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Old 01-07-2019, 05:19 PM   #1
Al 29Tudor
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Default brake linings

Need some sage advice,
We have adjusted the brakes, all the linkage is moving freely, taken all the slack out of the clevis ends/rods, new cast iron drums, rebuilt the tracks, almost all parts have been replaced, sanded the shoes and there is very little braking when the brakes are applied.
Has anyone ever experienced shoes that become ineffective? or too hard to work any longer?
What are we missing?



















Thank you for any advice you can offer.
Al
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Old 01-07-2019, 05:55 PM   #2
Tacoma Bob
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Default Re: brake linings

Were the shoes actually arced to the respective drums? "Almost all the parts have been replaced" That could mean different things to different folks. What type of lining on the shoes?
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Old 01-07-2019, 06:02 PM   #3
Lawrie
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Default Re: brake linings

I have just done a brake repair on our 33, had the flathead ted floaters in,was never that happy with the brakes.( my fault for not reading the instructions)
So ,last week took all the brakes apart,fitted standard size rear drums,(the old ones were.120 oversize),fitted new woven linings,front on back,repaired the roller tracks to set the shoes concentric with the std drums on the rear,washed all the hardened grease off the rollers and links,and floater parts that I had put on previously,adjusted the brakes as per the floater instructions. with the rods disconected,
did the same to the fronts,but this time made sure the shoes were set concentric via the flathead teds little plate,adjusted the front brakes up.
then fitted the rods and using my home made adjuster thing on the pedal, set the rod lenghts,
Well .first time ,you can now skid all wheels ,brakes dont drag or hang on,
So if all the stuff is right, you should be able to get them to work good.
Lawrie

Last edited by Lawrie; 01-07-2019 at 06:16 PM.
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Old 01-07-2019, 06:32 PM   #4
100IH
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Default Re: brake linings

Lay on the pedal at 40 MPH a bunch. Do this to be able to see where there is contact. Drums off for inspection. There are tools (gauges) for this without driving. Regardless, there is always a break in period where the efficiency improves.
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Old 01-07-2019, 06:51 PM   #5
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Default Re: brake linings

Did you use woven linings or molded?
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Old 01-07-2019, 10:21 PM   #6
Al 29Tudor
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Default Re: brake linings

I don't remember if the rears are molded or woven because we did them a month ago but the fronts are woven. We did not change the linings because the have a lot of meet left. Do you suspect molded linings might be the problem? I can certainly ask the owner. There was a good amount of contact before but that probably changed now. We'll keep at it and check the current wear pattern.
Thanks to all.
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Old 01-07-2019, 10:55 PM   #7
Flathead
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Default Re: brake linings

You have the front brake arms angled forward 15 degrees with play removed from brake push rods? Have to ask, this is very important for good braking.
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Old 01-09-2019, 04:27 PM   #8
100IH
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Default Re: brake linings

Generally, woven for original type steel drums. Composition lining for cast drums. Not everyone adheres to this.
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Old 01-09-2019, 08:27 PM   #9
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Default Re: brake linings

FWIW

There is hard bonded and soft bonded, the soft bond you can feel a slight depression with your thumb nail. Soft bonded will work with mechanical brakes and steel and cast iron drums.

Hard bonded will only give you adequate braking with a hydraulic brake system.

How do I know, well on one of my previous brake jobs, I never could get any decent braking. After tearing the system apart and checking the arcing and centering to find nothing wrong I had discussions with club members and was able to determine that the brake shop installed hard lining. I obtained some soft bonded brake shoes, arced the shoes to the drums put everything back together with no other changes and I have BRAKES!!!
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Old 01-09-2019, 09:27 PM   #10
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Default Re: brake linings

Al,
My suggestion is to use the molded or soft molded lining with the cast iron drums.
With all the mechanicals properly restored I would put the car up on jack stands and get a helper to give pedal pressures a 1 inch id a half and 2 inch increments and the wheels should be pretty well locked at the 2 inch mark. If not adjust the brake rods as necessary .
Of course you wedged should already have been set with clevis ends disconnected.

Having done all the above correctly you should be able to adjust the brakes properly.
My number is in the Model a News in my ad. Contact me if you can’t get satisfactory results.
Larry Shepard

Last edited by larrys40; 01-09-2019 at 10:05 PM.
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Old 01-09-2019, 10:42 PM   #11
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Default Re: brake linings

Quote:
Originally Posted by larrys40 View Post
Al,
With all the mechanicals properly restored I would put the car up on jack stands...
Larry Shepard
Where are you putting you jack stands??? Frame or axles? It does make a difference.
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Old 01-10-2019, 06:25 AM   #12
springerpete
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Default Re: brake linings

Do any of you guys have words of wisdom about fixing very loud, squeaky front brakes ? I wave woven linings and cast iron drums. I have chamfered the shoe ends and roughed up a bit on the linings. No change. Thanks for your thoughts.
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Old 01-10-2019, 09:24 AM   #13
larrys40
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Default Re: brake linings

Quote:
Originally Posted by springerpete View Post
Do any of you guys have words of wisdom about fixing very loud, squeaky front brakes ? I wave woven linings and cast iron drums. I have chamfered the shoe ends and roughed up a bit on the linings. No change. Thanks for your thoughts.
Pete,
I would Switch to the molded shoes. I no longer use woven linings because of the squeaking issue they have. I have had brake vendors tell me it’s the resin that is some of the problem in the woven lining. I know it’s been used for years however the modern woven is different today than it used to be. Its been my experience that the molded either bonded or riveted is much better and compatible today. Ask Randy gross.... he will tell you the same.
I do lots of brake work and will no longer install the woven linings as the will squeak in short time.

Larry shepard
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Old 01-11-2019, 10:02 PM   #14
Al 29Tudor
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Default Re: brake linings

Thank you gents for the info and advice.
Car is on stands under axles and I will find out what linings are on the back. Looks like the best choice is soft molded linings.
Thanks again,
Al
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Old 01-12-2019, 03:18 AM   #15
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Default Re: brake linings

Soft lining work well on anything for everyday use from what I've found.

As far as I know hard linings are only good for racing where the temperatures can be kept up. Soft linings for me on drum brakes, car disc brakes, 4wd disc brakes, especially going to bigger wheels, electric mountain bike disc brakes. Works every time for me, and anyone who will listen. Also, an old guy when I was young said of the model A brakes "the secret is soft linings".
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Old 01-12-2019, 11:50 AM   #16
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Default Re: brake linings

Quote:
Originally Posted by larrys40 View Post
Al,
My suggestion is to use the molded or soft molded lining with the cast iron drums.
With all the mechanicals properly restored I would put the car up on jack stands and get a helper to give pedal pressures a 1 inch id a half and 2 inch increments and the wheels should be pretty well locked at the 2 inch mark. If not adjust the brake rods as necessary .
Of course you wedged should already have been set with clevis ends disconnected.

Having done all the above correctly you should be able to adjust the brakes properly.
My number is in the Model a News in my ad. Contact me if you can’t get satisfactory results.
Larry Shepard
Concur; just finished a job with the graduated brake stick from pedal to seat frame, 1 person job, jackstands under axles as close to wheels as possible.
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