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Old 09-07-2016, 01:38 PM   #41
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Default Re: Awwe Crap!

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Originally Posted by Capt Kirk View Post
I didn't want to crawl under a running car with it in gear so I could put my ear to the axle.
You are obviously a WISE man! But..........you could use a long stick (stethoscope) to your ear. DD
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Old 09-07-2016, 01:44 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by JM 35 Sedan View Post
Capt, if your axle housings look like these, with the angled flange welded in place like these for rear wishbone attachment, then you would have a '35-'36 rear.
Must be a later axle...mine doesn't look like yours.
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Old 09-07-2016, 01:58 PM   #43
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I've already suggested this is not the way I would go about it, I would remove the whole axle assembly and go through it. However, if you want to go the one axle replacement only approach be sure you understand how the gaskets determine the backlash and bearing load. If the existing gaskets do not come off intact, then you need to be sure of the thickness of them. Any new gaskets must remain identical to the existing ones.

Some of this may help (if you can read it!). Found a slightly clearer copy of one of the pages.
Now that I have seen how the axles are mounted in the 3rd member, I am planning on removing the whole diff and torque tube so I can drag that in the garage and do it right. I'm hoping to not have to pull the pinion. I have done some reading today on using various thickness of gaskets for backlash and bearing preload. I don't have a dial indicator or mag base or any other specialized tools that may be necessary for this job. I was hoping that I could get away with replacing the gaskets with equal thickness new gaskets. I guess the final decision on how far I go into this will be made when I get it apart and see what I see.
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Old 09-07-2016, 02:00 PM   #44
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Default Re: Awwe Crap!

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Originally Posted by JM 35 Sedan View Post
Capt, if your axle housings look like these, with the angled flange welded in place like these for rear wishbone attachment, then you would have a '35-'36 rear.
These are the '35-'36 rear radius rods with integral spring mounts, and which would bolt-on to the tabs welded onto the axle bells at an angle, as in JM35's pictures. Otherwise, as someone pointed-out earlier, you probably have a '37-'40 rear assembly, which will bolt right in/swap as a complete assembly, torque tube and all. DD

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Old 09-07-2016, 02:06 PM   #45
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Default Re: Awwe Crap!

It's a classic 37-40 axle it has 39-40 brakes so was probably chosen as a direct bolt in replacement. If it has wide 5 hubs it could be a 39 axle with it's original hubs. One thing is for sure, it makes for a very neat conversion to hydraulics when it comes to running the pipes etc.

I'm lazy. There was nothing bothering you about the axle before something went pop. I'd just concentrate on replacing the component that broke and putting everything else back together exactly as it was removed. Chances are the bearings are better quality than a new replacement. There is no good reason to remove the pinion, why risk damaging the housing (which can happen if not done correctly) just for the sake of removing it because you feel you should.

Edit: ha ha just saw the wires. 40-48 hubs, which hopefully should have a support ring to support the inside diameter of the wheel face.

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Old 09-07-2016, 02:16 PM   #46
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Default Re: Awwe Crap!

Like Mart says, it is a '37-'40 from your pics.......right-side up this time. DD

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Old 09-07-2016, 02:21 PM   #47
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Default Re: Awwe Crap!

It looks like a nice neat installation in a pretty nice car.
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Old 09-07-2016, 02:22 PM   #48
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It's a classic 37-40 axle it has 39-40 brakes so was probably chosen as a direct bolt in replacement. If it has wide 5 hubs it could be a 39 axle with it's original hubs. One thing is for sure, it makes for a very neat conversion to hydraulics when it comes to running the pipes etc.

I'm lazy. There was nothing bothering you about the axle before something went pop. I'd just concentrate on replacing the component that broke and putting everything else back together exactly as it was removed. Chances are the bearings are better quality than a new replacement. There is no good reason to remove the pinion, why risk damaging the housing (which can happen if not done correctly) just for the sake of removing it because you feel you should.

Edit: ha ha just saw the wires. 40-48 hubs, which hopefully should have a support ring to support the inside diameter of the wheel face.

Mart.

There was absolutely no problems with the rear end before yesterday. Did the Dream Cruise several weeks ago and that's nothing but stop and go. Had the car up to highway speed last weekend...no noises whatsoever from the rear. Never any clunking...etc. Yesterday took me completely by surprise.
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Old 09-07-2016, 02:25 PM   #49
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It looks like a nice neat installation in a pretty nice car.

Thanks...I guess I won't send it to the crusher after all...
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Old 09-07-2016, 02:27 PM   #50
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I see on the Van Pelt site that a 35-38 axle has 18 teeth and a 39-41 has 16 teeth. Guess that means I need to take it apart to find out what tooth count I have.
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Old 09-07-2016, 02:45 PM   #51
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Default Re: Awwe Crap!

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I see on the Van Pelt site that a 35-38 axle has 18 teeth and a 39-41 has 16 teeth. Guess that means I need to take it apart to find out what tooth count I have.
That is correct. The sets are interchangeable, but together with the spider gear. When I built mine the first time, I was not aware of this, and had used a 16 tooth set. When the axle broke, I had obtained an 18 tooth, thinking I must have had that the first time, but no, I had to replace both axles and spider. This all can be done while the banjo and torque tube remain on the car. You mentioned that you'd likely remove both? Leave the torque tube on, just remove the banjo from the torque tube.

I think you must have been mistaken about hearing the noise while in neutral. Nothing rotates past the transmission while in neutral unless the car is rolling.
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Old 09-07-2016, 03:06 PM   #52
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38V8 I don't know how to quote just one sentence of a previous post but I think you'll know what part of your post I'm taking about.

I know that nothing is supposed to rotate behind the transmission when it's in neutral but I seem to remember in my past working on a more modern vehicle that when I started it without a driveline on and in neutral, the yoke was turning due to the lube inside. I could reach up and grab the yoke and make it stop...thought something similar could be happening here. I have some jockeying around of vehicles to do when I get home in order to get the 35 where I want to work on it. I'll put a jack under it and give that axle a tug and see what happens. I'll loosen the brakes if I need to.
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Old 09-07-2016, 03:22 PM   #53
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Yes, that is true, but nothing was connected to that yoke. In this case, the transmission output is connected all the way through to the wheels.
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Old 09-07-2016, 03:28 PM   #54
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Yes, that is true, but nothing was connected to that yoke. In this case, the transmission output is connected all the way through to the wheels.
If an axle is broken isn't the driveline free to rotate?
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Old 09-07-2016, 03:39 PM   #55
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Default Re: Awwe Crap!

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I see on the Van Pelt site that a 35-38 axle has 18 teeth and a 39-41 has 16 teeth. Guess that means I need to take it apart to find out what tooth count I have.
Yup, ya need to count teeth. One more distinct possibility to be aware of when you get it apart-enough to fondle an axle shaft. You need to also measure the length of your axle shaft to make sure it's a '37-'41. I say this only because it is POSSIBLE that someone has installed a '42-'48 rear end assembly with a '37-'41 drive shaft, torque tube and radius rods. As you noted, the '37-'41 axle shaft will measure 32.85", and could have either 18 OR 16 teeth. A '42-'48 rear end assembly is only slightly wider overall, and COULD be installed. '42-'48 axle shafts all measure 33.70" and have 16 teeth, which mate with 11-tooth spider gears. Just a "heads-up" so you know which axle to look for with certainty. DD
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Old 09-07-2016, 04:22 PM   #56
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I'm home and have discovered the problem. Before I share that, I feel VERY lucky that this didn't turn out WAY worse...I think my dad was looking down on me! Yep, it's a broken left side axle. I jacked the car up, tugged on the wheel and it fell off in my hand. I pushed that car around a corner from where it broke...down the street 1/2 block and a 90 degree turn into my driveway.
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Old 09-07-2016, 04:30 PM   #57
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Did you disconnect the hand brake or was it already that way.

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Old 09-07-2016, 04:34 PM   #58
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Yup, ya need to count teeth. One more distinct possibility to be aware of when you get it apart-enough to fondle an axle shaft. You need to also measure the length of your axle shaft to make sure it's a '37-'41. I say this only because it is POSSIBLE that someone has installed a '42-'48 rear end assembly with a '37-'41 drive shaft, torque tube and radius rods. As you noted, the '37-'41 axle shaft will measure 32.85", and could have either 18 OR 16 teeth. A '42-'48 rear end assembly is only slightly wider overall, and COULD be installed. '42-'48 axle shafts all measure 33.70" and have 16 teeth, which mate with 11-tooth spider gears. Just a "heads-up" so you know which axle to look for with certainty. DD
In your experience, how hard of a time do you think I'll have in finding an axle? Are there some around or will this be like searching for a Unicorn?

Also, with the hub installed on a good axle, does the hub put a little tension on the axle to keep the gear end of the axle up snug against the spider carrier? I hope the answer is yes...if not, I may have more problems inside.
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Old 09-07-2016, 04:50 PM   #59
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Default Re: Awwe Crap!

There should be very little movement in & out of the axle. If there is movement something is wrong (other than the obvious brake at the end).
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Old 09-07-2016, 05:07 PM   #60
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Did you disconnect the hand brake or was it already that way.

Bob
It was that way...I left it like that when I restored the car. I have an original e-brake handle that was intended for mechanical brakes and I have no way to go from the original handle to the cable so I put a big spring at the point of the cable V just to hold it up. I didn't want that spring to apply brake pressure so I left them disconnected in the drums. Once I figure out how to go from the e brake lever to the cable, I'll hook them back up. At least I have all the cable parts where they belong until I can get the rest figured out.
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