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Old 03-31-2020, 10:03 AM   #21
Bob C
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Default Re: Gen charging Q

The cutout on Hardtimes generator looks like it says Pos Grd so if you are
running negative ground the diode is fried.


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Old 03-31-2020, 10:15 AM   #22
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Default Re: Gen charging Q

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Originally Posted by Bob C View Post
The cutout on Hardtimes generator looks like it says Pos Grd so if you are
running negative ground the diode is fried.


Bob
The diode donīt fry...just doesnīt conduct any current...turn it around and there will be light
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Old 03-31-2020, 11:15 AM   #23
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Default Re: Gen charging Q

If itīs been on there backwards for a long time with battery hooked up it woud have drained the battery...and maybe done damage to the generator itself...
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Old 03-31-2020, 05:44 PM   #24
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Default Re: Gen charging Q

If adjusting the brushes in the generator does not alter the voltage at all, then move the 'Troubleshooting' mode.
1) Verify generator works: hook up battery directly to the generator. if the generator turns, the generator works.
2) On rare occasions, original type cut-outs can stick, thus draining the battery. I tap the top of the cut-out with the handle of a screwdriver and it releases the internal contact. (his does not apply to diode based cut-outs as they're designed differently)

If you've already solved the problem, great! If not, keep at it!
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Old 03-31-2020, 05:56 PM   #25
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The diode donīt fry...just doesnīt conduct any current...turn it around and there will be light



What was I thinking.
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Old 03-31-2020, 06:26 PM   #26
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Default Re: Gen charging Q

I would think a 3 brush generator is going to be 6 volt - and wouldn't be able to charge a 12 volt system. Or am I missing something?
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Old 03-31-2020, 06:40 PM   #27
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I would think a 3 brush generator is going to be 6 volt - and wouldn't be able to charge a 12 volt system. Or am I missing something?
You probably have to move the third brush a loooooooooong way.
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Old 03-31-2020, 08:24 PM   #28
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Default Re: Gen charging Q

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I would think a 3 brush generator is going to be 6 volt - and wouldn't be able to charge a 12 volt system. Or am I missing something?

What I said in post #12....
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Old 03-31-2020, 09:48 PM   #29
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Default Re: Gen charging Q

The three brush generator can charge an 12 volt battery, see
posts numbers 5 and 7 at the link. https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=278477


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Old 04-01-2020, 01:16 AM   #30
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Default Re: Gen charging Q

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Originally Posted by flatheadmurre View Post
If itīs been on there backwards for a long time with battery hooked up it woud have drained the battery...and maybe done damage to the generator itself...
Uh huh !
“Draining the battery”....is what has been happening !!
So...switch the two wire connections ?
Wow hoping it is that simple !

So, I’ve had it on a trickle charger 24/7.
Thought MAYBE bare wire short.
THANKS TO ALL you guys for your great diagnostics help.
I’ll let you know how things go.
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Old 04-01-2020, 01:19 AM   #31
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Default Re: Gen charging Q

Thing is with the 3-brush...they are a lot weaker then the later generator...you start pushing them hard they overheat and burn armatures.
A generator is same as motor it has a set power they can handle (watts..hp..whatever)
If you double the voltage and keep the same output current the generator is now working twice as hard...some does that without complaining...the armature of the 3-brush isnīt in the bunch that happily runs all day long...it will have a tough time dealing with the increased power output..
I would suggest going another route then converting 3-brush to 12v...a lot of things can be done...some is just not a first choice to do.
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Old 04-01-2020, 03:06 AM   #32
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hardtimes, the generator on your car is from a 1933 Ford. It has no cooling openings in the end plates which means it is not capable of any more safe maximum output than about 10 amps continuous operation. The 1934 Ford generator had cooling openings in the end housing and an integral fan cast into the pulley which means it had a higher safe output of approx. 15 amps. Your generator third brush setting should be set at no more than 10 amps maximum. If it is set higher than that, then the result will be a burnt out armature. The ""TRANSPO"" diode cut out will work OK on both 6 and 12 volts. It will also work OK on NEG or POS ground by turning it around on its mounting and swapping the two connections around. Take notice of the instruction sticker on the side of the cut out. I don't like using a 6 volt generator in a 12 volt system. One drawback is that the generator will have to be revved up higher before it starts to charge. 6 volt generators were designed to operate in 6 volt systems by electrical engineers and do not operate to their best on 12 volt systems. You cant just guess at what you are doing with this stuff, it has to be done correctly otherwise you will be in more trouble than Jessie James. Regards, Kevin.
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Old 04-01-2020, 05:09 PM   #33
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hardtimes, the generator on your car is from a 1933 Ford. It has no cooling openings in the end plates which means it is not capable of any more safe maximum output than about 10 amps continuous operation. The 1934 Ford generator had cooling openings in the end housing and an integral fan cast into the pulley which means it had a higher safe output of approx. 15 amps. Your generator third brush setting should be set at no more than 10 amps maximum. If it is set higher than that, then the result will be a burnt out armature. The ""TRANSPO"" diode cut out will work OK on both 6 and 12 volts. It will also work OK on NEG or POS ground by turning it around on its mounting and swapping the two connections around. Take notice of the instruction sticker on the side of the cut out. I don't like using a 6 volt generator in a 12 volt system. One drawback is that the generator will have to be revved up higher before it starts to charge. 6 volt generators were designed to operate in 6 volt systems by electrical engineers and do not operate to their best on 12 volt systems. You cant just guess at what you are doing with this stuff, it has to be done correctly otherwise you will be in more trouble than Jessie James. Regards, Kevin.
Ha ha...more trouble than Jesse James !
I'm had some 'trouble', more or less most of life...Jesse was a friend of mine !!

Anyway, you say its a '33. I believe it, as this is on my '32 five window.
The coupe was restored sometime back and has done ok yet. But, this electrical thingy ,i.e.- part 12V (battry) and part 6V who knows what is total BS, eh !

I'm thinking the OLD dude or some dummy just installed a 12v
battery in a stock duece.
If so, that would explain several things...namely, NO lights ! Most likely blew every bulb in the car ?

Guess I'd better start digging into what this mess consists of. I can't believe someone would do that and it never occurred to me. time for a systtem check.
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Old 04-01-2020, 06:50 PM   #34
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That's not unusual for someone not in the know to do a 12 volt conversion by just fitting a 12 volt battery and then the jobs done. Ha Ha. Well check it all out and report back. Maybe easier to refit a 6 volt battery, replace all the blown globes and you are good to go. Nothing wrong with a 6 volt system if all components are up to scratch. Regards, Kevin.
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Old 04-02-2020, 12:35 AM   #35
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Guess things never worked before. So eager to change it after 80 plus years. 12volt battery!!!

Last edited by Tinker; 04-02-2020 at 12:42 AM.
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Old 04-04-2020, 01:28 AM   #36
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be sure to check that the belt tension is correct and that the belt is not slipping, if it is this could be the problem
Hey Jim,
Thanks, the belt is new and appears to be without wear. It is snug fit on pulley.
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Old 04-04-2020, 01:36 AM   #37
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Default Re: Gen charging Q

Quote:
Originally Posted by koates View Post
hardtimes, the generator on your car is from a 1933 Ford. It has no cooling openings in the end plates which means it is not capable of any more safe maximum output than about 10 amps continuous operation. The 1934 Ford generator had cooling openings in the end housing and an integral fan cast into the pulley which means it had a higher safe output of approx. 15 amps. Your generator third brush setting should be set at no more than 10 amps maximum. If it is set higher than that, then the result will be a burnt out armature. The ""TRANSPO"" diode cut out will work OK on both 6 and 12 volts. It will also work OK on NEG or POS ground by turning it around on its mounting and swapping the two connections around. Take notice of the instruction sticker on the side of the cut out. I don't like using a 6 volt generator in a 12 volt system. One drawback is that the generator will have to be revved up higher before it starts to charge. 6 volt generators were designed to operate in 6 volt systems by electrical engineers and do not operate to their best on 12 volt systems. You cant just guess at what you are doing with this stuff, it has to be done correctly otherwise you will be in more trouble than Jessie James. Regards, Kevin.
Hey koates,
Question:
Who ever put the 12V battery in, maybe did not polarize system , when doing so. If I remember correctly, an electrical system in an auto will NOT charge if not polarize ?? is that so ?
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Old 04-04-2020, 01:41 AM   #38
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My understanding... why you polarize a system. To change the polar magnetism. It's some wizard stuff that I'm not clear on or agree. I've always done it with regulars anyway (fields etc). Because they said so.


Putting a 12v on a 6 volt system has complications not related to polarization. Going from positive to negative ground is less important. You can do that with 6 volts and don't need to polarize anything on a regular stock cutout.



On a diode. https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/polarity/all


Battery has poles already setup. Generator spins in one direction only no matter the current direction. Greater minds will add.

Last edited by Tinker; 04-04-2020 at 02:38 AM.
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