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Old 04-07-2021, 05:05 PM   #21
35fordtn
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

To the original poster are you running reproduction shoes? If so you need to grind .020" off the tabs of the shoes where the cylinder pistons push against. The reproduction shoes are made with the tab too long causing the cups to push in too far into the wheel cylinder. We include a note dictating such in all the shoes we sell. This is only a issue if your drums measure less than around 12.030". What exactly is your issue in not getting them to bleed right? Soft pedal? If it is a soft pedal use good reproduction cylinders and check out the shoe issue I mentioned and you'll be set.

No need as others have mentioned to bench bleed a master cylinder. .... Check for minimal leaks as well! Are you using copper washers between the front hoses and the cylinders? if not, do so.
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Old 04-08-2021, 06:16 AM   #22
mike42
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

Woodie.....

I have tried to adjust the new shoes the best I can to answer the question. What I have not done is adjust the new shoes so they touch the drum just enough for wheel not to turn and then try to bleed right rear wheel. That's the next step along with plugging the split-off adapter at rear of the master cylinder so that the fluid only goes to the rears to see if that helps in the bleeding process. My problem also is that the weather has been so nice that I've spent more time cleaning up the property from the Winter mess, but I will get back to it soon. I need to get that car back on the road. I love driving it !!

Thx.....Mike
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Old 04-08-2021, 09:43 AM   #23
glennpm
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

Hi Mike,


Regarding shoe adjustment, tighten as you mention but then back them off so the wheel/tie CAN be moved. It may scrape just a bit in one spot but you don't want them so tight that the wheel/tie can't be moved. If you did it that wrong way, as the the drum heats up you will have very heavy drag and could even lock the wheels up just do to the heat expansion.


Glenn
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Old 04-08-2021, 10:46 AM   #24
Bob C
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

You say you have a bleeding problem, what exactly is the problem??
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Old 04-08-2021, 12:41 PM   #25
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

Make sure the master cylinder pushrod is retracting completely. There should be approx. 1/4" pedal free movement before the pushrod contacts the master cylinder piston. If this is too tight the piston can't retract fully and you'll have a problem getting all the air out of the system. Also, if driven like this the brakes will drag when they heat up.
Good luck!
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Old 04-08-2021, 05:38 PM   #26
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

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35 ....I may have to pull them all apart to check out the tab issue I can't resolve this. As far as the bleeding....I mist have filled the Master 50 times and started with right rear....I get bubbles and bubbles and bubbles, but never a pure steam of fluid. Sometimes nothing comes out. Pedal goes right to the floor ! New master and all new wheel cylinders.

Glenn ....I'm going to try that tightening next. Car is at my buddy's shop and he's looking at it also.

Bob .....all new cylinders and shoes and cannot get a good solid flow of fluid no matter how many times I pump the brakes. Pedal got right to the floor. I keep refilling the master and get a flow with bubbles, but then nothing. Put in more fluid and same old things !!

Double .....I'm checking that 1/4" clearance out for sure.

Thx....Mike
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Old 04-08-2021, 05:39 PM   #27
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

PS - I'm using a very good vacuum pump that gives up to 25 lbs. of pressure and still no luck.
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Old 04-08-2021, 06:05 PM   #28
fortyfords
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

When you are having this much trouble, you don't want to use a vacuum pump, you have to have pressure so you don't draw any air in through a minute leak. Otherwise you will be chasing your tail forever. You are probably getting the bubbles by air being sucked in past the threads of the bleeder screw and a little bit from where the bleeder hose is connected to the bleeder screw. So remove the bleeder screw and put teflon tape around the threads and screw in partially, Blue monster on the threads is good also. Once you get no bubbles, that bleeder can be screwed in and go to the next one. Don't pump the brake pedal either, just have someone hold the pedal down lightly. Give that a try
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Old 04-08-2021, 06:25 PM   #29
Hal Beatty
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

Speed Bleeders work great, at least in my opinion. Put some teflon tape or paste on the threads when you install them and bleed away...
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Old 04-08-2021, 06:55 PM   #30
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike42 View Post
PS - I'm using a very good vacuum pump that gives up to 25 lbs. of pressure and still no luck.
Sounds like the method may be part or all of the problem. I like to step on the pedal (requires a helper) and then crack the bleeder screw for just a second or so. Re-tighen it, have the helper let off the pedal, than step on the pedal again and repeat the process. Some times I have to except "as good as I can get" and move to the next wheel. After two or three times around they should be firm if there is not another issue.
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Old 04-09-2021, 08:10 AM   #31
1931 flamingo
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

I'm in CT but is there anyone close to mike42 who could physically help????

Thanks, Paul
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Old 04-10-2021, 06:59 AM   #32
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

Morning guys......

I'm going to use the sealer material for bleeder vales for sure. That was never mentioned before. I think I have a tube of that and will look today.

Hal.....I am using Speed Bleeders which surprises me that I having so much trouble.

The one thing I not doing is having someone pump the brake to help me. Rather I've been using the Vacuum pump and maybe that is my whole problem. My next step is to block off the front brakes via the split fitting at end of Master with a plug and see if I can get the backs bled with a friend of mines help.

The drama goes on for sure, but thx for all the suggestions and help !

Mike
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Old 04-10-2021, 07:11 PM   #33
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

Dump the vacuum. I work alone and have just done a complete brake system replacement on my new to me 41 . I also did the lines . I fabricated a broom stick to hold the pedal down . Its placed on the bottm front of the seat . As a mechanic , we had a locking extension rod that was used for this purpose.
Just push the pedal down , insert rod and go bleed . Short releases of fluid . As the pedal gets firmer and higher , adjust the seat to fit your rod .
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Old 04-11-2021, 06:11 AM   #34
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

Hi Mike,

Looked back through this whole thread and don't see that you mention if you have a hard pedal even though you are seeing bubbles. Is the pedal firm?

The reason I ask is that I'm a one man "shop" myself and use a vacuum pump for bleeding most of the time. When bleeding with the pump you will see bubbles with vacuum if you only just crack open the bleeder. I put a box wrench over the bleeder, positioned so I can get a good quarter turn on the bleeder, then slide a hose over the bleeder. Probably at least most of the time, I can get a steady fluid stream by turning the bleeder about an 1/8 of a turn.

After I bleed the brakes, I let it sit over night with a 2X4, keeping pressure on the pedal by bracing off the seat like Ggmac says. This keeps the Master cylinder port open with the system under pressure, air bubbles will migrate into thee master cylinder.

Glenn
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Old 04-13-2021, 11:28 PM   #35
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

Perhaps drums have been turned too large?
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Old 04-15-2021, 09:14 AM   #36
mike42
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

Will answer more later as I have had to spend time cleaning up the property from Winter storms and the place is a mess. Snowing again today for second time this week. I'll be getting back to the car soon though. I can't do it all at the same time.

Mike
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Old 04-15-2021, 09:16 AM   #37
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

Glenn ....I do like the 2x4 idea !!
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Old 04-16-2021, 09:51 AM   #38
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

Yeah, it works good for the final bubbles.


Glenn
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Old 04-16-2021, 10:19 AM   #39
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

But it is SO much easier with two people!
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Old 08-26-2021, 10:51 PM   #40
Clem Clement
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Default Re: '40 Brake Bleeding

Mike 42
I spent a lot of time at Eilson AFB, Fairbanks, flying north. 61-63.Weather recce and sniffing. Clem

Last edited by Clem Clement; 08-29-2021 at 09:32 PM.
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