Whose Knowledge Is It, Anyway?

[forever4]

Well, I just received another personal attack on fordbarn by a person who also took the time to jab my 'Ford Garage' web site as being a collection of "other peoples information and techniques".
I imagine so.

So let me say this about that.

For the most part, everything everyone 'knows' in life (and about old Fords) came from somewhere else. It was all learned along the way on each our journey. Not a lot of it was self-taught or self-discovered in a vacuum by anyone, I imagine. And not a lot of it is a secret.

And even those things that are self-taught or self-discovered are rarely unique to a single individual. Other people have also learned and discovered the very same things on their own, or in collaboration with others. And they shared it. And they taught it. And we all are sometimes (or even often) mistaken. And so it goes.

I have learned a lot from others. My learnings are just my learnings. They may or may not be facts. They may or may not be complete or correct. And they are subject to change as soon as the next best info shows up.

I have never claimed that any of the info on my web site is all my original thinking, or that it is even correct for that matter. But it is my effort to share something I am interested in with other people who may also be interested.

And I have taken the time and expense to put some of my learnings in a public place where it is freely available for others to consider on their own journey.

Agree or disagree, right or wrong, helpful or confusing, it is there for everyone's consideration.
Or not.

Lots of people on fordbarn, and elsewhere, over the years have graciously allowed me to repost their excellent photos, descriptions, and analysis, and I have credited them as best as possible.

The point of the jab was to offend me I suppose, but I'll try not to take it that way.

At least someone is reading it and considering it, to have formed a negative opinion about it.

[Mike V. Florida]

As long as one acknowledges where they received the information or at least doesn't present it as their own, I have no problem with anyones site or the information on it.

[MikeK]

A personal attack on fordbarn? I would consider that recognition of your contributions to the craft.

[RockHillWill]

Vince, I for one regard your website as a personal archive of great importance. I can go there and do some research without all the hastle of waiting for replies to the posts. Like Marco's , Plucks, Bob Johnsons and Jim Masons (and others I may not recall at the present time) it contains mountains of information and regarding all of the above mentioned sites, I have found little or no contradictory information at the Ford Archives. Just like here on the Fordbarn, you eventually figure out who is carrying water and who fills the bucket.

[Bruce of MN]

I agree with RockHill Will

[1931 flamingo]

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I thoroughly enjoy your website and am amazed at the amount of info there, and the sacrifice of your time to provide it all to anyone who's interested. If this was a personal attack on the Barn, I would notify RYAN ASAP as he doesn't seem to put up with any of that s__t. JMO
Paul in CT

[MCHinson]

Vince,

I have only been on this site for a short time. Sometimes it seems like this is the old wild west and there is no sheriff in town. It is my observation that there are a few folks on here that find it very easy to get into personal attack mode. Maybe it is because I just retired from a law enforcement career, but I really don't like the fighting and arguing.

Harassment, fighting and/or rude comments are a violation of the rules of this site.

Whenever that happens, it would make it easier if someone would click the "report" button on the post to bring it to the attention of the moderators. This site is so busy that the moderators obviously do not have time to read every post. If they don't see it and nobody reports it, it can quickly get out of hand.

[2manycars]

I would not get to concerned about an occasional jerk making uncalled for comments on your web site. Some people need to tear down people and things that are better than themselves to feel good about themselves. Your web site is interesting and informative, and a lot of people have benefited from it. There will always be jerks who want to piss you off, or belittle your work. Let it go. We all say things that offend someone occasionally, and some will get over it, and others will lash out. Ignore them.

[5window]

Originally Posted by 1931 flamingo

I thoroughly enjoy your website and am amazed at the amount of info there, and the sacrifice of your time to provide it all to anyone who's interested. If this was a personal attack on the Barn, I would notify RYAN ASAP as he doesn't seem to put up with any of that s__t. JMO
Paul in CT

I will second this. I really enjoy your website and its assemblage of information. There is no room for personal attacks here-I'd let Ryan and the Mods in on the problem.

[Scott NY]

I appualed people who set up websites and offer a magnitude of information that has been gathered over the years.Vince I bet the person that attacked you does not have a website offering free information to the mass. Keep up the good work.

[Tom H.]

When we started working on our 32 AAB truck we didn't know T's from A's.
I found a lot of info online most of it good , some not so good. But the day I found the ford garage site was an enlightenment. Thanks Vince and keep up the great work.
Tom H

[pdora]

Most of have strong feelings and opinions on a variety of topics. Learning when and where to express ourselves is a process of ongoing maturity. Some are getting there and some aren't.

[Mitch//pa]

your site has been a helpfull reference for me more times than i can remember. thanks for taking the time and effort for up keeping it. i do see where you give folks credit for the material on it. if someone feels your violating there copyrighted material i am sure they would just ask you to remove it.

[gweilbaker]

Thank you!

I like the garage art too, not much reading.


GW

[Roger V]

As with others, I also appreciate the tremendous amount of effort you have put in your website. Usually, attacks like that are from some isolated soul who does nothing for the good of others or are maybe jealous.........

Roger V

[Mike V. Florida]

Ask Jim Mason about attacks. He took down his site for a while because of them.

[MAG]

Vince,
Many of the books published for the repair and restoration of Model A Fords are compiled from sources of information other than the mind of the author.
I highly value your site and I don't care where the information came from.
Ignorance can be remidied; Stupid can't.
Ignorance did not attack you; Stupid did!

[Chris in WNC]

as long as the personal attacks are a minority and the rest of us enjoy the information you organize & provide, where's the problem? let it slide like water from a duck's back and keep up the good work!

[30ccpickup]

Thanks for creating your website. It is a place I go to learn more about my A.

[Jerry Parr WI]

Vince

Keep up the good work. I will do my best to be one of the other people but am not willing to devote the time and energy you do making information readily available to others. I like many others benefit from your efforts.

Jerry

[Rowdy]

Sorry to hear about the attack. I greatly enjoy your site and if at any time I post something you want to use on it, just let me know. I will be glad to share it. Rod

[Mitch Bunkin in PA]

The people replying to this post are probably just the "tip of the iceberg" and represent a much larger number who value your information & really appreciate the time & effort you put into it.

[Bruce Lancaster]

Vince's site and the others mentioned above, especially Marco, are the results of lifetime experience, including detailed and knowledgable observation of original cars and parts and much knucle-banging on cars, and many years of intensive research into difficult-to-locate original resources guided by the questions our cars raise.
I have some appreciation of this, as I have been hunting '32 literature since the early sixties and know how valuable every new scrap of information is and how hard it is to build a solid wall of information from a collection of fragments.
This is scholarly research, archaeology, and detective work combined and is difficult and grueling work.
Half the questions on here come from people who haven't bothered even to buy a repro owner's manual...they think information comes from asking random strangers online and that Ford parts are something you just order from Mac's...if offered an answer backed up all the way to the original blueprint by 20 years of reaearch and a different answer from Andrews, many are not capable of even understanding the nature of the difference.

[Benson]

Vince,

Thanks very much for your website and all the info.

Please add me as another of the positive reactions to all the work that you and others have done on your personal websites!

[HoarseWhisperer]

Big thumbs up on Vince's website!

[james hitchcock]

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Well Vince,
You should now thank that person who posted the attack. He gave you a nice dose of publicity and I hadn't heard of your site until this post. I will definitely check it out, sounds like a lot good info. I was told by another member a while back to not give these attackers the satisfaction of knowing they got to you. I think all here on Ford Barn take what they say with a grain of salt.
James.

[Glenn C.]

If the only information obtainable was from the owners manual and the Service Bullitens, I do not think there would be a Model A hobby. Keep up the good work on your website Vince. We continue to need the help and info.

[Bruce Lancaster]

On the old Ford barn, any search of old posts was very, very inefficient...my search technique was to simply make a wildly general search ("distributor", for instance) and pick out the posts by Marco and Vince. Bang. Trustworthy, detailed, and usually beautifully illustrated information on a platter.

[Tacoma Bob]

Vince, Keep on keepin on Buddy. You are one of many that have taken the time and effort to compile storehouses of knowledge and wisdom and are willing to share it. I have been hanging around these "A" sites for close to nine years now and there defiantly is a select group on the top shelf. What I have noticed is every now and then somebody decides they need to mow another person down and claim themselves as the new deity. Most of us can spot the smoke and mirrors.

[thebanjoman]

Unless you are infringing on copyrights, intellectual property issues, reprinting without proper consent, or claiming the information as your own without giving proper credit, or charging for said information then you are merely providing an additional resource of information on the 'Information Superhighway".

So you gather information, so does Google..

Opinions are like backsides.. Everybody's got one.. And often they stink.

[FL&WVMIKE]

forever4 ..........................
For goodness sake, just ignore any negative comments that you might get.
If you would get an abundance of them, that would be the time to worry. I don't think that has been the case.
Keep up the good work !
MIKE

[zzlegend]

Hey Vince. I dont know where you get your info. nor do i care. That thought never entered my mind. I only know that i can go to your site which i do quite often, and leave with a little more knowledge. Your close up pictures is what i find the most interesting. Keep up the good work and information. Mark.

[Kevin in NJ]

A big chunk of this hobby is putting existing information in a form that it is useful.

Everyone is lucky that some of us do not charge for the information. How many times have you bought prints from the Ford Archives or used information from prints bought from the Ford Archives. I have bought NOS and repro parts just to be able to compare them and share the results.

There are a few guys that have spend a large amount of money and time pulling prints from the archives. It is just the goodness of their hearts that this info is shared at no cost.

Now all we need are a bunch of open minds willing to learn.

[Frank Nemo]

These assassin's seem to delight in hiding behind their anonymity to tear down well meaning contributors. The only thing they prove is their own cowardice and stupidity!

Vince, in reading the replies on this thread you can see you have a lot of friends on Ford Barn who appreciate your many contributions to our hobby. Thank you very much.

[california dean]

I was told a story years ago about a hitchhiker picked up by a rough, tough cross county truck driver. The hitchhiker was surprised to see posted on his dash the word "FIDO," assuming it to be a reminder of his favorite pet dog. How could a guy like this have a foo foo type dog and if he did, why would he spell the dog's name in such a diminutive way? Asking the driver about it, the answer was that it stood for "F

[Rowdy]

I have a 1926 Automobile Electrical Blueprint book that I likely could charge for the info in it. To date I have made copies of 11 specific blueprints for people, I have never charged any of them. Very hard info to get ahold of and was lucky enough this was in the bottom of a box of books I bought at an auction over 20 years ago for $1. Rod

[california dean]

Sorry, punched the wrong key.

Stood for FORGET IT, DRIVE ON. Vince, moral of story is, there will always be a few that cause problems. Forget them and move on. FYI, as a result of your post, I visited your site for the first time and thoroughly enjoyed it. Great site and I will be back many times in the future!

[Timothy Kelly]

Vince....

Please keep sharing.....many of us find your information to be very helpful.

Cheers,

Timothy

[ken ct]

Originally Posted by forever4

Well, I just received another personal attack on fordbarn by a person who also took the time to jab my 'Ford Garage' web site as being a collection of "other peoples information and techniques".
I imagine so.

So let me say this about that.

For the most part, everything everyone 'knows' in life (and about old Fords) came from somewhere else. It was all learned along the way on each our journey. Not a lot of it was self-taught or self-discovered in a vacuum by anyone, I imagine. And not a lot of it is a secret.

And even those things that are self-taught or self-discovered are rarely unique to a single individual. Other people have also learned and discovered the very same things on their own, or in collaboration with others. And they shared it. And they taught it. And we all are sometimes (or even often) mistaken. And so it goes.

I have learned a lot from others. My learnings are just my learnings. They may or may not be facts. They may or may not be complete or correct. And they are subject to change as soon as the next best info shows up.

I have never claimed that any of the info on my web site is all my original thinking, or that it is even correct for that matter. But it is my effort to share something I am interested in with other people who may also be interested.

And I have taken the time and expense to put some of my learnings in a public place where it is freely available for others to consider on their own journey.

Agree or disagree, right or wrong, helpful or confusing, it is there for everyone's consideration.
Or not.

Lots of people on fordbarn, and elsewhere, over the years have graciously allowed me to repost their excellent photos, descriptions, and analysis, and I have credited them as best as possible.

The point of the jab was to offend me I suppose, but I'll try not to take it that way.

At least someone is reading it and considering it, to have formed a negative opinion about it.

Vince,i for one appreiacate your web site,its very useful to me on some occations,thank you keep it comming. ken ct.

[Bruce Lancaster]

There isn't anyone left alive with firsthand knowledge of Model A and B engineering and manufacuring changes. Ford's public offerings (parts books, bulletins, change orders, etc.) are not well organized, are not nearly complete enough to support detailed restoration, and in fact had purposes entirely different than ours. Ford was interested in function and to some extent updating...if you had dropped off a thoroughly thrashed 1928 A at a Ford dealer in 1932 and given the dealer a blank check to tear it down and rebuild, what emerged would sure have not been a restoration by modern lights.
ALL our information comes through others now (apologies if there are any 130 year old Ford engineers or plant managers here), and has to be extracted through nearly inaccessible paper and from studying ancient iron. Like Vince, I have been through gathering Ford paper over many years (not sure of the count, but I have '28-32 literature from at least 8 different countries now, ALL of it offering tiny bits of information not otherwise findable), fragments gathered from old non-Ford garage magazines, torn boxes with numbers, and a basement full not of just paper but of a sort of iron library. I have left quarts of blood in ancient rural junkyards over the years, and have lived on Ramen Noodles a few times when I found a unique but wildly expensive bit like a salesman's manual or obsolete bulletin page.
A lot of this stuff is only accessible to normal humans who would buy groceries before buying a service bulletin (the weak, the many, the normal!) through folks like Vince and Marco and the other hardcore researchers on here. I cannot imagine the work they put into getting their knowledge online...I can barely keep such stuff stacked neatly in my basement and don't even know how I would make it usable by the world.
These guys have thousands of dollars in ancient paper, years of contact with other researchers and piles of ancient iron, and they are publishing it for us to read FOR FREE. And people are complaining because their information from the untouchable past came from...gasp!...the PAST?
If you feel like that, go back to your cage full of bad parts and information from imbeciles and fling dung at the tourists.

[Brentwood Bob]

Bob's Rule #3. About one in 100 are jerks, they even enjoy being jerks. You have been attacked before on the old Site, and its followed you here. I, for one, value you input, freely given. Looks like I'm not alone. The individual who attacked you for whatever reason needs to look at what he did. That type of thing has no value here. He should move on. If he's lucky, in his travels he will run across others he can argue with. Just leave me, and my friends alone. Bob

[marc hildebrant]

Just found your web site due to this posting.
It's a good site and has a lot of useful info.

Thanks for your time in setting up the web site.

Marc

[Bob S]

I guess I should thank that attacker, because now I know about Vince's site. What a great resource. I'm sure I will use it often. Now I just need to find all those other sites that RockHillWill referred to. Anyone have addresses to post? I think it is great when people like Vince and the others take the time and effort to help others in this way, and can't imagine why anyone would make such an attack.

Bob

[Bruce Lancaster]

Goood sites, all very useful, all different:

http://idisk.mac.com/forever4/Public/index.htm
http://www.abarnyard.com/
http://jmodela.com/
http://www.plucks329s.org/
http://www.mantiquesresto.com/
http://home.comcast.net/~68c/
http://www.motormayhem.net/mode-a-fo...pecifications/ (not really a great site in general, but reprints many salesman's illustrations)
http://rkkaww2.armchairgeneral.com/galleries.htm (another odd entry...scroll down and blow-up the Gaz AA and AAA entries to see veryinteresting modernizations/upgrades to otherwise bearly normal Ford structure)

[Craig Lewis]

1) Vince I find your website excellent. As a personal contributor to the site I recall a polite & curtious request if you could include my item regarding tempered glass.
2) I have no problem with reading copyrighted material online providing the author is given recognition. I think those with strong feelings in this regard should step back a bit and view the reality of what they're "policing" and perhaps do something instead to bring some FUN back into the hobby.
In the case of samplings of someone's book posted online
(as carried out by an individual who recently moved to the "other side")
...I see it as a tremendous advertizing plug for the book....they likely sell more copies as a result.
3) Anybody who sacrifices valuable personal time, to provide a website of free info to a bunch of hobbiest's shouldn't be discouraged and I truly hope and expect you will eventually pick up some form of reward for your efforts. What that reward is, is none of my concern nor business, but hopefully it's something more than the guy who restores licence plates for $25xx each! (he was recommended on a recent thread)
Thanks again for the info you share Vince.

[Freddie (Memphis)]

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Vince...your website may indeed be a collection of other people's experiences ... coupled with your personal experiences. But, in all our daily lives, isn't that what makes up our collective knowledge of anything and everything...? If I want to know something about Jippy Car, I come here...or go to your website...or others...or look it up in one of the books I might have on hand already. Bottom line is all of our learning comes from those who preceeded us...and their learning came from those who preceeded them...and so on.

I wouldn't let someone's misguided personal attack get to me...and it doesn't sound like you did...good for you!

Meanwhile...I will thank everyone who posts knowledge of all things Model A related - or just old car related. Without folks publishing their collective knowledge...no matter WHERE it originated...many of us would continue to roam in the darkness of ignorance.

Thanks guys...continue to post stuff you may have learned from someone else. If I didn't know it already...I had to learn it from one of you. And I hope someday to be able to pass along what I have learned from others.

...and screw the naysayers...

[V4F]

ya know what they say ...... jokem if they cant take a screw ! ...................... steve

[Tom Foster]

Originally Posted by Bruce Lancaster

There isn't anyone left alive with firsthand knowledge of Model A and B engineering and manufacuring changes. Ford's public offerings (parts books, bulletins, change orders, etc.) are not well organized, are not nearly complete enough to support detailed restoration, and in fact had purposes entirely different than ours. Ford was interested in function and to some extent updating...if you had dropped off a thoroughly thrashed 1928 A at a Ford dealer in 1932 and given the dealer a blank check to tear it down and rebuild, what emerged would sure have not been a restoration by modern lights.
ALL our information comes through others now (apologies if there are any 130 year old Ford engineers or plant managers here), and has to be extracted through nearly inaccessible paper and from studying ancient iron. Like Vince, I have been through gathering Ford paper over many years (not sure of the count, but I have '28-32 literature from at least 8 different countries now, ALL of it offering tiny bits of information not otherwise findable), fragments gathered from old non-Ford garage magazines, torn boxes with numbers, and a basement full not of just paper but of a sort of iron library. I have left quarts of blood in ancient rural junkyards over the years, and have lived on Ramen Noodles a few times when I found a unique but wildly expensive bit like a salesman's manual or obsolete bulletin page.
A lot of this stuff is only accessible to normal humans who would buy groceries before buying a service bulletin (the weak, the many, the normal!) through folks like Vince and Marco and the other hardcore researchers on here. I cannot imagine the work they put into getting their knowledge online...I can barely keep such stuff stacked neatly in my basement and don't even know how I would make it usable by the world.
These guys have thousands of dollars in ancient paper, years of contact with other researchers and piles of ancient iron, and they are publishing it for us to read FOR FREE. And people are complaining because their information from the untouchable past came from...gasp!...the PAST?
If you feel like that, go back to your cage full of bad parts and information from imbeciles and fling dung at the tourists.

Whoohooo! Hooray for you, Bruce, let 'em have it!

In case the Fordbarners aren't that familiar, Mr. Lancaster is regarded on the HAMB as The God Who Walks Among Us for his knowledge and willingness to help.

Fearless

[Jim Mason]

the offline attacks are the main reason I haven't update my site in some time. Also lack of time. I did take my site down for a short period, and got talked into putting it back up. (often wish I hadn't). I'm actually considering taking it down (the yearly fee is due soon). No this is NOT a request for support, advertisement, or an offer to have the site moved to someone else. Please don't take it that way. I also seldom post here or anywhere because of the flame mail. Vince, in the end you'll have to decide what to do. don't let people talk you in to or out of something...fwiw,jm

[joe plumber]

I wouldn't worry about it .Sounds like someone is jealous of your site .Keep on keeping on.

[Bruce Lancaster]

There are lots of attack lunatics in the Model A community, apparently, and a lot of real rancor. JM was shut down for a while, Ahooga was nearly destroyed when some of the best resources abandoned the place forever...whoinhell are these people, and why can't we just make them into gaskets or something?? Gett'em online and Ryan will likely ban them. HAMB is boisterous, but simply does not have the sort of stalker-type animosities that came up on the old Barn...that sort of thing leads to banishment, leaving the perps to amuse themselves by pulling the wings off of flies or something.

[peters180a/170b]

i checkout your website twice ... Sounds like i should of checked it out more often...

[Tom Wesenberg]

Sometimes the slimeballs slither out from under their rocks and think they can lift themselves up by pulling others down.

I've also had a couple of those type emails.

[Jim Huseby]

Vince - I like the way you expressed your intentions with all kinds of useful, technical and fun info on the 'barn. Coming in, I thought that those kinds of exchanges were the friendly, unthreatening general mode of communication on this site. Well, I got some hate mail on the old barn that took me for a loop, but I didn't see any possible outcome other than escalation by responding to it. It doesn't take long to discern personality types on this site, and I recognize the huge majority of barners are truly great people; smarter, wizer and more mature than me. There will always be miserable people; just smile and keep barning, please.

[Cool Hand Lurker]

Vince, I wish I could tell you how to stop the slammers. If you respond, then more come out of the woodwork and join in like a pack of dogs. It doesn't matter if they have never dealt with you or even been aware of your site. It is an illness of the weird and we have them in the Ford community, unfortunately.

It takes all kinds of good people to make a good forum, the knowledgeable and the searchers and the users. Otherwise there would be no need for the forum. Thanks for your site and your help.

[henry494]

OK Vince. Now with well over 50 responses patting you on the back and advising you to ignore the fools, can you get back to work on your excellent site and add more content? I can't really add to what all the others have said so well, but I couldn't help adding my two cents of support for what you and many others provide to us in your spare time, for free. There is no explanation for folls like that. I too have received some very colorful personal attacks, and for what? I never figured out where any of them were coming from.

One word of advice I would offer to you;

DELETE
(Hit that button a little faster next time)


Dave Lopes

[ford1]

hey vince, let ryan know who he is and i bet he will get banned, the most positive solution

[pdora]

Growing pains for the new FB. So far good order and civility are winning.

[hardtimes]

Originally Posted by pdora

Growing pains for the new FB. So far good order and civility are winning.

'Growing pains'..indeed! Bottom line is, this should not be recurring! Mabe more moderators? Mabe more power to moderators, if indicated? Mabe make it mandatory(RYAN) that a fellow Barner report such allegation immediately to you..for whatever action you decide necessary, if any!
At any rate, THANKS Ryan for this site....

[Chuck Kuntz]

I enjoy your site very much and find a lot of useful info there. Those that sent the attacks must be the same ones that go off on a rant when someone offers a response to a question that they don't agree with.

[jerseyboy]

As a contributor to your site as well as a regular user, I think it is a top notch site. You personally have helped me out with many questions.

Thanks Vince!

Keep V-8ing and 4-banging! (Oh, by the way, my tag line is not original, it was Dale Sandman's. I use it as a tribute to someone who helped me immensely!)

[SteveM]

Vince,

I like your website too. Keep doing what you are doing.

The sum total of all the information out there (you, Marco and all the others) is all to our advantage. The more the better.

I don't know where I'd be without the effort made by you and others like you.

Remember:
Illegitimi non carborundum
(which is sort-of Latin for "Don't let the bastards grind you down")

Steve

[Bob/AZ]

Originally Posted by forever4

well, i just received another personal attack on fordbarn by a person who also took the time to jab my 'ford garage' web site as being a collection of "other peoples information and techniques".
I imagine so.

So let me say this about that.

For the most part, everything everyone 'knows' in life (and about old fords) came from somewhere else. It was all learned along the way on each our journey. Not a lot of it was self-taught or self-discovered in a vacuum by anyone, i imagine. And not a lot of it is a secret.

And even those things that are self-taught or self-discovered are rarely unique to a single individual. Other people have also learned and discovered the very same things on their own, or in collaboration with others. And they shared it. And they taught it. And we all are sometimes (or even often) mistaken. And so it goes.

I have learned a lot from others. My learnings are just my learnings. They may or may not be facts. They may or may not be complete or correct. And they are subject to change as soon as the next best info shows up.

I have never claimed that any of the info on my web site is all my original thinking, or that it is even correct for that matter. But it is my effort to share something i am interested in with other people who may also be interested.

And i have taken the time and expense to put some of my learnings in a public place where it is freely available for others to consider on their own journey.

Agree or disagree, right or wrong, helpful or confusing, it is there for everyone's consideration.
Or not.

Lots of people on fordbarn, and elsewhere, over the years have graciously allowed me to repost their excellent photos, descriptions, and analysis, and i have credited them as best as possible.

The point of the jab was to offend me i suppose, but i'll try not to take it that way.

At least someone is reading it and considering it, to have formed a negative opinion about it.

well said. I need all the help i can get and i'm thankful for folks like you who are willing to share information.

[rotorwrench]

My elders always told me that misery loves company and time has taught me that it's true as shurely as it did my elders. Miserable people have a nack for pushing other peoples buttons and making them feel bad.

It's best to ignore ignorance and misery and keep your own chin up and eyes down the road.

[msmaron]

Originally Posted by Bruce of MN

I agree with RockHill Will

ditto!!! 10 x over

[Frank Nemo]

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Vince, we now are the 4th page of this thread and every poster has said how much they appreciate the great contributor and advocate you are to our beloved Model A's. It's time to take off the gloves and expose the schmuck who differed with you and took a shot at you. If you don't want to blow the whistle on him publicly on this thread (don't worry he has a lot more enemies than friends on Ford Barn) at least let Ryan and the mods know his identity. This should remain a "feel safe place" where people can ask questions and get answers.

[pdora]

Best handled behind the scenes, lest a dreaded conflagration flare up.

[MCHinson]

The moderators know who it is. The posts that started this were deleted by the moderators.

[Bill Stipe]

(""For the most part, everything everyone 'knows' in life (and about old Fords) came from somewhere else. It was all learned along the way on each our journey. Not a lot of it was self-taught or self-discovered in a vacuum by anyone, I imagine. And not a lot of it is a secret.

And even those things that are self-taught or self-discovered are rarely unique to a single individual. Other people have also learned and discovered the very same things on their own, or in collaboration with others. And they shared it. And they taught it. And we all are sometimes (or even often) mistaken. And so it goes."")

Vince you have a great website and you pretty much nailed it with what you said. There are very few if any of us that were around when this info was imagined and turned from the drawing board to proto type to production part etc.

I always admired your way of analyzing a problem or an idea I know because I have seen you at it first hand!!----

[tuneman]

The end
I hope !!!
Lets not beat this to death any longer!

[tamagrouchy]

To Vince and all others who out of sheer love of the hobby who are working hard, collecting data, building and maintaining and constructively contributing to websites, I say THANK YOU ONE AND ALL! We ALL benefit from the generosity of those who give back to the hobby. I am sure that the newbie of today will become a contributing expert someday!

There will always be a few "rotten apples" in the bushel. Best to just avoid it and let it rot away on its own....

[Cob]

Originally Posted by MCHinson

Vince,

I have only been on this site for a short time. Sometimes it seems like this is the old wild west and there is no sheriff in town. It is my observation that there are a few folks on here that find it very easy to get into personal attack mode. Maybe it is because I just retired from a law enforcement career, but I really don't like the fighting and arguing.

Harassment, fighting and/or rude comments are a violation of the rules of this site.

Whenever that happens, it would make it easier if someone would click the "report" button on the post to bring it to the attention of the moderators. This site is so busy that the moderators obviously do not have time to read every post. If they don't see it and nobody reports it, it can quickly get out of hand.

Here is the scoop boys.
Moderator is in town and donates his time so all can enjoy.

The last time I checked this is The Old Ford Barn sight.
It's about Old Fords.

The information is good and helpful and that's they way it should be.
Post info and learn.

Plain and simple - if you disagree, I suggest you take your disagreements to a private message because if you don't, and I get reports from other members that your posted disagreements take away from the cars and the disagreement becomes the focus, YOUR post will be deleted.

You copy a private message to a post that was intended to be a private message - your post will be deleted.


So going forward - you disagree - fine. Discuss in a private message.
Fellow members report it to me that guys go off course and start arguing on who is right etc. your post will be deleted.

Come on boys -Drama just isn't tolerated - posted bickering and arguing isn't tolerated.
Make a note of that.

It's about Old Ford CARS - that's why we are here - remember ?

Thanks,
Cob
Moderator