd just put some old motor oil in a squirt bottle, spray the spring packs and take it for a ride. Come home and wipe up any mess.

I had my rear spring apart The leaves don't relax until you remove the center bolt and start loosening the clamps.

[midgetracer]

Originally Posted by alexiskai

Not familiar with that gizmo, what is it?

It is a tool to lubricate leaf springs.

[Y-Blockhead]

Here is a Leaf Spring Greaser I fabbed to lube my springs. Patterned after one designed for Austins, Bentleys and Rolls. After lubing I installed spring covers.

[alexiskai]

The Model T and other cars that have the springs exposed can be greased with this very elegant tool.

There are also a lot of variants on this tool that separates the leaves in a controlled fashion.

I just found this post by Tom Wesenberg where he mentions a problem I also noticed, which is that the rear springs are tucked way up inside the cross-member, making it difficult to access them for greasing. That's why I originally was hoping to remove the hanger nuts, to try to drop the spring down so I could get between the leaves.

The post includes a photo of his greasing tool, although I can't really see how it works.
https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showp...90&postcount=2

That's going to be the real trick, getting the grease up in the midsection that's tucked into the cross-member.

[1931 flamingo]

In the above pic you tighten the handle after the tool is positioned against the leaves, it spreads the leaves apart, after the leaves are spread a bit, insert grease. I picked one up very similar a while back.
Paul in CT

[Tom Wesenberg]

Just squirt ATF or oil on the springs and go for a drive. The oil will migrate between the leaves. When I first bought my 29 Tudor, the springs were bone dry and lightly rusted, so the car rode like a lumber wagon. I squirted oil on them and drove it over the bumpy paths in the junk yard. It now rides quite smooth. Squirt them down a few times over a few weeks, and they will get lubed.

[Chris Haynes]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vtg-Ford-Mo...kAAOSwrENdUIrv

[rocket1]

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A number of years ago a tool was available that was driven between the spring leaves that had a grease fitting attached.I took my springs apart ground the gouges smooth and greased them with graphite grease and installed covers.

[alexiskai]

This looks like the tool Y-Blockhead was talking about. Marked "Herbrand."

[alexiskai]

OK, all the discussion about specialized spring lubrication tools got me intrigued, so this weekend I'm going to attempt to build my own spring separator using a 4" C-clamp, a steel rod that I'm going to cut/grind into the wedge shapes, and some JB weld. Will post an update if it's successful.

[Y-Blockhead]

Originally Posted by alexiskai

This looks like the tool Y-Blockhead was talking about. Marked "Herbrand."

Yes, that one is similar to the one I patterned the one I fabbed.

Here is one on eBay but they are easy (and cheap) to make. Beside, I get a certain satisfaction of making specialty tools, if I can.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-VINTAG...MAAOSwL49b8ucZ

[alexiskai]

Following up, here is the process I actually used that actually worked:

1. Spread some newspapers under the axle before you get started
2. Detach the brake rods and shock arms at the backing plates
3. Jack up the car as high as possible
4. Get jack stands under the frame, let the axle come down until the wheels touch
5. Loosen lug nuts and remove the wheels
6. Remove bolts from spring clamps, good time to change these out as they're often rusted
7. Remove spring clamps if possible (rear pair came off, front pair did not)
8. Loosen, but do not remove, the hanger nuts on the U-bolts
9. Using a small and a large flathead screwdriver, plus a couple of wooden or plastic shims if you have them, work your way up first one side of the spring and then the other
10. Hammer the small screwdriver under the end of each leaf to free it up, then alternate small and large, working your way toward the center of the leaf; if the leaf is long, leave a couple of shims in place so the whole leaf stays open
11. Once you've gone as far as you can, spray Kano Penephite into the gap; use a shop rag to block the far side so you don't make a mess
12. Once you've laid down a good coating, back out your wedges and shims, then move on to the next leaf
13. For the rear spring, use a floor jack to lift one side of the axle up; this will bring the leaves on the other side farther down out of the cross-member for easier access
14. When finished, bolt the spring clamps back in and jack up the axle to make sure the springs are flexing smoothly
15. Put the wheels back on and take the jack stands out
16. Once the car is back on its wheels, tighten the hanger nuts evenly in a cross pattern, then install cotter pins
17. Remember to re-attach brake rods and shock arms
18. Optional: install spring covers so you never have to do this again.

[Ted Duke]

Do you think your great granpa lubed the springs?


KISS



Spray the springs on both sides with https://www.brattons.com/graphite-lube.html and drive it.


Ted

[Ruth]

Originally Posted by Ted Duke

Do you think your great granpa lubed the springs?

KISS

Spray the springs on both sides with https://www.brattons.com/graphite-lube.html and drive it.


Ted

Different mind set I guess. I drive my modern as transportation (like my great grandpa drove his Model A) but I tend to 'Baby' my Town Sedan.

[alexiskai]

Originally Posted by Ted Duke

Do you think your great granpa lubed the springs?

If the springs were squeaking, I assume my great-grandpa would have taken it to the repair shop like a normal person. I don't get the critique here though - the Bratton's product you linked to says to spray it on both sides of each leaf, which is exactly what I'm doing. The rest of the process is just a workaround for how to do this without taking the springs off the car, which is what you're "supposed" to do. End result is the same.

[Ranchero50]

Indeed, spraying the outside of the spring with a dry lube spray isn't going to accomplish much between the leaves. I removed my back spring and after cleaning and painting the overlap areas with a longer loose center bolt poured some old motor oil on it (like grandpa probably would have). It worked out well.

I did the same to the front except the clean and paint and now I have rusty oil dripping out of it. Half measures...

[MikeK]

Originally Posted by Ted Duke

Do you think your great granpa lubed the springs?
Ted

My grandfather greased everything: mechanicals, politicians, building inspectors, police, maî·tre d's, vendors, ad infinitum. Made for a real smooooth ride through life.

[ETAModel]

Originally Posted by Ted Duke

Do you think your great granpa lubed the springs?


KISS



Spray the springs on both sides with https://www.brattons.com/graphite-lube.html and drive it.


Ted

When your Great Granpa drove his Model A it wasn't NINETY years old !!!

(Just the new guy chiming in)
ET