How do I check king pins for wear, 41 coupe

[corvette8n]

How do I check King pins for wear?, winter project might be rebuilding front suspension. Best place to get parts(tie rod ends, King pins, and whatever else I need).

[Seth Swoboda]

Jack up the front end. Then grab the top of the tire and push/pull back and forth. Feel for slop in the king pins or have someone else move the tire and you watch. I'm going to do this job on a '47 tudor over the winter.

New king pins and bushings are available from the common suppliers. I know Speedway offers them. I've been thinking about looking for some NOS king pins because I know the quality of the Ford parts but then again the Speedway ones are probably just as good. I know my local NAPA store can get them too.

[19Fordy]

Don't know how good they are but I recall seeing ball bearing style front wheel bearings being available. Suppose to make steering easier, sort of like power steering?
Here's some good discussion about king pin bushings vs. needle bearings.
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/t...update.367693/
Speedway Needle bearing kit is here.
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Royal-...-Set,4037.html
But wait, there's more.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SSBC-Perform...ZXpZ~3&vxp=mtr
Or, if you have plenty of loot and plan to outlive your car there's this option.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SSBC-Perform...ZXpZ~3&vxp=mtr

[Seth Swoboda]

Originally Posted by 19Fordy

Don't know how good they are but I recall seeing ball bearing style front wheel bearings being available. Suppose to make steering easier, sort of like power steering?
Here's some good discussion about king pin bushings vs. needle bearings.
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/t...update.367693/
Speedway Needle bearing kit is here.
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Royal-...-Set,4037.html
But wait, there's more.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SSBC-Perform...ZXpZ~3&vxp=mtr

I think those kits have had bad reviews. Perhaps JM could chime in on this again?

[woodiewagon46]

To add what Seth recommends, while the car is on jack stands get in the car and have someone watch the front end as you turn the steering left and right to observe how much "slop" you have in the ball joints and steering. Also check the shackles for wear. If the front end has never been rebuilt it probably can use a rebuild.

[drolston]

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Unless you plan to put 100,000 miles on your '41, stay with the old style bushings, versus needle bearings. Easier installation, and cheaper. It has been 50 years since I did king pins; can you still get a king pin kit that comes with a reamer?

[JSeery]

Well you can get the reamers! A lot of recommendations for honing them now days.

[Bluebell]

The bit that Seth missed out after his first paragraph was:
Once you have established there is play (a vertical wobble) you then have someone apply the brakes.
Then you check it again. If it still wobbles you have king pin movement. If it has diminished, then some of the play is in the wheel bearings. if the play is gone, it is all in the wheel bearings.

[Seth Swoboda]

Originally Posted by Bluebell

The bit that Seth missed out after his first paragraph was:
Once you have established there is play (a vertical wobble) you then have someone apply the brakes.
Then you check it again. If it still wobbles you have king pin movement. If it has diminished, then some of the play is in the wheel bearings. if the play is gone, it is all in the wheel bearings.

Good point. When I checked mine I had my dad move the tire back and forth while I visually inspected the king pin movement. I also tightened the wheel bearings while I was at it and still experienced the "play".

[scooder]

Reamers work plain and simple. And have done since before the automobile came along. Most issues from a king pin with reamed bushings are due to adjustable reamers not set at correct size. Use the correct size solid tool. And line it up properly.
Not sure why honeing has become " the way to do it"? Maybe because it's something else that they can sell you?
Can a needle bearing be as tight as a proper sized bushing?
Martin.

[flatheadmurre]

Bushing or bearing can be as good when it comes to specs.
Bearings are more sensitive to particles so not sure how they improved the sealing ?
Next problem is if you run a bearing in the same position for a long time(straight forward) you get brinelling.
Not sure if it will be an issue but comes to mind.
If you get at it with the greasegun frequently perhaps you could keep the dirt out...

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by scooder

Can a needle bearing be as tight as a proper sized bushing?
Martin.

As a matter of fact, tighter, because the needle bearing rolls on the oiled surface and can be tighter.
I installed them on my car over 12 years ago and have not had any issues.

[rotorwrench]

I've noticed that some of the king pin kits have the vertical thrust bearings with ball bearings that are a lot smaller diameter than the OEM ones had. Ford 7/8" pin kit sizes may be better than the Merc 15/16" pin sizes though. Sometimes they try to pawn off thrust washers instead of bearings and that just makes me steam. I purchased the king pin reamers off of flea-pay and they were still like new. Hone material can get embedded in the soft phosphor bronze bushings and cause premature wear so I stick with the line reamers that were made for the king pins. They are not like the standard adjustable types. I wouldn't use them since they aren't set up to pilot the bores and they have a tendency to chatter.

[oldford2]

Originally Posted by 51 MERC-CT

As a matter of fact, tighter, because the needle bearing rolls on the oiled surface and can be tighter.
I installed them on my car over 12 years ago and have not had any issues.

12 years but how many miles?
Thanks
John

[Sixseven]

I'd second Rotorwrench on the honing. Soft bushings will hold abrasive particles. Hard surfaces like brake cyclinders are more reliably honed without impregnating the metal with the abrasive.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by oldford2

12 years but how many miles?
Thanks
John

Thanks for asking because it spurred me on to do an inspection of the installation. Found no detectable movement and no binding but found that I needed to re-adjust the wheel bearings.
Also after checking the service log, found that in the first 12 years to 2003 (when I installed the king pins), I put on 27000 miles.
I know that I have not been using the car much and that is reflected by the low mileage. So since the king pins were installed in the car 13 years ago it has been driven 8500 miles.
PS. The 2003 price for the SSBC Royal king pin set was $195.00

[rich b]

While I always ream kingpin bushings; kinda curious about the comments stating that a Sunnen hone will create a killer problem by leaving abrasive particles in kingpin bushings, when the same machine is used to hone more critical piston pin bushings?

[rotorwrench]

Many piston pins are sized by an expansion process where draw a sizing ball through the bushing. This sizes it and expands it into the rod for a good grip. I use reamers on some Harley Davidson piston pins but they are set up with an alignment block so I can do them while the bottom end is still assembled.

The different Sunnen hone set ups and machines are fantastic for what they are set up to do. I have to follow Aviation standards and most don't use them on soft bushings so I've always made that a practice. You can get a reamer to do just about any resizing operation but they have to be purpose built too. Screw type sliding taper adjustable reamers are only good for non critical parts. A lot of the king pin reamers are expandable with slots cut into the flutes to allow them to expand a bit. They use a tapered ram inside to force the reamer flutes out to a larger size. They are very limited on how far they can bend the flutes.

[flatheadmurre]

The sunnen hone uses different stones and guides depending on aplication and you can hone soft metals without an issue doing it right.
If you use an iron setup honing lets say aluminum you have a disaster coming real quick.
But that it don´t work is not the absolute truth.
As everything else it has to be done the correct way.