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Old 04-06-2020, 11:32 PM   #1
rehpotsirhcj
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Default Banjo bell bearing race puller?

Hi guys, having finished my trans rebuild Iím on to my banjo rear. Can someone point me to the correct (and obtainable) tool for pulling the bearing races? Note that Iíd prefer a tool vs welding in a stud and using a slide hammer (as is suggested in the very handy Tardel booklet)
Thanks much,
-Chris


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Old 04-07-2020, 08:24 AM   #2
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

Try a Mig weld bead on the bearing surface and the race should fall out.
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Old 04-07-2020, 10:05 AM   #3
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rehpotsirhcj View Post
Hi guys, having finished my trans rebuild I’m on to my banjo rear. Can someone point me to the correct (and obtainable) tool for pulling the bearing races? Note that I’d prefer a tool vs welding in a stud and using a slide hammer (as is suggested in the very handy Tardel booklet)
Thanks much,
-Chris


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Chris, if we're talking about the carrier bearing races into the large end of the axle housing, which could be referred to as a "bell", I made a very simple steel bar, radiused on both ends, that's inserted into the "bell" end of axle housing, and sits on top of a small exposed ledge of that bearing race. With the axle housing sitting vertically on its "bell" end in my hydraulic press, I insert a long piece of bar stock (I use an old '35-'36 axle that has damaged threads on tapered end, & excessive wear on gear teeth) thru the small end of the axle housing, which sits on top of the steel bar, and pushes the bar and bearing race out of the axle housing using my press.
I tend to save and carefully examine all original used bearings and races that I remove from my old Fords that were manufactured in the USA,...because in some cases they are much better quality than many of todays new bearings and races coming from off shore suppliers.
Because of this, I do not use the welding bead method that will get that bearing race out, but also destroy the possibility of reuse.
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Old 04-07-2020, 05:23 PM   #4
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Default Banjo bell bearing race puller?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JM 35 Sedan View Post
Chris, if we're talking about the carrier bearing races into the large end of the axle housing, which could be referred to as a "bell", I made a very simple steel bar, radiused on both ends, that's inserted into the "bell" end of axle housing, and sits on top of a small exposed ledge of that bearing race. With the axle housing sitting vertically on its "bell" end in my hydraulic press, I insert a long piece of bar stock (I use an old '35-'36 axle that has damaged threads on tapered end, & excessive wear on gear teeth) thru the small end of the axle housing, which sits on top of the steel bar, and pushes the bar and bearing race out of the axle housing using my press.
I tend to save and carefully examine all original used bearings and races that I remove from my old Fords that were manufactured in the USA,...because in some cases they are much better quality than many of todays new bearings and races coming from off shore suppliers.
Because of this, I do not use the welding bead method that will get that bearing race out, but also destroy the possibility of reuse.

Thanks for this! I had only briefly considered pressing rather than pulling, and figured it would be a struggle having to run through the bell, then I saw the Ford tool for this, and how narrow the exposed shoulder of the race was and thought I would need a specialty tool. I wasnít thinking of the race quality, which is a good point, just that I didnít want to chance screwing up the bell with heat.

Can you tell me a bit more about the small bar youíre using against the shoulder? Is this just round bar stock radiused at each end to match the curvature of the case? Or flat stock..
Iím thinking about how much surface area contact is necessary to safety press....Iím envisioning flat stock and a straight cut on your axle stub up against it, is that correct?

-Chris


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Old 04-07-2020, 06:29 PM   #5
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

Do what deuce lover says. Just weld them out. (funny term). no tools or press involved. Takes just a few minutes with welder, stick or mig and you are done. One of the few processes that are 100% effective. Just weld 'em and sit down with a beer or cup of coffee and wait for the "cling" when the race falls out.
My opinion and experience
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Old 04-07-2020, 07:19 PM   #6
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rehpotsirhcj View Post
Thanks for this! I had only briefly considered pressing rather than pulling, and figured it would be a struggle having to run through the bell, then I saw the Ford tool for this, and how narrow the exposed shoulder of the race was and thought I would need a specialty tool. I wasnít thinking of the race quality, which is a good point, just that I didnít want to chance screwing up the bell with heat.

Can you tell me a bit more about the small bar youíre using against the shoulder? Is this just round bar stock radiused at each end to match the curvature of the case? Or flat stock..
Iím thinking about how much surface area contact is necessary to safety press....Iím envisioning flat stock and a straight cut on your axle stub up against it, is that correct?

-Chris


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Chris, I'll look for pictures I've taken in the past or take some new ones for you. This is a thick piece of rectangular bar stock, radiused on ends to sit firmly on the exposed back area of the bearing race, and just a tad bit less in total length than the inside diameter of the housing where bar locates. This method works very well for me. I can have these pressed out and new pressed in before I could get my mig welder set up and weld one of these, and as said earlier, I save these races for possible reuse it they pass my inspection. I've also found some other uses for these, so don't care to mess them up by doing the welding method of removal. Will post pics and give you dimensions asap. Stay tuned ......
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Old 04-07-2020, 07:26 PM   #7
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

33-35 carrier bearings are not that easy to come by either
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Old 04-07-2020, 09:15 PM   #8
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

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33-35 carrier bearings are not that easy to come by either
Lawrie

I agree Lawrie, and thank you for the response to my recent pm.
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Old 04-08-2020, 12:25 AM   #9
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

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Chris, I'll look for pictures I've taken in the past or take some new ones for you. This is a thick piece of rectangular bar stock, radiused on ends to sit firmly on the exposed back area of the bearing race, and just a tad bit less in total length than the inside diameter of the housing where bar locates. This method works very well for me. I can have these pressed out and new pressed in before I could get my mig welder set up and weld one of these, and as said earlier, I save these races for possible reuse it they pass my inspection. I've also found some other uses for these, so don't care to mess them up by doing the welding method of removal. Will post pics and give you dimensions asap. Stay tuned ......

Thatís perfect. Photos help a lot, thank you for your trouble.
I scrounged around the shop and found some bits that I think will work for the job. Too late for grinding in my neighborhood tonight, so Iíll report back. Finally, a use for the 3í length of model A driveline thatís been kicking around my shop for years...


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Old 04-08-2020, 03:03 AM   #10
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JM 35 Sedan View Post
Chris, I'll look for pictures I've taken in the past or take some new ones for you. This is a thick piece of rectangular bar stock, radiused on ends to sit firmly on the exposed back area of the bearing race, and just a tad bit less in total length than the inside diameter of the housing where bar locates. This method works very well for me. I can have these pressed out and new pressed in before I could get my mig welder set up and weld one of these, and as said earlier, I save these races for possible reuse it they pass my inspection. I've also found some other uses for these, so don't care to mess them up by doing the welding method of removal. Will post pics and give you dimensions asap. Stay tuned ......
Thanks for the picture - makes it very easy to see what you described. I like this method as most folks don't have the KR Wilson pullers that were originally used by many.
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Old 04-08-2020, 11:16 AM   #11
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

That bar design was originally part of a puller I was making years ago to remove those outer races, but in my haste to complete a rebuild on a '35 banjo rear, I decided to use it for pressing those races out, and that worked so well that the puller never made it off the drawing board...
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Old 04-08-2020, 11:13 PM   #12
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

Following up in case anyone might want to use this method. It worked pretty slick! the races came out without damage to them as far as I can tell, and itís free to boot. I only had 1/4 flat stock laying around, and that did work, but bent a bit in the process. For the second I cut a chunk off an old cold chisel and welded that to back of the plate. Maybe someone can school me on gauging the condition of used races. Would be good to know if the current replacements are low quality. A couple photos, the first is the setup I used, and the second looking up into the bell when on the press. I used the magnet from a HF small parts dish to hold everything in place until I had the bar seated. Damn that was fun!





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Old 04-09-2020, 07:03 AM   #13
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

Source NOS parts (bearings) when u can. 99% of the time your money ahead when using such.
Southside Obsolete is a great source.
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Old 04-09-2020, 10:12 AM   #14
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

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Source NOS parts (bearings) when u can. 99% of the time your money ahead when using such.
Southside Obsolete is a great source.

Thanks, Iíll check them out. My go to otherwise (currently) would be Vanpelt. I had a good experience with them with my trans. But Iím new to Banjos and so happy to hear about good vendors.


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Old 04-09-2020, 10:38 AM   #15
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

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Source NOS parts (bearings) when u can. 99% of the time your money ahead when using such.
Southside Obsolete is a great source.
Yes, I totally agree with using NOS bearings if/when you can find them at a price that's reasonable and makes sense to use them. I just don't care to use bearings coming out of some of the offshore sources.

I'm assembling a '37 - '40 rear now, and was lucky enough to find all NOS bearings required for this assembly from 3rd Gen Automotive in Tennessee. However, with the number of '35 - '40 rears I've aquired and disassembled for component parts in recent times, I've found some very nice sets of used bearings that I occasionally use in my own cars. I do a thorough inspection on these bearings, and only use those that pass my inspection.
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Old 04-09-2020, 10:49 AM   #16
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

I can't help but agree with u JM 35 Sedan
Third Generation is a great source for parts. Van pelt as well. . I've bought a a bunch of things from them both.
Also, the use of good used bearings and races.
The quality of yesterday can't be spoke of enough of.
Reminds me of a great quote. "Quality is remembered, long after price is forgotten".
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Old 04-09-2020, 11:02 AM   #17
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

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Originally Posted by rehpotsirhcj View Post
Following up in case anyone might want to use this method. It worked pretty slick! the races came out without damage to them as far as I can tell, and it’s free to boot. I only had 1/4 flat stock laying around, and that did work, but bent a bit in the process. For the second I cut a chunk off an old cold chisel and welded that to back of the plate. Maybe someone can school me on gauging the condition of used races. Would be good to know if the current replacements are low quality. A couple photos, the first is the setup I used, and the second looking up into the bell when on the press. I used the magnet from a HF small parts dish to hold everything in place until I had the bar seated. Damn that was fun!





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It looks like "mission accomplished" to me

A couple things I recall about making that cross bar was making the total length and radiused ends such that it would just fit on the exposed ledge of the brg race, and stay pretty much centered in place inside the housing when on top of the race. I probably lucked out on the thickness necessary to prevent the bar from bending, but I used a piece of what I, or maybe it was what the company I worked for, considered to be scrap metal.
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Old 04-11-2020, 08:44 AM   #18
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Default Re: Banjo bell bearing race puller?

i think i just knocked them out with a long piece of 3/8 all thread
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