Help with 7.00X17 tires, Budd wheels, '39 3/4 ton followed me home

[jim galli]

I blame it on the (*^*(& snipe engines. You go to bed fine and wake up owner of a '39 3/4 ton.

Does anyone close to me have some 17" tires that would be good enough for "rollers". Bald is OK. I won't get this off the trailer until I get some tires that can hold air.

The solid rings, I assume you have to be able to drive down then work them over the edge to come off. We're "ranch" in Nevada and not afraid to do things ourselves but technical help appreciated. Yes, I'll wrap it up in continuous chain before I put the air to it, if and when I get that far. Anything written on these? Pages V8 manual cover them? Anything on line? Anyone got some tires for me?

Plates on this are Wyo. 1958. Engine turns over and oil looks like it was changed 2500 miles ago. Trans 'sounds' dry as a bone. Much to do. Want to make a preserved 'driver'. Keep the patina. It came with better fenders though. I'm in central Nevada. Tires within 250 miles? Thanks all.

[NealinCA]

Neat truck. I am no help on the tires, but FYI, that is a Tonner, not a 3/4 ton. 3/4 ton used 16" wide five wheels similar to 37-39 cars and 1/2 ton (wheels were wider and not scalloped).

On a side note, does anyone have a complete 39 Tonner rear end and brakes? I have a friend with a 38 tonner who want to convert it to hydraulic brakes. Looks like he will need a 39 rear end to do it.

Neal

[jim galli]

That was my first thought too when I saw it, but wheelbase is 122". Not 131, so it seems to be a heavier 3/4 ton. Did they do a one ton with the short wheel base? Did Ford put any "GVW" tags on stuff this early?

[Bob C]

The tonner was 122" also.
When you get the lock ring pushed down a little look for two cutaways 180 degrees
apart, these cutaways allow the ring to slip over the rim.

Bob

[jim galli]

Originally Posted by Bob C

The tonner was 122" also.
When you get the lock ring pushed down a little look for two cutaways 180 degrees
apart, these cutaways allow the ring to slip over the rim.

Bob

Ah! Thanks for both. I'm definitely in 'discovery' phase on this beastie.

[GB SISSON]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

The 131" and 157" were 1 1/2 or 2 tons, depending on version. Only a '39-'41 tonner with hydraulic brakes would interchange. In '42 the got wider by 2 1/2". I'm always on the hunt for 7.50 x 17s and I use those rims too. I'm not sure if backing plates interchange. As for changing tires, I did one last night. You gotta make sure you can get the tire's bead down a bit below the ring. Then you see the 2 oval cutaways and a notch in the ring. It's about 3/4" wide x 1/4" . It takes the tip of a thin but very strong bar. I use some light oil and get the ring rotating easy, press downwards on it and get the prybar into the notch. Using hammer,pound the ring opposite the notch twds the center of wheel while keeping pressure on the pry bar. It looks impossible and IS difficult, but I have never lost to one. Around here they are often really rusty in there and many get rejected. Remember get the tire as low as possible. I use the forks on my skidsteer, but last nights was made much more difficult because someone used a flap that was thick and too wide. Did I mention I cut the tire off the rim with a sawzall so I could finally get it off? I was repaid by a really clean rim and ring. Hope this helps. Oh, and one side is left hand thread on the lugnuts! Look for the 'L' in the stud and little notches on the corners of the lugnuts.....

[NealinCA]

Originally Posted by GB SISSON

Only a '39-'41 tonner with hydraulic brakes would interchange. In '42 the got wider by 2 1/2".

Are 40-41 closed drive also? I was under the impression that they went to open drive in 40.

[jim galli]

Originally Posted by GB SISSON

The 131" and 157" were 1 1/2 or 2 tons, depending on version. Only a '39-'41 tonner with hydraulic brakes would interchange. In '42 the got wider by 2 1/2". I'm always on the hunt for 7.50 x 17s and I use those rims too. I'm not sure if backing plates interchange. As for changing tires, I did one last night. You gotta make sure you can get the tire's bead down a bit below the ring. Then you see the 2 oval cutaways and a notch in the ring. It's about 3/4" wide x 1/4" . It takes the tip of a thin but very strong bar. I use some light oil and get the ring rotating easy, press downwards on it and get the prybar into the notch. Using hammer,pound the ring opposite the notch twds the center of wheel while keeping pressure on the pry bar. It looks impossible and IS difficult, but I have never lost to one. Around here they are often really rusty in there and many get rejected. Remember get the tire as low as possible. I use the forks on my skidsteer, but last nights was made much more difficult because someone used a flap that was thick and too wide. Did I mention I cut the tire off the rim with a sawzall so I could finally get it off? I was repaid by a really clean rim and ring. Hope this helps. Oh, and one side is left hand thread on the lugnuts! Look for the 'L' in the stud and little notches on the corners of the lugnuts.....

Afternoon of discovery and so far, a fail. I cut the old tire off so all I have is the 2 beads left. Flap and tube are gone. Tire sans 2 beads is gone. Shoved the top bead from the old tire down so I've got lots of room to 'see' at the ring area. The ring has 2 half moon areas where I can see that it would slide on. But there are no notches to get a pry bar under to try to get it flipped over the bead so you can start to work it around. The pry bars just slip off. Can't get under the ring to get a good bite. Need a codger that's done a thousand of these in the 1940's and 50's to show me how it's done I guess.

Saw the writing on the wall and bit the bullet and ordered new tires. Tornel traction 10 ply's. All 4. Ranch truck, it's supposed to look gnarly. Didn't like the looks of the hi-way tread.

Spending money, always the easy part. Need to figure out how to wrestle them apart and back together.

[Bob C]

If you put your half moons at 3 and 9 oclock there should be a one inch
notch in the ring at about 1 or 7 oclock to put a tire iron in and get the ring off.

Bob

[51504bat]

Try an AG tire or big truck tire shop. They'll be able to do the mount and dismount in nothing flat. Once you see how its done its not really rocket science but you'll certainly break a sweat doing it. When you do mount the new tires make sure you use new flaps in addition to the new tubes.

[48 coupe]

be careful with those rims. they will kill u. use a cage or chain around them when u air them .up.

[GB SISSON]

Originally Posted by NealinCA

Are 40-41 closed drive also? I was under the impression that they went to open drive in 40.

Starting in 1940 all the commercial trucks were changed to a Hotchkiss drive system (open driveline) . At the same time the fronts were changed to fore and aft type springs. The width increase in the tonners wasn't til '42.

[GB SISSON]

Originally Posted by jim galli

Afternoon of discovery and so far, a fail. I cut the old tire off so all I have is the 2 beads left. Flap and tube are gone. Tire sans 2 beads is gone. Shoved the top bead from the old tire down so I've got lots of room to 'see' at the ring area. The ring has 2 half moon areas where I can see that it would slide on. But there are no notches to get a pry bar under to try to get it flipped over the bead so you can start to work it around. The pry bars just slip off. Can't get under the ring to get a good bite. Need a codger that's done a thousand of these in the 1940's and 50's to show me how it's done I guess.

Saw the writing on the wall and bit the bullet and ordered new tires. Tornel traction 10 ply's. All 4. Ranch truck, it's supposed to look gnarly. Didn't like the looks of the hi-way tread.

Spending money, always the easy part. Need to figure out how to wrestle them apart and back together.

I have probably changed out 30 or 40 of these 17s and never seen one without the notch... Also keep in mind there are two different widths in these rims and we are never supposed to swap out the rings as they are slightly different. I have about equal amount of each type. Without looking I think the ones with 4 slots are the wide ones and soild disc are the narrow ones. I only run the 7.50s but wouldn't put them on the narrower rims.

[41panelmark]

I agree with GB, it can be done and they are not as dangerous as the center splits. Took me a day or so to get all 6 of mine off and new ones back on. Sore back and some cussing. Try to find a duck bill hammer, makes things easier going on and off.

[jim galli]

Originally Posted by GB SISSON

I have probably changed out 30 or 40 of these 17s and never seen one without the notch... Also keep in mind there are two different widths in these rims and we are never supposed to swap out the rings as they are slightly different. I have about equal amount of each type. Without looking I think the ones with 4 slots are the wide ones and soild disc are the narrow ones. I only run the 7.50s but wouldn't put them on the narrower rims.

Did finally find the 'notch'. Have 2 of the 4 apart now, but not without cutting the old tires off and pulling the tube and flaps out of the way, which is sort of cheating. Where I live, there's no one to "do it for you". If I don't do it, it won't get done. The guys at our local tire emporium don't know what a split rim is. Or they cross their fingers out in front of them and back away slowly while saying enchantments. These things make the ordinary notched split rims look easy.

Everything about that truck is heavy. Hey does anyone know if it's normal for the wood that the bed lays on to be longer on one side than the other. Almost looks like the factory did them that way so you could store a spare tire up inside the frame at the back of the flat bed, underneath.

[GB SISSON]

Originally Posted by jim galli

Did finally find the 'notch'. Have 2 of the 4 apart now, but not without cutting the old tires off and pulling the tube and flaps out of the way, which is sort of cheating. Where I live, there's no one to "do it for you". If I don't do it, it won't get done. The guys at our local tire emporium don't know what a split rim is. Or they cross their fingers out in front of them and back away slowly while saying enchantments. These things make the ordinary notched split rims look easy.

Everything about that truck is heavy. Hey does anyone know if it's normal for the wood that the bed lays on to be longer on one side than the other. Almost looks like the factory did them that way so you could store a spare tire up inside the frame at the back of the flat bed, underneath.

Not sure on that... I have a factory script stakebed on my '47 2 ton, but it came off my '59 one ton when I put a flareside 9' box on it. Are you talking about the longitudinal 2x6 that run down the frame? Never seen unequal lengths on them.

[expavr]

Once you clean or sandblast the locking rings I recommend having them magnafluxed before remounting. I had to trash two of mine due to hairline cracks that made them unsafe.

[truckdog62563]

Originally Posted by expavr

Once you clean or sandblast the locking rings I recommend having them magnafluxed before remounting. I had to trash two of mine due to hairline cracks that made them unsafe.

Ham fisted prior service, or just bad roads, can damage the rings and make them junk. Worst thing to do is to use to much force which will bend the ring. I agree with the ag shop recommendation. And ditto Gary's comment about ensuring the rim/ring sets stay together. There were two rim widths, and the rings don't interchange. Stu

[jim galli]

Originally Posted by GB SISSON

Not sure on that... I have a factory script stakebed on my '47 2 ton, but it came off my '59 one ton when I put a flareside 9' box on it. Are you talking about the longitudinal 2x6 that run down the frame? Never seen unequal lengths on them.

Yes, I'll include a picture later this week when I'm back home. Unequal lengths and there's a sort of clamp to hold the tire in, and also the end caps on either side of the bed are different, the one on the side where the wood doesn't come all the way to the end is longer and meets the frame to sort of compensate for the wood not being there.

[jim galli]

Originally Posted by jim galli

Yes, I'll include a picture later this week when I'm back home. Unequal lengths and there's a sort of clamp to hold the tire in, and also the end caps on either side of the bed are different, the one on the side where the wood doesn't come all the way to the end is longer and meets the frame to sort of compensate for the wood not being there.

As promised, here are images of the rear area under the bed of my '39 Tonner.

My first thought when I first viewed the truck in Oregon is that the poor old thing, someone had cut the rotten wood away and it had finished it's first life with unequal lengths of wood under it's bed.

Then, as I got into the project and had more time to evaluate, it's obvious that this is factory done. There's a clamp to hold your spare wheel up under the bed safely tucked in,

And thoughtfully, the pocket that holds the end of the bed support wood on one side is made longer on the other side so that it would meet the frame and offer support where the wood is subtracted.

What has happened though through long years of battle is that the shoe that once sat on top of the frame has broken it's weld and someone has tucked it in under the frame to rest on top of the tow hitch parts added later. So the bed leans about 2 inches on one side. Not a difficult repair, and I'm glad it's all still intact.

I love how original this truck is. Nothing has been disturbed. It's all there.