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Old 05-31-2020, 02:15 PM   #1
Oberfranke
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Default torque all head nuts

I have a question about torquing the cylinder head nuts after changing the head gasket. I have a copper head gasket.
My workshop says I should torquing the nuts again after about 300 miles.
The workshop has torqued with 52 ft lbs (70Nm).
Would it be better to tighten the nuts more often, so not to wait 300 miles?
Are 52 ft lbs sufficient or maybe almost too much?
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Old 05-31-2020, 02:39 PM   #2
Patrick L.
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

It won't hurt to torque them sooner and most tighten them to 55#. Check them every now and again until you know they'll stay put.
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Old 05-31-2020, 04:46 PM   #3
Werner
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

Hallo Bajuware,

the Cu-seals settle through the effects of temperature and vibrations. Therefore, they have to be tightened after about 10 hours of operation.

There are two variants: loosen every single nut to eliminate the loosening torque, then tighten it to the original value.

Or add 1/8 U. If the previous tightening was done correctly, this is the better method.
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Old 05-31-2020, 05:00 PM   #4
Gary WA
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

Model A Ford Garage ~ Brumfield Cylinder Head Gasket Instructionss
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Old 05-31-2020, 05:01 PM   #5
Gary WA
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

follow the instructions in post #4 you will have no problems!! Thanks to Larry B.
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Old 05-31-2020, 05:02 PM   #6
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

New head and gasket here, have checked/re-torqued three times in two weeks.

I put a lot of miles on mine as it is a daily driver, weather permitting.
Will check the torque in two weeks to ensure I'm still at 65 lbs
(Hi comp head/gasket recommends 65 lbs)
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Old 05-31-2020, 08:58 PM   #7
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

Personally I torque the head nuts very often on a new head installation until I am completely comfortable that they have settled in and are holding consistent torque.
You can not torque too many times. However you can torque too much. (too high)
No fun having a freshly installed head develop a leak and fill a cylinder after it cools down and sits overnight if a quick check with a torque wrench after driving it could have prevented it from happening.
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Old 05-31-2020, 09:27 PM   #8
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

I torque all my head bolt nuts to 55lbs except for the two holding the water neck which I do to 50lbs. I have noticed that one of the head bolts is showing more thread then the rest as I had them all to one thread showing above nut.

Is this bolt creeping out on me and why? Is the only remedy to remove the head AGAIN and run this bolt down and the start the retorquing process?

After reading post #4 I have to wonder how many here use this method of torqueing / retorqueing? I understand Mr. Brumfield knows much more then I about the Model A heads but I cannot understand why backing off each nut 1/8 turn helps this process. I always thought the ultimate goal here was to get each nut torqued to 55lbs. and for them to STAY at 55lbs. With this method you would never know if any nuts have come loose. Can someone explain this?
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Old 06-01-2020, 01:15 PM   #9
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

This should answer your questions: And Thanks To Larry Brumfield for info!!
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Old 06-01-2020, 02:47 PM   #10
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cape Codder View Post
After reading post #4 I have to wonder how many here use this method of torqueing / retorqueing? I understand Mr. Brumfield knows much more then I about the Model A heads but I cannot understand why backing off each nut 1/8 turn helps this process. I always thought the ultimate goal here was to get each nut torqued to 55lbs. and for them to STAY at 55lbs. With this method you would never know if any nuts have come loose. Can someone explain this?
In Larry Brumfield's info on 'Ford Garage' it states "You’ll know when you are done because the nuts will re-torque to the same position at full torque that they were when torqued on the previous re-torque."

The article also explains 'why' he recommends you should back off ⅛ turn.
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Old 06-01-2020, 02:48 PM   #11
Kurt in NJ
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

I did it different last time--- used head gasket, tightened with original tool kit wrench, about as tight as I could get it with one hand, backed off slightly, re tightened twice over 3 days, haven't touched them since, been over 30 years, no seeping,leaks, always antifreeze
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Old 06-01-2020, 03:21 PM   #12
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

You're awesome Kurt...
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Old 06-02-2020, 05:20 AM   #13
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

Guten Morgen!
Why do you tighten the head screws so often? So far I was of the opinion that once after 500 mls is enough.
I use the modern silicone head gasket.
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Old 06-02-2020, 11:13 AM   #14
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

I recommend torquing after about 5 minutes of running, before driving. Again after the first, short, outing and again after a few hundred miles. All gaskets are not the same, some are seated after the first re-torquing, many are not. You can't do it too often.
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Old 06-02-2020, 11:47 AM   #15
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Werner View Post
Guten Morgen!
Why do you tighten the head screws so often? So far I was of the opinion that once after 500 mls is enough.
I use the modern silicone head gasket.

As an FYI, many have had problems with the modern silicone head gasket. Here is one of many strings on this subject.


https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...ne+head+gasket
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Old 06-02-2020, 12:51 PM   #16
Dave in MN
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

Quote:
Originally Posted by 30 Closed Cab PU View Post
As an FYI, many have had problems with the modern silicone head gasket. Here is one of many strings on this subject.


https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...ne+head+gasket
Werner, Why re-tighten: The "Modern Silicone" head gasket requires the most cycles of re-tightening of any gasket I have used. Once seated after multiple tightening sessions, the gasket holds up quite well.
Good Day!
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Old 06-02-2020, 12:55 PM   #17
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

Quote:
Originally Posted by burner31 View Post
New head and gasket here, have checked/re-torqued three times in two weeks.

I put a lot of miles on mine as it is a daily driver, weather permitting.
Will check the torque in two weeks to ensure I'm still at 65 lbs
(Hi comp head/gasket recommends 65 lbs)

Keith,
Which head and manufacturer is suggesting 65# torque?
From my checking Snyder's website: Their Thomas, 6:1 and 5.5:1 heads all state 55#.
All their gaskets for high compression heads state 55#.
Most of the reading I do of spec's from the manufacturers of both heads and gaskets suggest a torque of 55#. If the head and block are "flat", 55# should do the job.

When I hear/read of 65# being recommended, it is from car owners.
My concern with 65# of torque is that it could pull a stud out of the block if the threads are compromised in the block. There is not much more of a sinking feeling than when the torque wrench keeps moving and the torque reading stays the same or decreases.
Thanks!

Last edited by Dave in MN; 06-02-2020 at 02:55 PM.
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Old 06-02-2020, 01:16 PM   #18
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

1. Many years ago I had an original 8.25 to 1 Thomas Aluminum head always used 55 ft lbs.

2. LionHead III 6.5 to one same torque (55) on this one also, worked fine.

3. Police head 5.2 "The head with the Large B" used 55 foot pounds here also.

Both engines had old original studs.

Last edited by Benson; 06-04-2020 at 06:49 PM.
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Old 06-03-2020, 11:14 AM   #19
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave in MN View Post
Keith,
Which head and manufacturer is suggesting 65# torque?
From my checking Snyder's website: Their Thomas, 6:1 and 5.5:1 heads all state 55#.
All their gaskets for high compression heads state 55#.
Most of the reading I do of spec's from the manufacturers of both heads and gaskets suggest a torque of 55#. If the head and block are "flat", 55# should do the job.

When I hear/read of 65# being recommended, it is from car owners.
My concern with 65# of torque is that it could pull a stud out of the block if the threads are compromised in the block. There is not much more of a sinking feeling than when the torque wrench keeps moving and the torque reading stays the same or decreases.
Thanks!

Bratton's, head gasket #8090, instructions in the package states 65 lbs.
Also installed new head studs and the 6 to 1 hi comp head #8010
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Old 06-04-2020, 05:17 PM   #20
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Default Re: torque all head nuts

Has anyone have any thoughts about my post #8 especially my question of the apparent bolt coming up above the head and WHY?
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