The Ford Barn

sharp21 · 04-29-2019, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tubman

Glad that worked. It looks like you've got a better place to start than most. Now, hope for no cracks.

Knock on wood but I’m feeling real good about it so far! I haven’t been able to find any cracks yet.

Not bad for $200!

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RalphM · 04-29-2019, 08:55 PM

Use a good penetrating oil and then give those stuck valves a tap with a wood block, or brass drift. Should free them up.

Ziggster · 04-30-2019, 05:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOSFAST

Hi "sharp", try to find a shop who will use a block-plate to finish-hone the bores, it's fairly important on these Flathead castings!

Also, make certain you have it pressure-tested, do not rely on "magging" only!

Thanks, Gary in N.Y.

P.S. Would also strongly recommend some stainless valves and some bronze-lined guides so there will be no valves "hanging" down the road.

I spoke to my machinist last week about using a block plate, and he laughed, but mine will not be a performance build. Supposed to start machining this week. Fingers crossed.

Tim Ayers · 04-30-2019, 05:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziggster

I spoke to my machinist last week about using a block plate, and he laughed, but mine will not be a performance build. Supposed to start machining this week. Fingers crossed.

Ziggster:

I've had more bad and expensive machine work done in the past than I care to admit.

Please listen to others here, find another shop. If he doesn't think a torque plate is necessary, what other short cuts is he taking?

Ziggster · 04-30-2019, 05:55 AM

I'm no expert, and I'm sure having one honed with a toque plate gives piece of mind, but he simply doesn't have one. I trust him based on feedback from those that have used him in the past and I'm comfortable with any potential risk. I found this post here on HAMB, but I'm sure there are others that say the opposite.

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...gines.1055001/

Tim Ayers · 04-30-2019, 06:54 AM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziggster

I'm no expert, and I'm sure having one honed with a toque plate gives piece of mind, but he simply doesn't have one. I trust him based on feedback from those that have used him in the past and I'm comfortable with any potential risk. I found this post here on HAMB, but I'm sure there are others that say the opposite.

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...gines.1055001/

I'm no expert either, but I rely I expert opinions. Different builds may require different tools. My motor is at 3 3/8" +.030. That is a big bore. A flathead deck is thin and there is no doubt in mine or my builder's mind that a bore that big with a deck that thin it needs a torque plate.

I pulled a quote from the the thread you copied. I feel a flathead block falls into the same category as a Ford 302 block in terms of this.

Think about it. There is a reason why Ford added 3 more studs to the block when it went to 239 c.i. A cast iron head clamping down on that deck with one big hole and many smaller holes on a thin casting is going to move.

from what I have seen the lighter the block the more it needs a plate. A 302 ford will move enough to mesure but a big block 460 its hard to see. The ones I did we bored without the plate on a rotler bar then put the plate on the 302 pulls around the head bolts about .0015ish big blocks you could berly get .0002

sharp21 · 05-11-2019, 01:28 PM

No progress as such, but just got this in the mail so I’m ready to continue

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RalphM · 05-11-2019, 02:09 PM

One of these pry bars will come in awful handy when pulling the horseshoe clips as well.
Once the clip is out you can sometimes pry up on valve from bottom, tap down and repeat, using lots of PB blaster.
Or you can get the other tool here and make the job even easier.

sharp21 · 05-12-2019, 06:50 AM

I’m always happy to buy more tools!

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flatford8 · 05-13-2019, 07:22 AM

If you get another motor......keep them separated......they breed like rabbits!!!!!....Mark

Tim Ayers · 05-13-2019, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RalphM

One of these pry bars will come in awful handy when pulling the horseshoe clips as well.
Once the clip is out you can sometimes pry up on valve from bottom, tap down and repeat, using lots of PB blaster.
Or you can get the other tool here and make the job even easier.

The KD valve tool is an excellent edition to anyone's flathead tool arsenal.

sharp21 · 05-14-2019, 06:24 AM

Oil pump drive cover off. Now how to get the idler gear out while the block is on the stand...?

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Tim Ayers · 05-14-2019, 07:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharp21

Oil pump drive cover off. Now how to get the idler gear out while the block is on the stand...?

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Get a little pry bar or light duty puller. It's been a while since I've torn down an 8BA motor, but I believe it is just riding on a bushed post in the back of the block.

It may be stuck on from years of oil goop and muck.

tubman · 05-14-2019, 09:25 AM

"Sharp" - Just a question about an obscure item. Is the oil pump drive cover stamped steel or cast iron? Every Ford car 8BA I've seen had a stamped cover, while the Merc's (admittedly only two) had cast covers. Your's looks cast (maybe because it's a truck engine 8RT)?

kegmon · 05-14-2019, 11:03 AM

I remember making a 'slide hammer' out of a short piece of all thread (or a long bolt) and some nuts and washers. It just needed to be the same size thread as the idler gear center. It came out pretty easily once I got that rigged up.

RalphM · 05-14-2019, 11:04 AM

If you don’t want to damage the idler then get a puller. Screw bolt into threaded hole then pull slowly.

P.S. Tubman, I just looked at an 8 RT motor I have torn down, cover plate is stamped.

sharp21 · 05-15-2019, 06:21 AM

Valves! No progress. Can’t get the horseshoe retainers off and can’t get anything going.

I won’t need to reuse any of these will I? Can I just cut the spring then cut the valve stem down low?

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JSeery · 05-15-2019, 06:55 AM

I just cut the valves to get them out.

macdonge · 05-15-2019, 06:56 AM

I had the same problems with my teardown. Ended up getting out the plasma torch to cut the springs & valve stems, then pulled the valves out from above (some with the help of a slide hammer) and drove the guides down into the valley. Only way to do it in some cases!

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kegmon · 05-15-2019, 12:34 PM

This probably isn't the best way but it worked for me. Pry up the spring from the bottom and see if you can't get the 2 little keepers on the valve stem bottom off. If you can, then the valve should just pull out from the top. A little of the aforementioned acetone/trans fluid on the valve guides will help. I was then able to pop the springs out (wear eye protection). After that I tapped the valve guides down and out from the top using the right sized socket and extension.

04-29-2019, 08:55 PM	#82
RalphM Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: North Pole, Alaska Posts: 2,651	Re: First Flathead Build Use a good penetrating oil and then give those stuck valves a tap with a wood block, or brass drift. Should free them up.

05-11-2019, 01:28 PM	#87
sharp21 Member Join Date: Mar 2019 Location: Spring, TX Posts: 76	Re: First Flathead Build No progress as such, but just got this in the mail so I’m ready to continue Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

05-12-2019, 06:50 AM	#89
sharp21 Member Join Date: Mar 2019 Location: Spring, TX Posts: 76	Re: First Flathead Build I’m always happy to buy more tools! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

05-14-2019, 06:24 AM	#92
sharp21 Member Join Date: Mar 2019 Location: Spring, TX Posts: 76	Re: First Flathead Build Oil pump drive cover off. Now how to get the idler gear out while the block is on the stand...? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

05-14-2019, 09:25 AM	#94
tubman Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Minnesota, Florida Keys Posts: 10,312	Re: First Flathead Build "Sharp" - Just a question about an obscure item. Is the oil pump drive cover stamped steel or cast iron? Every Ford car 8BA I've seen had a stamped cover, while the Merc's (admittedly only two) had cast covers. Your's looks cast (maybe because it's a truck engine 8RT)?

05-14-2019, 11:03 AM	#95
kegmon Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Kansas City, MO Posts: 41	Re: First Flathead Build I remember making a 'slide hammer' out of a short piece of all thread (or a long bolt) and some nuts and washers. It just needed to be the same size thread as the idler gear center. It came out pretty easily once I got that rigged up.

05-14-2019, 11:04 AM	#96
RalphM Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: North Pole, Alaska Posts: 2,651	Re: First Flathead Build If you don’t want to damage the idler then get a puller. Screw bolt into threaded hole then pull slowly. P.S. Tubman, I just looked at an 8 RT motor I have torn down, cover plate is stamped. Last edited by RalphM; 05-14-2019 at 11:28 AM.

05-15-2019, 06:21 AM	#97
sharp21 Member Join Date: Mar 2019 Location: Spring, TX Posts: 76	Re: First Flathead Build Valves! No progress. Can’t get the horseshoe retainers off and can’t get anything going. I won’t need to reuse any of these will I? Can I just cut the spring then cut the valve stem down low? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

05-15-2019, 06:55 AM	#98
JSeery Member Emeritus Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Wichita KS Posts: 16,132	Re: First Flathead Build I just cut the valves to get them out.

05-15-2019, 06:56 AM	#99
macdonge Senior Member Join Date: May 2015 Location: Frelighsburg, QC Posts: 166	Re: First Flathead Build I had the same problems with my teardown. Ended up getting out the plasma torch to cut the springs & valve stems, then pulled the valves out from above (some with the help of a slide hammer) and drove the guides down into the valley. Only way to do it in some cases! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

05-15-2019, 12:34 PM	#100
kegmon Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Kansas City, MO Posts: 41	Re: First Flathead Build This probably isn't the best way but it worked for me. Pry up the spring from the bottom and see if you can't get the 2 little keepers on the valve stem bottom off. If you can, then the valve should just pull out from the top. A little of the aforementioned acetone/trans fluid on the valve guides will help. I was then able to pop the springs out (wear eye protection). After that I tapped the valve guides down and out from the top using the right sized socket and extension.