Go Back   The Ford Barn > General Discussion > Early V8 (1932-53)

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-01-2019, 05:28 PM   #1
jrvariel48
Senior Member
 
jrvariel48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 958
Default Camden Supercharger

Is anyone running a Camden Supercharger or even just have one?
I'm running one in my 35 coupe and I wanted to compare notes.
I get around 4lbs of boost at 4000 rpm with the pulleys that came with the set up. Thanks Joe
jrvariel48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2019, 04:07 PM   #2
jrvariel48
Senior Member
 
jrvariel48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 958
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

No one?!
jrvariel48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Old 03-02-2019, 04:34 PM   #3
Mike in AZ
Senior Member
 
Mike in AZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Waddell, AZ
Posts: 2,533
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

Have never see one. On a flathead? Got pics. Mike
Mike in AZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2019, 04:45 PM   #4
tjw
Senior Member
 
tjw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Australia
Posts: 241
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

Camden blower
Attached Images
File Type: jpg jerry 12.jpg (61.6 KB, 189 views)
File Type: jpg jerry 13.jpg (76.6 KB, 144 views)
tjw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2019, 05:04 PM   #5
rotorwrench
Senior Member
 
rotorwrench's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Posts: 10,623
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

I remember your thread from back in 2014. Most folks go for the Roadrunner engineering Weiand kits or H&H Flathead's Navarro 471 or SCoT blower set ups. The Camden doesn't garner a lot of attention in the flathead performance area since they are advertised for smaller displacement engines or rotary engines for Mazda cars. It's kind of out of the Ford Barn theme of things too. The HAMB may have some other folks that have them.
rotorwrench is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2019, 07:58 PM   #6
Fordors
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Orland Park,IL
Posts: 1,337
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

The Camden flathead kit along with their other V8 offerings were dropped when the company was sold quite a few years ago.
They had Chevy small and big block kits, Buick, Chevy and Ford V6 kits but the new owners concentrated on small four cylinder stuff.
__________________
My school colors are black and blue, I attended the School of Hard Knocks where I received a Masters Degree in Chronic Mopery.
Fordors is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2019, 10:10 AM   #7
jrvariel48
Senior Member
 
jrvariel48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 958
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fordors View Post
The Camden flathead kit along with their other V8 offerings were dropped when the company was sold quite a few years ago.
They had Chevy small and big block kits, Buick, Chevy and Ford V6 kits but the new owners concentrated on small four cylinder stuff.
Yes, I believe it was in 1990/91
jrvariel48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2019, 10:14 AM   #8
jrvariel48
Senior Member
 
jrvariel48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 958
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

Quote:
Originally Posted by rotorwrench View Post
I remember your thread from back in 2014. Most folks go for the Roadrunner engineering Weiand kits or H&H Flathead's Navarro 471 or SCoT blower set ups. The Camden doesn't garner a lot of attention in the flathead performance area since they are advertised for smaller displacement engines or rotary engines for Mazda cars. It's kind of out of the Ford Barn theme of things too. The HAMB may have some other folks that have them.
The cu.in. for the Camden is 144, B&M 144, Weiand 142 & Scot is 172 but untouchable price wise. The 471
jrvariel48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2019, 08:52 PM   #9
saltracer
Member
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Lafayette, La.
Posts: 74
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

I believe Speedway used to sell the Camden supercharger in a kit for Flatheads years ago.
saltracer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2019, 09:54 PM   #10
Ronnieroadster
Senior Member
 
Ronnieroadster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: East Coast in CT
Posts: 638
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

Joe while i have no experience with the camden blower I remember years back when they were first offered I spent time looking them over. Since your getting 4 lbs of boost at 4 grand at this point thats not to bad. To gain more boost the drive ratio needs to be adjusted so going down 1/4 inch in diameter on the blower would give you another 2 to 3 pounds. If going smaller on the upper pulley is not possible doing the same by increasing the lower pulley diameter would also give you more boost.
Something to remember about the Flathead port design seeing high boost readings is not truly an indication of the pressure the cylinder is seeing. The poor port design is actually a choke to the boost so the high readings are caused by a backup of flow.
Back when i ran my 671 GMC combination I would always see over 20 pounds of boost with no ill effects to the engine even in street driven form as long as a good octane gas was being used when the boost was getting high. That old reliable 671 combination is waiting for a new owner complete bolt on for the Flathead as some say go big or go home. LOL
Ronnieroadster
__________________
I use the F word a lot no not that word these words Flathead , Focus and Finish.
"Life Member of the Bonneville 200 MPH Club using a Ford Flathead block"
Owner , Builder and Driver of the First Ford Flathead bodied roadster to run 200 MPH Record run July 13, 2018 LTA timing association 200.921 from a standing start in one and a half miles burning gasoline.
Ronnieroadster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2019, 04:23 AM   #11
jrvariel48
Senior Member
 
jrvariel48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 958
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronnieroadster View Post
Joe while i have no experience with the camden blower I remember years back when they were first offered I spent time looking them over. Since your getting 4 lbs of boost at 4 grand at this point thats not to bad. To gain more boost the drive ratio needs to be adjusted so going down 1/4 inch in diameter on the blower would give you another 2 to 3 pounds. If going smaller on the upper pulley is not possible doing the same by increasing the lower pulley diameter would also give you more boost.
Something to remember about the Flathead port design seeing high boost readings is not truly an indication of the pressure the cylinder is seeing. The poor port design is actually a choke to the boost so the high readings are caused by a backup of flow.
Back when i ran my 671 GMC combination I would always see over 20 pounds of boost with no ill effects to the engine even in street driven form as long as a good octane gas was being used when the boost was getting high. That old reliable 671 combination is waiting for a new owner complete bolt on for the Flathead as some say go big or go home. LOL
Ronnieroadster
Hey RR thanks for your reply. I contacted Atkins Rotary which is the company producing the Camden superchargers. They make a blower drive pulley that they told me would produce 10lbs. Do you think that would be safe in a fresh built motor with no heavy center crank cap? Is there anyway for me to come up with an idea on what the cylinder pressure would be?
Thanks again, Joe
jrvariel48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2019, 08:27 AM   #12
Ol' Ron
Senior Member
 
Ol' Ron's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Chester Vt
Posts: 7,154
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

The Magnason blower kit for the Flathead uses an Eaton ny-pass blower. On My friends 294 engine it produces 235 hp at 4500 (red line) with only 3 1/2 to 5 lbs boost. Blower comes in at WOT around 3000. The engine could probably produce more power, however the cost of building it doesn't justify blowing it up just to see how much power it could make. Runs great on the street driving a C4 auto into a 3.08 rear giving great gas milage in cruise.
Ol' Ron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2019, 08:46 AM   #13
revkev6
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: western Mass
Posts: 365
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrvariel48 View Post
Hey RR thanks for your reply. I contacted Atkins Rotary which is the company producing the Camden superchargers. They make a blower drive pulley that they told me would produce 10lbs. Do you think that would be safe in a fresh built motor with no heavy center crank cap? Is there anyway for me to come up with an idea on what the cylinder pressure would be?
Thanks again, Joe

joe, I'm in the process of building my own eaton based unit. joe abbin has a nice formula for determining rough boost levels. i would input your current setup and run the numbers to see how accurate they are to your setup then modify his "fudge factor" number to match your setup. after that play with the target boost numbers to get you a ratio that will work for you.



I don't know who I would trust more with a boosted motor, the guy who builds and dynos them and literally wrote the book, or the guy who just broke his own record with a blown flathead on the salt AGAIN.....



we really do live great times to have this sort of blown flathead experience at our fingertips!!


here is Joe's formula copy and pasted from www.roadrunnerengineering.com
There is no simple, accurate relationship for estimating boost and pulley size because of all the variables involved. Roger Huntington in his 1950 book Souping the Stock Engine had a reasonable estimating equation:
R = (A x D)/(K x V) where,
R is the blower drive ratio (crank pulley dia/blower pulley dia)
A is the desired manifold pressure in atmospheres (14.7 psia = 1 atmosphere)
D is the engine displacement in cu.in.
V is the Roots blower displacement in cu.in./revolution
K is a constant determined by experience. I use 1.8 .
For example, assume a 276 cu.in. engine, a 142 cu.in./rev blower (e.g. Weiand 142) and 6.6 psi boost,
A = (14.7+6.6)/14.7 = 1.45
R = (1.45 x 276)/(1.8 x 142) = 1.56
Not too bad compared to 1.5 in the example on page 49 of Blown Flathead. I use Engine Analyzer Pro software for more accurate estimates. A more complete engine analysis can be done using the Analysis Worksheet included on this web page.
revkev6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2019, 03:14 PM   #14
Ronnieroadster
Senior Member
 
Ronnieroadster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: East Coast in CT
Posts: 638
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

Hi Joe
I would use Joe Abins formula for a guesstimate on what you would get like Revkev6 has written. However i would not be to concerned with the potential of 8 to 10 pounds of boost on your engine. Revkev I not only reset our record on the salt but also have many thousands of miles on the roads with three different blower combinations. Average HP on the street over 300. All trouble free miles even when using the options. that being the loud pedal. Returning again to the salt this year to see if more speed can be added to my top speed to date with my old trusty valve in block Flathead Ford V-8 block. More fun to still to be had i hope LOL
Ronnieroadster
__________________
I use the F word a lot no not that word these words Flathead , Focus and Finish.
"Life Member of the Bonneville 200 MPH Club using a Ford Flathead block"
Owner , Builder and Driver of the First Ford Flathead bodied roadster to run 200 MPH Record run July 13, 2018 LTA timing association 200.921 from a standing start in one and a half miles burning gasoline.
Ronnieroadster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2019, 05:53 PM   #15
jrvariel48
Senior Member
 
jrvariel48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 958
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

Quote:
Originally Posted by revkev6 View Post
joe, I'm in the process of building my own eaton based unit. joe abbin has a nice formula for determining rough boost levels. i would input your current setup and run the numbers to see how accurate they are to your setup then modify his "fudge factor" number to match your setup. after that play with the target boost numbers to get you a ratio that will work for you.



I don't know who I would trust more with a boosted motor, the guy who builds and dynos them and literally wrote the book, or the guy who just broke his own record with a blown flathead on the salt AGAIN.....



we really do live great times to have this sort of blown flathead experience at our fingertips!!


here is Joe's formula copy and pasted from www.roadrunnerengineering.com
There is no simple, accurate relationship for estimating boost and pulley size because of all the variables involved. Roger Huntington in his 1950 book Souping the Stock Engine had a reasonable estimating equation:
R = (A x D)/(K x V) where,
R is the blower drive ratio (crank pulley dia/blower pulley dia)
A is the desired manifold pressure in atmospheres (14.7 psia = 1 atmosphere)
D is the engine displacement in cu.in.
V is the Roots blower displacement in cu.in./revolution
K is a constant determined by experience. I use 1.8 .
For example, assume a 276 cu.in. engine, a 142 cu.in./rev blower (e.g. Weiand 142) and 6.6 psi boost,
A = (14.7+6.6)/14.7 = 1.45
R = (1.45 x 276)/(1.8 x 142) = 1.56
Not too bad compared to 1.5 in the example on page 49 of Blown Flathead. I use Engine Analyzer Pro software for more accurate estimates. A more complete engine analysis can be done using the Analysis Worksheet included on this web page.
Thanks for the response Rev. I'm using Joe's formula and actually spoke with him a bunch of times. He's a great guy to talk to, very helpful and friendly! With his formula I'm coming up with about 3.7 lbs of boost using a 1.3 as a constant because this motor is a stock 59L. My boost gauge shows 4lbs at about 4000 rpm so I'm comfortable with that formula. At light throttle, going uphill, I get a pound or two of boost depending on how much I put my foot in it. I'm also running a four barrel Holley 4160 carb. The torque is awesome. I'm building a 4" stroke motor now with all the goodies except the heavy center main cap and I wanted to give it a little more boost. The only pulley I can find to fit my blower is said to give me 10lbs of boost so I'm a little scared of blowing it up!!
jrvariel48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2019, 06:00 PM   #16
jrvariel48
Senior Member
 
jrvariel48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 958
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronnieroadster View Post
Hi Joe
I would use Joe Abins formula for a guesstimate on what you would get like Revkev6 has written. However i would not be to concerned with the potential of 8 to 10 pounds of boost on your engine. Revkev I not only reset our record on the salt but also have many thousands of miles on the roads with three different blower combinations. Average HP on the street over 300. All trouble free miles even when using the options. that being the loud pedal. Returning again to the salt this year to see if more speed can be added to my top speed to date with my old trusty valve in block Flathead Ford V-8 block. More fun to still to be had i hope LOL
Ronnieroadster
Thanks Ronnie your input is always appreciated and implemented. You were instrumental in helping me set-up and tune my blown motor! I think I'll order that pulley for shits and giggles and give it a whirl when I put the new motor in. I'm going with a Unilite 3727501 distr. and a CB Performance black box for laptop tuning. While it was real fun and challenging to set-up the advance on the small block chevy distr., I'm done with that and want to be able to retard timing under boost, etc. I want more tune-ability. The black box has a built in map sensor also.
Thanks again, Joe
jrvariel48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2019, 06:01 PM   #17
jrvariel48
Senior Member
 
jrvariel48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 958
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Ron View Post
The Magnason blower kit for the Flathead uses an Eaton ny-pass blower. On My friends 294 engine it produces 235 hp at 4500 (red line) with only 3 1/2 to 5 lbs boost. Blower comes in at WOT around 3000. The engine could probably produce more power, however the cost of building it doesn't justify blowing it up just to see how much power it could make. Runs great on the street driving a C4 auto into a 3.08 rear giving great gas milage in cruise.
That sounds like a nice set-up Ron! I wonder if the pulleys are compatible?!
Thanks for your response, Joe
jrvariel48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2019, 07:56 PM   #18
revkev6
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: western Mass
Posts: 365
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronnieroadster View Post
Hi Joe
I would use Joe Abins formula for a guesstimate on what you would get like Revkev6 has written. However i would not be to concerned with the potential of 8 to 10 pounds of boost on your engine. Revkev I not only reset our record on the salt but also have many thousands of miles on the roads with three different blower combinations. Average HP on the street over 300. All trouble free miles even when using the options. that being the loud pedal. Returning again to the salt this year to see if more speed can be added to my top speed to date with my old trusty valve in block Flathead Ford V-8 block. More fun to still to be had i hope LOL
Ronnieroadster
Dont I know it Ron. Think I was twelve the first time I saw your roadster and your wifes 5 window at the summer nationals in Worcester 92 I think? You probably still have my drool on those ardun heads! We road all the way there in the rumble seat of my dads 8ba powered white 28 roadster.
revkev6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2019, 07:52 PM   #19
Randy
Senior Member
 
Randy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Austin
Posts: 676
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

A sidebar, but possibly of interest, John Camden built his superchargers here in Austin. I remember when he developed the kit for the flathead. He is still around, super smart innovative engineer, in his 80s now. As a kid he worked on Model Ts moving up into VWs that he and buddies would remove the bodies from and race around. He worked as a mechanical engineer for the GM institute in the 1950s and GM invited him to work on the design of the early 6 cylinder Corvettes, worked on a '55 Chevy that set a Pike's Peak speed record, raced and crashed a '56 Corvette at Sebring, ran a speed shop in Utica, NY, where he built and installed supercharged small block Chevy's in small foreign cars, designed industrial chain drives for Borg Warner, designed a propeller reduction gear for a 460 Ford mounted in an airplane, got into aviation design at Mooney Aircraft in Kerrville, leading to working as chief mechanical engineer for a project at Learjet, was partners in building a car called the Cumberford Martinique, after which at some point he began developing his supercharger, and I'm sure there's lots more to his story. He is retired and the last car that I know he built was a soap box derby car that his wife drove to a win at the "adult" soap box derby races in Marble Falls, TX, also winning "Best Of Show", in 2016. He's a true hot rodder!
Randy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2019, 03:46 AM   #20
jrvariel48
Senior Member
 
jrvariel48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 958
Default Re: Camden Supercharger

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy View Post
A sidebar, but possibly of interest, John Camden built his superchargers here in Austin. I remember when he developed the kit for the flathead. He is still around, super smart innovative engineer, in his 80s now. As a kid he worked on Model Ts moving up into VWs that he and buddies would remove the bodies from and race around. He worked as a mechanical engineer for the GM institute in the 1950s and GM invited him to work on the design of the early 6 cylinder Corvettes, worked on a '55 Chevy that set a Pike's Peak speed record, raced and crashed a '56 Corvette at Sebring, ran a speed shop in Utica, NY, where he built and installed supercharged small block Chevy's in small foreign cars, designed industrial chain drives for Borg Warner, designed a propeller reduction gear for a 460 Ford mounted in an airplane, got into aviation design at Mooney Aircraft in Kerrville, leading to working as chief mechanical engineer for a project at Learjet, was partners in building a car called the Cumberford Martinique, after which at some point he began developing his supercharger, and I'm sure there's lots more to his story. He is retired and the last car that I know he built was a soap box derby car that his wife drove to a win at the "adult" soap box derby races in Marble Falls, TX, also winning "Best Of Show", in 2016. He's a true hot rodder!
Randy, That's some awesome info!! Thank you, I'll definitely take a look!
jrvariel48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:04 PM.