Vapor lock right now on the way to work. How long will it last

[msmaron]

Very hot day today. Running nice and then dies. Cannot get started. All elec working etc. But won't catch. I think I have vapor lock. How long do I usually have to sit until it will start?

[Special Coupe Frank]

Could take any where from 15 mintues to an hour, with both sides of hood open.

If you have some bottled water ( or jugged for the radiator), splash that over the fuel-line / carb bowl, then see if fuel flows... Also, make sure gas cap vent is working - remove cap for a test.

If you're running an original-style condensor, that could be failing due to heat from the manifold... ran into this myself back in March... if this is the case, you will have no spark, or very weak, reddish spark.

[Tacoma Bob]

yup........slide into a DQ and pick up a vanilla cone for you and a big ice water for your fuel system. If it starts keep the lid on the ice.............you may need it again before you get to work.

[msmaron]

Well back again. Let it sit for about 35 minutes.. Advanced the spark and it started up, kept the throttle high when stopping.. Very frustrating., How can i prevent that?

[Tom Wesenberg]

Are you using gas with NO ethanol? I have a lot of trouble with vapor lock when using crap gas, even at 80*, but with the good gas even yesterday when we had a record high of 95* I had no trouble all day long.

[msmaron]

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are you saying to use the Premium Tom?? or just the better gas and not the standard cheap one?

[steve s]

Insulate the sediment bowl and fuel line, and add heat shield on carb. Each thing helped some.

Avoiding ethanol has to help. In my experience, adding diesel fuel didn't help.

I've seen in-bowl and in-line fuel filters serve as vapor lock sites, as they fill with vapor. Others' results differ.

Will try to add photo of my insulation. Used foil backed fiberglass sold for duct work on the bowl. Used rubber fuel line, slit lengthwise under REAL duct tape on the fuel line. A friend made the heat shield.

Steve

[Tom Wesenberg]

Mark, Look for a station that sells gas with NO ethanol. You may have to ask or call several stations to find the one that has a pump with NO ethanol. Then try to always fill up at that pump.

[Clem Clement]

You could put wooden clothes pins on the entire length of the fuel line. Clem

[Louis]

msmaron,
I don't mean to sound to simple as i am kinda new to this hobby.
do you have both engine splash pans installed?
what kind of fan is installed?
is your rad. clean?.... all having to do with air to circulate around the engine which could cause a vapor lock.
from what i have seen a lot of people removed these cowl's in the past.
my 31 has a org. fan and from what i have been told it moves more air then any of the aftermarket's including the 4 bladed, it get's a little warm here in GA. and i have been in a few traffic jams and have yet to have a vapor lock.
just my 2 cent's worth. good luck.

[msmaron]

Originally Posted by Louis

msmaron,
I don't mean to sound to simple as i am kinda new to this hobby.
do you have both engine splash pans installed?
what kind of fan is installed?
both having to do with air to circulate around the engine which could cause a vapor lock.
from what i have seen a lot of people removed these cowl's in the past.
my 31 has a org. fan and from what i have been told it moves more air then any of the aftermarket's including the 4 bladed. just my 2 cent's worth. good luck.

Yes of course i have the pans and 2 blade fan.... It is based on the boiling of the fuel, thanks for posting

[Tom Wesenberg]

Mark, DON'T cut the fuel line to install a rubber line. That would be a possibility for more leaks and trouble. When I was having trouble with the crap gas I slipped this white cover over my fuel line and it helped a lot. It's just like the black wiring covers with a slit down the length like used on most modern cars, except it's white to better reflect the heat. You can slip in on or off in about 5 seconds.

You need to insulate the carb and fuel line from excess heat. Are you running with enough spark advance, so that isn't the cause of excess engine heat?

BTW, since using only good gas with NO ethanol I have removed the white plastic cover and haven't had any trouble.

[msmaron]

Tom, makes sense...Where did you get that and ARE you running premium gas or regular unleaded gas..???

NOW you are saying basically the root of the problem is the gas in the line gets TOO HOT and basically boils with does not allow the vapor to escape and by insulating the line we hope to stop that...do i have this correct Tom?

Mark

[Tom Wesenberg]

Where I buy the good gas (a Marathon station) the pump is labeled PREMIUM 91 octane. I suppose all the good gas with no ethanol would be labeled PREMIUM, but don't know that for sure.

[msmaron]

Tom, this was my 60 T-Bird.. notice the insulation on the fuel line also., and this is original. SAME as you put on yours

[Louis]

Originally Posted by msmaron

Yes of course i have the pans and 2 blade fan.... It is based on the boiling of the fuel, thanks for posting

msmaron,
That's what i was saying, to much heat in the eng. comp.
No eng. was designed to vapor lock, and you should not have to put all kind,s of wraps, close pins, heat shield's, or pour cold water on it to make it work as it was designed. you seem to already have you mind made up as to what is not wrong,.... what ever you are doing is not working .
Still,.... good luck.

[Brian SATX]

A strange as it sounds, I had that problem about 15 years ago in Oregon of all places. Not that hot there. I did the wooden clothes pin thing and have not had a problem since, even in 105 temps here in the San Antonio area on long drives

[MBI Houston]

Can someone explain how clothes pins solve the vapor lock problem? Thanks

[tuneman]

The clothes pins draw the heat off the fuel line . Just like fins do on the rediator. When on tour with our local club and it gets hot we all move up one grade in gas.
Thus no problem with vaporlock. But I do keep a bag of wooden clothes pins in my car after seeing it work on a model a

[msmaron]

Originally Posted by tuneman

The clothes pins draw the heat off the fuel line . Just like fins do on the rediator. When on tour with our local club and it gets hot we all move up one grade in gas.
Thus no problem with vaporlock. But I do keep a bag of wooden clothes pins in my car after seeing it work on a model a

Ok can I see a pic of this closeline thing please
mark

[tamagrouchy]

Mark, I had vapor lock start to happen last year in that ridiculously hot weather at the MARC national last year. I made sure the spark was advanced, cranked the mixture open 1/2 turn (running rich will cool the exhaust a little as will the added spark advance) and pulled the throttle down a bit to idle faster. It was still grumpy, but never stalled. Also some of our club members swear by water wetter (I have never used it) to bring down the engine temp. Thanks to our Northern Illinois blended fuels, we have to fight with vapor lock. The best thing to do is try to keep the engine as cool as possible. Hope this helps. Guess you'' find out tomorrow.

[marc hildebrant]

Wood doesn't conduct heat very well. Some type of metal clip would be better ?

Marc

[msmaron]

Originally Posted by tamagrouchy

Mark, I had vapor lock start to happen last year in that ridiculously hot weather at the MARC national last year. I made sure the spark was advanced, cranked the mixture open 1/2 turn (running rich will cool the exhaust a little as will the added spark advance) and pulled the throttle down a bit to idle faster. It was still grumpy, but never stalled. Also some of our club members swear by water wetter (I have never used it) to bring down the engine temp. Thanks to our Northern Illinois blended fuels, we have to fight with vapor lock. The best thing to do is try to keep the engine as cool as possible. Hope this helps. Guess you'' find out tomorrow.

EXACTLY what I did this am to keep it lit and did not have any more problems. Tonight it was fine as it was much more cooler out.

[WTSHNN]

Originally Posted by msmaron

Ok can I see a pic of this closeline thing please
mark

It is exactly as it sounds. Take some clothes pins and just clip them onto the fuel line.

On the way to the 2002 MARC meet in Green Bay, the '28 Phaeton I was driving vapor locked and we ended up fixing it by taking tin foil from someone's lunch-doggy bag, wrapping it around the fuel line and holding it in place with some clothes pins. Seemed to work fine.

-Tim

[Special Coupe Frank]

Originally Posted by msmaron

EXACTLY what I did this am to keep it lit and did not have any more problems. Tonight it was fine as it was much more cooler out.

Mark,

What was the high temp out your way yesterday ( when you had the vapor-lock ) ?

We're expecting low 90's today, here in NE Penna... I'm wondering whether I should pack a cooler with ice, beer-can "foamy" , and clothespins ?

Frank

[msmaron]

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Originally Posted by WTSHNN

It is exactly as it sounds. Take some clothes pins and just clip them onto the fuel line.

On the way to the 2002 MARC meet in Green Bay, the '28 Phaeton I was driving vapor locked and we ended up fixing it by taking tin foil from someone's lunch-doggy bag, wrapping it around the fuel line and holding it in place with some clothes pins. Seemed to work fine.

-Tim

You know i fugured that was the fastest way to fix it... Does not cool it down but does prevent it. i still dont get this close line part??

[msmaron]

Originally Posted by Special Coupe Frank

Mark,

What was the high temp out your way yesterday ( when you had the vapor-lock ) ?

We're expecting low 90's today, here in NE Penna... I'm wondering whether I should pack a cooler with ice, beer-can "foamy" , and clothespins ?

Frank

Frank pack a lunch and extra soda.. We were at about 89 and funny the previous day we were at 92 and it was fine...

[Franchise_24]

Originally Posted by msmaron

Ok can I see a pic of this closeline thing please
mark

I don't have a pic, but picture closepins nicely spread out all the way down the fuel line to the carb. It doesn't look the greatest, but we have a member in our club that does it, and it does the trick for him.

Neal

[tamagrouchy]

I bet the wood clothes pins are actually acting as insulators, enough of them would cover a substantial amount of surface area. Just my 2 cents, no change given.

[msmaron]

The goofiest thing i think i have heard and who do you think came up with that one?

[Special Coupe Frank]

I first saw the clothespin trick on Great Race cars when that event came through Wilkes-Barre, in the late 1980's...

I often see it employed on flatty-Ford V-8s...

I have never been convinced of the ability of the wooden clothespin to radiate heat from the fuel line; I have a little more faith that it might provide some insulating benefit...

The most interesting theory is that the clothespins absorb/dampen vibrations that if left un-checked might provoke already-warm fuel to flash into a vapor state... there's certainly enough ambient vibration present in a stock Model A to make this plausible...

Perhaps a combination of:

Ethanated fuels

Crud in the fuel system / valves / sediment bowls

Restricted or blocked gas-cap vents

Vibration

High ambient air temp and high relative humidity

Failing coil and /or Condensor


might all conspire to create a "vapor lock" scenario...


Over the years, on "modern" fuel-pump cars & trucks, I've had my share of roadside grief resulting from rust / crud in the tank, perforated suction line between tank & pump, failing fuel pump, blocked gas-cap vent, and coil failure when hot...

I don't think I've encountered true "vapor lock" yet.... am wondering if it will happen with my trusty, crusty '28 this summer ?

Hope you get it licked, Mark !

[anut]

hey mark please forget about vapor lock you have other problems could be the coil or condenser i would try coil first

[msmaron]

New coil and tested, as well as the condenser. But maybe i will swap them out
but dont think it is them, what makes you think that?

[Bob A.]

Originally Posted by anut

hey mark please forget about vapor lock you have other problems could be the coil or condenser i would try coil first

Anut, Great suggestion, Mark also check your vent in the gas cap.
Condenser and coil can break down with heat.
Mark when you get this "vapor lock" try opening the gas cap and listen closely for air rushing in. With a faulty vent you create a vacuum in the tank which will starve the engine of fuel.
Good luck