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Old 02-27-2012, 03:46 PM   #1
johnsor
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Default Ford V8-60

I am thinking about installing a Ford V8-60 in my Model A PU. Is this practicle or advisable? As I have access to a nice V8-60 engine, it seems it would be lightweight, smoother and 20hp more than the Model A engine. Should I make the hook-up to the existing Model A transmission with an adapter plate, or find a 37 transmission and modify the U-joint/torque tube connection? What's been done before? Any advice would be appreciated.
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Old 02-27-2012, 06:44 PM   #2
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

I've read where thisa isn't as good a swap as you'd think. Try posting this on the model A forum. Now when I transplanted a pont tempest 4 cyl into my 32, that worked almost as good as the olds I took out.
Paul in CT
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Old 02-27-2012, 06:53 PM   #3
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

There was a thread about this topic here on V-8 Ford Barn before but I can't find it.

Most were trying to convince the guy not to do it.

One guy said, "Why, are you tired of going fast?"
or something like that.

T
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Old 02-27-2012, 08:08 PM   #4
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

The V8 60 fits a Model A better than the larger V8 for sure but none of them are bolt ins per say. The Model A guys are not the ones to ask about such things. To most of them folks, it's downright blasphemy.

The miget racers of old nearly used up all the good V8-60 motors so there aren't as many as there used to be. Parts are a little harder to scrounge up too.
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Old 02-27-2012, 10:12 PM   #5
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

Two suggestions. The little v/8 60 is not endowed with very much lowend torque. With the normal 3.78 ring and pinion in the rear end you will be disappointed with the lack of get up and go. I would recommed and 4.11 ratio to help with that. 2nd. use the "'39" transmission and get the necessary adapters for lthe pedals and wishbone from Specialty Ford Parts of Rosemead, California, phone 626-288-2121. These adapters are very good.
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Old 02-28-2012, 01:14 AM   #6
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

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The stock V8 60 does not have much torque at any RPM. I think it only has about 90-95 ft lbs with a fairly flat torque curve.You would need the 60 trans as it is different than the 85 case.It will bolt up to the A rear end.Put a model B engine in it & it would have much more power & torque.My 30 A coupe has a 33B with a 5.9 cyl head & it will pull a 6 % grade with a 2.94 ratio in overdrive without slowing down.I think the cars with the 60 used a 4.44 ratio & even then they were under powered.The B engine is easy to install in an A .To retain the A trans,you need to remove the lower flywheel hsg that is part of the B pan and use the A F-W hsg,or you could use the B trans case with 39-48 gears & 39-52 shift top.with the later trans you would needthe adapters for pedals,mounts wishbone etc.Much easier to retain the A trans,and to me,part of the charm of the A is the sound of the straight cut gears & the art of double clutching.
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Old 02-28-2012, 01:50 AM   #7
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

I ran into a great deal on a very nice V8 60 HP engine and transmission that was being sold by a guy who was just about to drop it into his Model A but apparently 'saw the light' at the last minute and decided not to make this swap. I have also read posts here and articles published elsewhere on why this may not be the best swap to consider. The stories always seem to evolve to the point that you would be far better off with a beefed up A or B engine in that Model A than a little 60 HP engine.
Now on the other hand if you talk to a guy named Richard Willim or read his book 'The Mighty Little V-8 60 HP Powerhouse', he may change your thinking back to going with a little 60 HP in that Model A. IMO, if I were considering swapping a Model A engine with some other type engine it would have to be an 85/100 HP Flathead Ford V-8 engine. Probably not that much more difficult to do, if any, and a whole lot more potential for increased performance as compared to a 60 HP engine. Lots of How To's have been written on what's known the 'AV8'. The most well known of these books is The Bishop & Tardel book on how to built an AV8. The book that probably launched thousands of these AV8 projects. I would suggest carefully reviewing all the pros and cons of this swap before plowing ahead. Good luck!!

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Old 02-28-2012, 07:42 AM   #8
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

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Originally Posted by columbiA View Post
You would need the 60 trans as it is different than the 85 case.
There are two 60 trans; passenger & commercial. The passenger trans is a tiny thing unique in all aspects to the 60. The commercial trans actually uses 85HP internals & shares many parts.

But a standard 85HP trans can be adapted - you just need to hole-saw a hole for the 60 starter bendix and fabricate a cover for it - something like a tuna can or cat food can works. And with that in mind, you can modify any of the adapters for the 85 as well, so you could put a T5 or any other adapter with the same modifications.
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Old 02-28-2012, 08:42 AM   #9
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

Some other things to consider.

Installing a V8-60 in a Model A PU should produce better results than installing one in a sedan. Ford introduced the V8-60 as a "thrifty" engine but used it in cars that got increasingly heavier. Weigh is a factor of performance.

Unless you specifically want a Model A transmission, the various V8 transmissions make driving a little easier with "synchroed" downshifts to 2nd when you need them. V8-60 transmissions varied by year. Early passenger transmissions were smaller than the commercial transmissions, but in 1940 the passenger model was full size like the 85hp and the commercial V8-60.

All will "bolt-up" to the Model A torque tube with the right mix of V8 parts, like the clamshell.

One advantage, as mentioned, of the larger transmission is the availability pedal, wishbone and e-brake adapters. You lose these when you change from the Model A transmission.

Engine mounts and a rear transmission mount must be added.

If it's most performance bang for the buck, the Model A can be made to really shine. Otherwise, a V8-60 project can be a slick and beautiful sounding attention getter. Speed parts for the 60 can get mighty expensive.



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Old 02-28-2012, 08:59 AM   #10
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

Having driven a 60hp car, and owning a stock A I would say that the A engine wants to be under 3000 rpm, the 60 wants to be over 3000 rpm
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Old 02-28-2012, 09:14 AM   #11
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

In 1963 when I was 18 I did what you are thinking of doing with a 60 HP V8. I was working in a garage during the summers and after and school both high school and college. My car at the time was a nice 31 Model A Coupe with a worn out engine. One of the mechanics at the garage was a big time fabricator and had just acquired a nice 37 Ford with a smooth running 60 HP engine. He pulled the flathead engine to put a sbc engine in. The 60 HP was mine for the asking. This conversion was a no brainer for me and it did not take long with his help and the assets of the garage to have this engine in my 31 coupe. A very easy install as everything bolted up using the 37 engine and 39 transmission. Glass pack duels and I was a happy guy. The car ran great. I never won any races but it was a good performer for the 2 more years I had the car. Never had any problems with it. The engine was an easy fit and looked like it came from the factory that way. After this long story I would say do the engine swap if you want and I think you will find that it creates a lot of interest when you start it up, especially if your A looks stock. The 60 HP with glass packs had a sound of its own. I was able to get a little bit more speed in each gear using the A rear end. Best regards Dennis
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Old 02-28-2012, 10:44 AM   #12
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

Hope the v/8 60 is not the "tin side" engine. hard to repair leaks. otherwise a fun little conversion
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Old 02-28-2012, 11:36 AM   #13
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

I put a '37 60hp in my '52 MGTD a couple years ago, first with an 85hp 3-speed, then a Mustang t-5. I use a reduction-gear starter so no cutting of the bell housing is needed but did have to make an adaptor plate for the t-5. It's been a challenge to keep the body stock, but lots of fun to build, and a blast to drive. The back side is, I've found the 60hp's to be quite pricey, even for just a good rebuildable one (always looking). Marvin
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Old 02-28-2012, 12:11 PM   #14
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

Hoop is right. An A with a V8-60 actually gets up and goes nicely. I had one in a '31 RPU and it had plenty of power. It is not a very hard installation to do.
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Old 02-28-2012, 02:00 PM   #15
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

I have been running a V8 60HP in my RPU for about 4 years. Runs great, draws a lot of attention. I have the low rear end and it is pretty quick, but I have model "A" with a HC Wieand head and downdraft carbs that will just plain kick the V8 60Hp to the curb. With that low rear end the V8 60 HP screams at 60 mph. It does help to reduce the weight of the vehicle as much as possible, see the attached picture. The steering column is very close to the exhaust manifold. It was a fun build and a blast to drive. Gary in MN [ATTACH][ATTACH]2007 50's 28 RPU 007.jpg[/ATTACH][/ATTACH]
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Old 02-28-2012, 02:20 PM   #16
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

By the way, that was my neighbor Greg's transmission in the above photo. Sorry about the Coors Light can ... we dug it out of another neighbor's trash. Life's too short for light beer.
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Old 02-28-2012, 03:37 PM   #17
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

Thanks for all the posts and experienced opinions, and as a result I'm going to go with a modified A engine like I have in my 30 Roadster. The Roadster engine has a considerably lightened flywheel (29 lbs.), late 30's Ford clutch & pressure plate, balanced, .060" overbored, a Model B carb with an enlarged manifold port, a lively Bill Sipe cam, Brumfield HC head and a 3:54 ring & pinion. It still looks, sounds and idles like a Model A and it has a smooth "sweet spot" at 60mph on the road. The 6:50x16's makes it handle nice on the road also. Of course the best part of the Model A engine is the availability of many and relatively cheap parts. Its always good to ask. Thanks, John
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Old 02-29-2012, 11:08 AM   #18
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

Thanks for choosing the Model A engine. That means more V8 60 engines, speed equipment and parts for the bunch of us that enjoy the 90-100 hp one can get out of these petite little flatheads. Not to mention the beautiful sight of a 60 with polished aluminum heads and two Stromberg 81's on top sitting in the engine bay.
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Old 03-02-2012, 11:25 AM   #19
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Default It's All In The Gearing!

I had a T coupe that had a 60 . Most such swaps of that era used 3.78 Model A rear with the toy size trans and was not all that bad. It was bad aerodynamics that limited the T/V8-60 at the top. The same rig with an open wheel roadster would have been much better and capable of freeway speeds. Light as possible a stripped down roadster could be great. The V8-60 in an A has been poorly done quite often, but seldom given the gear ratios and weight consideration. My current plan is for my '31 roadster with a '40 sixty. The 4.56 rear gear and the V8 16/28 Ford passenger trans plus a Mitchell OD. That would put the first gear ratio at 12.86, slightly lower than the Model A's standard 11.79 overall. The 4.56 ratio in the rear gives final in OD of 3.37 with the Mitchell. This is still a bit tall for the 60 but with the Ford V8 trans there are many gearset ratios to choose from, but 4.56 is the highest reduction I could find for the Model A rear. Hope that with reduced weight would make the top gear still work. I still would have the choice of tires to nudge the effective gearing. Engine mods are less effective short of a supercharger than the most ignored parameter which is gearing. Good Luck: Fred A
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Old 12-05-2013, 08:26 PM   #20
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

ok, I am new to the forum and have a question, I have a 1952 Ford Victoria and I need an adapter for 3speed transmission to install a 351W, can I get some info from anyone that can tell me where to get one.
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Old 12-05-2013, 08:40 PM   #21
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Default Re: Ford VICTORIA 1952

I need an adapter for 3 speed trans in order to install a 351W.
can anyone tell me where to get one?
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Old 12-05-2013, 08:44 PM   #22
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

No doubt you'll find that info if you google H.A.M.B. They'll have the info you need!!

Lonnie
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Old 12-05-2013, 08:59 PM   #23
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

I'm getting ready to pull the tin sided V8 60 out of my '37. Too bad because the car is original except for '39 brakes but every time I come up the hill to our house I feel like I'm churning butter with all the shifts back and forth between second and third. Tough on the trans when it's one of the early straight tooth gear boxes. Engine is in excellent shape and will be available with the trans after the swap.
Henry made a mistake putting this engine in full size cars. Might work better in stripped down model A. Good luck with it.
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Old 12-05-2013, 11:20 PM   #24
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

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Originally Posted by mananaba View Post
Thanks for choosing the Model A engine. That means more V8 60 engines, speed equipment and parts for the bunch of us that enjoy the 90-100 hp one can get out of these petite little flatheads. Not to mention the beautiful sight of a 60 with polished aluminum heads and two Stromberg 81's on top sitting in the engine bay.
Roger on all that. 100 hp is quite common with a 60.
100 hp is fairly easy with a model A also.
Both are quite expensive at this level though.
While a model A would be hard to get one hp per cubic inch out of a flathead, it has been done many times with a 60.
I would far and away rather drive the 60 though because of no vibration.
You would need a 5 or 6 speed behind either one to really enjoy them
on the street.
As someone already mentioned, talk to Rich Willim about the 60.
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Old 12-06-2013, 07:48 AM   #25
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

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I put a '37 60hp in my '52 MGTD a couple years ago, first with an 85hp 3-speed, then a Mustang t-5. I use a reduction-gear starter so no cutting of the bell housing is needed but did have to make an adaptor plate for the t-5. It's been a challenge to keep the body stock, but lots of fun to build, and a blast to drive. The back side is, I've found the 60hp's to be quite pricey, even for just a good rebuildable one (always looking). Marvin
Search Flathead 60 on eBay. There is one listed in NY right now. Five days left.
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Old 10-09-2014, 08:19 PM   #26
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I want to install Ford V-8 60 hp. in my model T speedster. I am thinking a five speed T5 transmission would really make for great driver. Where can I find an adapter to mate the engine to the T5? I sure would appreciate any suggestions. Don Hanson in MN.
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Old 10-09-2014, 08:38 PM   #27
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

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Originally Posted by norma7982 View Post
ok, I am new to the forum and have a question, I have a 1952 Ford Victoria and I need an adapter for 3speed transmission to install a 351W, can I get some info from anyone that can tell me where to get one.
Might get a better response on the HAMB. The Ford Barn is geared more toward stock and slightly modified cars and stock and modified flatheads. The HAMB is more all out hot rods, although they also have a cut off in the 60s and the 351W would be past that time period. I have nothing personal against the 351Ws as I have two of them, one in a 2005 Focus and one in my 70 Truck, but it is not the focus of this site. Wilcox makes a lot of adapters might try them. One suggestion, why keep the 52 transmission, with a 351W engine I would be looking at a later Ford transmission like a 4-speed or a T5 with an overdrive.
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Old 10-09-2014, 08:46 PM   #28
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I want to install Ford V-8 60 hp. in my model T speedster. I am thinking a five speed T5 transmission would really make for great driver. Where can I find an adapter to mate the engine to the T5? I sure would appreciate any suggestions. Don Hanson in MN.
Most of the parts to put a T5 on an 85 flathead will work for the 60.
A gear drive starter is recommended.

If you put a Simca V8 flathead crank in the 60 and bore to .100, you can have 166 ci.
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Old 10-09-2014, 08:53 PM   #29
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You guys guys know this post is from last December right?

Lonnie
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Old 10-09-2014, 09:10 PM   #30
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You guys guys know this post is from last December right?

Lonnie
Who cares?????
I WAS ANSWERING TODAYS QUESTION FROM don2274.
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Old 10-09-2014, 09:48 PM   #31
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You guys guys know this post is from last December right?

Lonnie
Well, I blew it! Guess I need to head to bed, thanks for the heads up Lonnie. That is usually the first thing I check, but it got past me today.
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Old 10-10-2014, 08:09 PM   #32
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Thanks for the advice on my V-8 60 project. It really helps!

Don Hanson
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Old 01-24-2015, 11:20 AM   #33
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

Hey Pete I agree with you "WHO CARES"? I am owner of V-8 60 and think I would like it in one of my As . So still reading all available info from anywhere!
My engine was used to run a saw mill in East Texas, My Transmission came from Arizona hoping it is the later one, think it came out of a 41?
I will accept all the information I can get.and "Who Cares" was the name of a Drive In Restaurant in Dallas Texas in the 50's
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Old 01-24-2015, 02:40 PM   #34
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Hey Pete I agree with you "WHO CARES"? I am owner of V-8 60 and think I would like it in one of my As . So still reading all available info from anywhere!
My engine was used to run a saw mill in East Texas, My Transmission came from Arizona hoping it is the later one, think it came out of a 41?
I will accept all the information I can get.and "Who Cares" was the name of a Drive In Restaurant in Dallas Texas in the 50's
Email me and I might be able to help you get 100 street hp from your 60
contrary to what people that have never done it say.
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Old 01-25-2015, 06:30 AM   #35
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Default Re: Ford V8-60



Here is a 1937 Ford Tudor with the V8 60 that has been imported to Australia
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Old 01-25-2015, 10:19 PM   #36
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

Back in the 80s early 90s I had a 29 pickup that had a V8-60 in it. I thought it was a great combo for a model A and it fit good. Id love to build another.
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Old 09-13-2018, 02:17 PM   #37
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

Hi All, if this post is still relevant; I have a 1952 MGTD with a 1938’ish V8-60, running through a Ford Clutch to a stock MG trans. Took some work to get it going properly after it’s 40+ year slumber but we are running. Love to get some advice. Thanks, Scott
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Old 09-13-2018, 05:34 PM   #38
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First piece of advice is, take it REAL easy on that transmission.
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Old 09-13-2018, 05:34 PM   #39
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Hi All, if this post is still relevant; I have a 1952 MGTD with a 1938’ish V8-60, running through a Ford Clutch to a stock MG trans. Took some work to get it going properly after it’s 40+ year slumber but we are running. Love to get some advice. Thanks, Scott
Sure it's still relevant! Can't remember his name, but there's another Fordbarner on here with a v8-60 in an MG, and it is nicely done, too. Maybe he'll see this and chime-in. DD
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Old 09-13-2018, 09:06 PM   #40
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Thanks DD; thanks for that, there can’t be more than a handful of them left! Scott
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Old 09-14-2018, 09:31 AM   #41
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Thanks DD; thanks for that, there can’t be more than a handful of them left! Scott

Here the guy is right here in THIS thread, post #13….Marvin, Ct.



He doesn't appear to be a DAILY visitor here. Maybe PM him...might bring it to his attention next time he's here. Good luck! DD


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Old 09-14-2018, 12:29 PM   #42
5851a
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Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: NE Iowa
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Default Re: Ford V8-60

Quote:
Originally Posted by MARVIN, CT View Post
I put a '37 60hp in my '52 MGTD a couple years ago, first with an 85hp 3-speed, then a Mustang t-5. I use a reduction-gear starter so no cutting of the bell housing is needed but did have to make an adaptor plate for the t-5. It's been a challenge to keep the body stock, but lots of fun to build, and a blast to drive. The back side is, I've found the 60hp's to be quite pricey, even for just a good rebuildable one (always looking). Marvin
A Shelby MG!
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