Go Back   The Ford Barn > General Discussion > Model A (1928-31)

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-09-2018, 04:49 PM   #21
Synchro909
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 3,646
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

Quote:
Originally Posted by denniskliesen View Post
I prefer Permatex High Tack gasket sealant over #2. You can buy it in spray or brush on. I've used it on my differential housings, transmission, and over 6k miles no leaks. I also used Ultra Black under the head of the bolt and medium strength on the threads.
What is Ultra Black???? Probably like that Indian Head stuff at $70 a tube by the time it gets here. Does Permatex Higfh Tack work on oily threads or must the surfaces be squeaky clean?
It's nearly 9am here and I'm about to leave to check out what is available while bearing in mind what I has been suggested here.
__________________
Procrastinate now. Don't put it off!
Synchro909 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2018, 06:45 PM   #22
Corley
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Battle Ground WA
Posts: 251
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

That Ultra Black rtv is really good stuff on super clean surfaces, but it won't adheare to oily surfaces. You must get all the oil out of the bolt holes if sealing the bolts is your goal, and that is near impossible on an A diff. I'm just sayin'...
__________________
Corley
-----------------
Subscribed to the KISS principle!
Corley is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Old 10-09-2018, 07:53 PM   #23
J Franklin
Senior Member
 
J Franklin's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: oregon
Posts: 3,494
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

I have purchased flat washers with rubber on one side to use for general sealing. Use these or find a thread sealant sold locally. Ask your local mechanics what it is they would use I'm sure you can find similar products without having to import it.
J Franklin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2018, 09:39 PM   #24
Synchro909
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 3,646
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

Well, I've done the rounds of suppliers and not come up with anything. Every product I looked at, including Loctite 515 and Prmatex #2 (which is just another silicone) says the parts should be clean and dry so here's what I now thought I'd do.
After draining the oil and flushing, I can easily clean the bolts one at a time as I remove them. It is the female thread that causes the problem and for that, I thought I could use some carburettor cleaner squirted in through the hole and let it drain out the bottom. I could maybe also make up something like an oversized pipe cleaner to help. I don't really want to do this again so maybe I use some string or yellow teflon tape as well as Loctite 243 to seal things up. I'd also put the aluminium washers I made under the bolt heads. That is 3 different methods - surely that will shut it up!
__________________
Procrastinate now. Don't put it off!
Synchro909 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2018, 10:25 PM   #25
Terry Burtz, Calif
Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Campbell,CA, USA
Posts: 43
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

Permatex #2 is not just another silicone.

There is no silicone in Permatex #2.

Permatex #2 is a sealant that is alcohol based.

Silicone based sealants were developed during the "Space Race".

Permatex #2 was developed during WW2 to seal aircraft engine interfaces where precision mating surfaces needed to be sealed, and the variability of a squished paper gasket was unacceptable.
Terry Burtz, Calif is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2018, 10:49 PM   #26
Chuck Sea/Tac
Senior Member
 
Chuck Sea/Tac's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Between Seattle & Tacoma
Posts: 1,617
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

I havenít read where you checked if the bolts will torque. That would be step # 1
Chuck Sea/Tac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 01:07 AM   #27
Synchro909
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 3,646
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry Burtz, Calif View Post
Permatex #2 is not just another silicone.

There is no silicone in Permatex #2.

Permatex #2 is a sealant that is alcohol based.

Silicone based sealants were developed during the "Space Race".

Permatex #2 was developed during WW2 to seal aircraft engine interfaces where precision mating surfaces needed to be sealed, and the variability of a squished paper gasket was unacceptable.
That makes more sense than what I saw. The #2 I saw was definately silicone. Maybe things arew marketed differently here. I haven't seen what you call #2, only #3
__________________
Procrastinate now. Don't put it off!
Synchro909 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 01:08 AM   #28
Synchro909
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 3,646
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck Sea/Tac View Post
I havenít read where you checked if the bolts will torque. That would be step # 1
That was the first thing I did - 35 ftlb. Sorry I didn't mention it but I agree, first things first
__________________
Procrastinate now. Don't put it off!
Synchro909 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 01:31 AM   #29
Tom Wesenberg
Senior Member
 
Tom Wesenberg's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Mpls, MN
Posts: 27,122
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Synchro909 View Post
That makes more sense than what I saw. The #2 I saw was definately silicone. Maybe things arew marketed differently here. I haven't seen what you call #2, only #3
It comes in a small tube, like toothpaste, and comes out like brown tar. It's a good sealer. There is also Pematex #1, which is the hardening type.
Tom Wesenberg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 01:36 AM   #30
updraught
Senior Member
 
updraught's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Australia
Posts: 958
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

https://www.permatex.com/products/ga...-no-2-sealant/

The middle one here looks the same as the one at Supercheap Auto. Should smell like alcohol ...

Interesting article, looks like Hylomar is a good all rounder. Been sold here around the 60's or so. Rolls Royce product.

https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2013/0...omment-page-1/
updraught is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 01:40 AM   #31
Mike V. Florida
Senior Member
 
Mike V. Florida's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: South Florida
Posts: 13,743
Send a message via AIM to Mike V. Florida
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

The original bolts are not the same dia as the reproductions. This is From Tom Endy's procedure,

"There are ten banjo bolts on each side of the banjo (20 total). These are special bolts; examine them to be sure they are original. They should have a space between the head of the bolt and the threads. This is to prevent oil from spiraling up the threads and causing an oil leak. The head of the bolt will also appear to be thicker than a normal bolt. It is best to use the original bolts and avoid the reproductions. Do not use lock washers with these bolts, as they will leak oil. "
__________________
What's right about America is that although we have a mess of problems, we have great capacity - intellect and resources - to do some thing about them. - Henry Ford II

Last edited by Mike V. Florida; 10-10-2018 at 01:47 AM.
Mike V. Florida is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 09:01 AM   #32
katy
Senior Member
 
katy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 1,478
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

As Terry Burtz said: "Permatex #2 is not just another silicone. There is no silicone in Permatex #2."

https://www.permatex.com/wp-content/.../tds/80011.pdf

Another trick you might try is copper washers under the bolt heads.
__________________
Talk slow, think fast.

Last edited by katy; 10-11-2018 at 09:16 AM. Reason: Spelling correction
katy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 02:23 PM   #33
Corley
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Battle Ground WA
Posts: 251
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry Burtz, Calif View Post
Permatex #2 is not just another silicone.

There is no silicone in Permatex #2.

Permatex #2 is a sealant that is alcohol based.

Silicone based sealants were developed during the "Space Race".

Permatex #2 was developed during WW2 to seal aircraft engine interfaces where precision mating surfaces needed to be sealed, and the variability of a squished paper gasket was unacceptable.
Don't think anyone said that Permatex #2 contains silicone, but "Ultra Black" sure does. Ultra black is a modern day sealer, #2 is old school. Both have their place.

Something interesting that lots of guys don't realize, is that silicone sealants and RTV sealants are a very different composition, and you should not use plain silicon sealer around oily stuff, it won't hold up. RTV is recommended for automotive uses, and will withstand that environment.
__________________
Corley
-----------------
Subscribed to the KISS principle!
Corley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 04:49 PM   #34
Synchro909
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 3,646
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

Quote:
Originally Posted by updraught View Post
https://www.permatex.com/products/ga...-no-2-sealant/

The middle one here looks the same as the one at Supercheap Auto. Should smell like alcohol ...

Interesting article, looks like Hylomar is a good all rounder. Been sold here around the 60's or so. Rolls Royce product.

https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2013/0...omment-page-1/
Thanks for the info. That looks nothing like what I saw at Burson's labelled as Permatex #2 but I note that the instructions say that the surfaces should be thoroughly clean before assembly.
__________________
Procrastinate now. Don't put it off!
Synchro909 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 07:20 PM   #35
updraught
Senior Member
 
updraught's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Australia
Posts: 958
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

Do you read the instructions on a beer can?
updraught is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 07:25 PM   #36
Synchro909
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 3,646
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

Quote:
Originally Posted by updraught View Post
Do you read the instructions on a beer can?
Why didn't I think of that???? Seal it with beer. Genious!
__________________
Procrastinate now. Don't put it off!
Synchro909 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 07:43 PM   #37
Corley
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Battle Ground WA
Posts: 251
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

How about some Gorilla glue, it is supposed to swell up and fill in all the gaps, but I doubt it would set in an enclosed space... Maybe some bacon rind, they made a lot of use of that back in the day...
__________________
Corley
-----------------
Subscribed to the KISS principle!
Corley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 09:16 PM   #38
Mikeinnj
Senior Member
 
Mikeinnj's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Northern New Jersey
Posts: 1,199
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

There are ten banjo bolts on each side of the banjo (20 total). These are special bolts; examine them to be sure they are original. They should have a space between the head of the bolt and the threads. This is to prevent oil from spiraling up the threads and causing an oil leak. The head of the bolt will also appear to be thicker than a normal bolt....From Tom Endy's informative article
found here.....http://www.santaanitaas.org/wp-conte...vised-2014.pdf Also, do not chase the female threads on the banjo as it will affect their ability to seal oil.
Mikeinnj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 09:33 PM   #39
Synchro909
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 3,646
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikeinnj View Post
There are ten banjo bolts on each side of the banjo (20 total). These are special bolts; examine them to be sure they are original. They should have a space between the head of the bolt and the threads. This is to prevent oil from spiraling up the threads and causing an oil leak. The head of the bolt will also appear to be thicker than a normal bolt....From Tom Endy's informative article
found here.....http://www.santaanitaas.org/wp-conte...vised-2014.pdf Also, do not chase the female threads on the banjo as it will affect their ability to seal oil.
The bolts fit your description but I'm by no means certain they are original. It's a slow process but I'm removing them one by one, cleaning out the female threads with Carby cleaner, cleaning the bolt and refitting with yeloow teflon tape and a washer under the head. I tried some time ago to seal them in a half hearted way and the ones where I had used the tape look pretty good. I'm hopeful that after cleaning the threads, they will seal. Now, I'm hoping that the leaks are not through the gasket. That could be if the gasket is damaged or the axle housing is distorted. I'll do this easy thing first, then see what I have. No point fixing the gaskets if they are not the problem.
There also seems to be oil excaping around the flange at the pinion. This guy was a lousy mechanic!!
__________________
Procrastinate now. Don't put it off!
Synchro909 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2018, 04:17 PM   #40
Synchro909
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 3,646
Default Re: Diff leaking around the bolts

Often, we never hear how things turned out for the originator of a thread so I thought I'd report back.
It's been 36 hours now since I removed the bolts on at a time, cleaned the female threads and the bolts, put a washer on the bolt and silicone under it and Permatex #3 on the threads. Torqued them up to 35 ftlb and there are no leaks. I haven't driven it yet but so far, I'm a happy chappy.
It was time consuming and fiddley and I'm pleased it is so easy to get at the diff under a P/U. Time well spent!
__________________
Procrastinate now. Don't put it off!
Synchro909 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:47 AM.