The Ford Barn

TDS · 09-29-2015, 03:10 PM

Hi

Will check the timinggear.
I can remove the gearcover from below.
Can I replace the timinggear without taking the engine out?
Do I need a special puller or will it slide out?
Can someone help me with a link to the right part and maybe a link to a good guide.
It's a stock 1935 221 cui flathead in a model 48.

Thank you a lot:-)

32 4door · 10-02-2015, 05:54 AM

Hi any update on this problem ?

AnthonyG · 10-02-2015, 09:40 AM

"Exactly the same rythmn every time"
If the frequency of the rythmn doesn't increase with the rpm its not internal to the engine. Any internal engine knock will increase its frequency with higher rpm.

1938 Coupe · 10-02-2015, 02:25 PM

[QUOTE=Lanny;1163695]================================================== =

There are some of the most quallified flathead mechanics in the world
on this site, and some damn good back-yard mechanics here, too.

The information is free for the asking, and more times than not, the
advice given here helps the original poster with his problem.

.[/QUOTE I know there are a lot of qualified flathead folks here and I regularly use this site for good information, but using a qualified mechanic is just another option and doesn't that qualify as another opinion? My intent wasn't to say these other opinions don't count for value, just another option is to use a mechanic.
Sorry if any one with common sense was offended. My 2 cents!

TDS · 10-03-2015, 02:08 AM

Hi

Work has kept me busy so I havnt had time to get further into it

The frequency of the rythmn does increase with the rpm comes up.

Hope to find time to take the timing cover of today.
Will post update later

corvette8n · 10-03-2015, 09:18 AM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

My ring gear got cockeyed on the flywheel and it was hitting the block, at first we replaced the main bearings thinking that was the problem, tapped the ring gear back in place and had it tacked welded in a couple of spots.

The noise on mine would change when I pushed in on the clutch.

TDS · 10-04-2015, 08:26 AM

Hi

Finally got to it...

Camgear og crankshaftgear looks just fine.

Teeth are all there.

Timing marks are right on.

Messure endplay on camshaft to 0,55 mm (around 0,216 ") + gasket.
Messured with a feelerblade between camshaft end and back of timingcover.

I took this video before I took it apart.
Fan belt is of.
Still this knocking rythm. Gets louder when under load.
I can feel the knocking on the distributor body.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJCx...ature=youtu.be

Please see photos...
Im stuck any good ideas

?

RobR'35 · 10-04-2015, 10:12 AM

I'd bank on what Walt D. has to say.
He's helped me in the past. Just listening to the problem my engine was having he gave a diagnosis of the fix.
He was dead on.
This site is better than bringing ur car to a mechanic.
The best mechanics for the flat head in the world are on here and want to help.

TDS · 10-04-2015, 11:50 AM

Manifold of.

Turned the crankshaft with a wrench.
Valves opens and close freely.
Some sludge down at the valvetrain. Cleaned it before picture taken.

I might hear a one knock when turning the crankshaft a full 360 degrees but its hard to say if its just the old chassis.

Is the camshaft and the crankshaft connected beside the camgear?

Was pretty sure I would find a damaged camgear or crankshaft gear but they look fine?

scooder · 10-04-2015, 03:30 PM

Did you try shorting the sparking plugs?
Martin.

richard crow · 10-05-2015, 04:43 AM

you say it started after you changed the carb . are you sure you did not drop something in the manfold . also check the carb for missing parts . remove spark plugs check them to see if something is hiting the plug.

leakers · 10-05-2015, 06:32 AM

The vacuum brake on the distributor !!! ..Maybe working differently because of different carb/conection? or vacuum taken from different port...or may simply be that the vacuum brake has been stuck in the past and has now moved and or freed up , causing the advance plate to move and cause a knock.. Not an ignition knock , but a mechanical knock in the distributor.
Did you try taking the carb back off and putting the original one on.

VeryTangled · 10-05-2015, 06:59 AM

Hi Everyone, It's a little late for this suggestion, but TDS can you try a different distributor? You've said a couple of times that you can feel it vibrating.

TDS · 10-05-2015, 01:46 PM

Hi

It started when I had another distributor installed.

I replaced it with a rebuild distributor, I rebuild it myself.
I thought it was an issue with the plunger and maybe incorrect timing.
Replace didnt change anything.

Tried to disconnect one sparkplug at the time but it didnt change anything.

The knocking is clearly at the front of the engine.
I dont think a bearing will that kind of knocking neither at the camshaft or the crankshaft.
But maybe Im wrong?..

Going this far I should proberly take of the heads of too.

Can I pull the camshaft out without removing the valves?.
Is there other issues I need to be aware of if I pull the camshaft out?.

Thanks..

Bassman/NZ · 10-05-2015, 02:09 PM

No, you cannot remove the cam without removing all the valves.
I'm following this with interest because I too have something similar. I have had my heads off twice, replaced the valves, guides and followers etc, had the distributer off (which is a Bubba rebuild), had the cam gear cover off, replaced #5 piston and rings and bearings, and still that persistent knock.
Have you used a stethoscope (fancy name for a length of rubber hose) to try and isolate the knock? I did, and the #5 valve area is very noisy compared to other cylinders, but I can't trace the knock. Maybe you will have better luck than me.

richard crow · 10-05-2015, 04:01 PM

your first post said after you chaned the carb now you say after you changed the dist. which is it

19Fordy · 10-05-2015, 04:46 PM

Could it be piston slap?

Walt Dupont--Me. · 10-05-2015, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TDS

Hi

It started when I had another distributor installed.

I replaced it with a rebuild distributor, I rebuild it myself.
I thought it was an issue with the plunger and maybe incorrect timing.
Replace didnt change anything.

Tried to disconnect one sparkplug at the time but it didnt change anything.

The knocking is clearly at the front of the engine.
I dont think a bearing will that kind of knocking neither at the camshaft or the crankshaft.
But maybe Im wrong?..

Going this far I should proberly take of the heads of too.

Can I pull the camshaft out without removing the valves?.
Is there other issues I need to be aware of if I pull the camshaft out?.

Thanks..

You can pull the cam without removing the valves, pry the valves wide open with a pickle fork, install cloth pins under the head of the valves, pull the lifters up till they hit the valve stems, hold the lifters in the up postion, you could wire them up, it's easier with engine out upside down, line the timing marks up and pull the cam out. Why do you want to pull the cam if the valves are all same lift? Walt

Johnnydidd · 10-06-2015, 09:21 AM

I think you have something in a cylinder or rod bearing.

deuce_roadster · 10-06-2015, 10:52 AM

Check the carb and see if all 4 of the brass screws that hold the butterflies in are there. I was sure I had a rod bearing go and it was one of those screws came out and got into a cylinder.

09-29-2015, 03:10 PM	#21
TDS Member Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Denmark, Aarhus Posts: 49	Re: Engine knocking Hi Will check the timinggear. I can remove the gearcover from below. Can I replace the timinggear without taking the engine out? Do I need a special puller or will it slide out? Can someone help me with a link to the right part and maybe a link to a good guide. It's a stock 1935 221 cui flathead in a model 48. Thank you a lot:-) Last edited by TDS; 09-29-2015 at 03:16 PM.

10-02-2015, 05:54 AM	#22
32 4door Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Sydney australia Posts: 23	Re: Engine knocking Hi any update on this problem ?

10-02-2015, 09:40 AM	#23
AnthonyG Senior Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: Pa. Posts: 2,167	Re: Engine knocking "Exactly the same rythmn every time" If the frequency of the rythmn doesn't increase with the rpm its not internal to the engine. Any internal engine knock will increase its frequency with higher rpm. __________________ Nomad

10-02-2015, 02:25 PM	#24
1938 Coupe Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Cloverdale California Posts: 148	Re: Engine knocking [QUOTE=Lanny;1163695]================================================== = There are some of the most quallified flathead mechanics in the world on this site, and some damn good back-yard mechanics here, too. The information is free for the asking, and more times than not, the advice given here helps the original poster with his problem. .[/QUOTE I know there are a lot of qualified flathead folks here and I regularly use this site for good information, but using a qualified mechanic is just another option and doesn't that qualify as another opinion? My intent wasn't to say these other opinions don't count for value, just another option is to use a mechanic. Sorry if any one with common sense was offended. My 2 cents! __________________ "DON'T CRUSH IT....RESTORE IT"

10-03-2015, 02:08 AM	#25
TDS Member Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Denmark, Aarhus Posts: 49	Re: Engine knocking Hi Work has kept me busy so I havnt had time to get further into it The frequency of the rythmn does increase with the rpm comes up. Hope to find time to take the timing cover of today. Will post update later

10-03-2015, 09:18 AM	#26
corvette8n Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: 36 miles north of Albany NY Posts: 2,949	Re: Engine knocking Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) My ring gear got cockeyed on the flywheel and it was hitting the block, at first we replaced the main bearings thinking that was the problem, tapped the ring gear back in place and had it tacked welded in a couple of spots. The noise on mine would change when I pushed in on the clutch.

10-04-2015, 10:12 AM	#28
RobR'35 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Upper Peninsula, Michigan Posts: 604	Re: Engine knocking I'd bank on what Walt D. has to say. He's helped me in the past. Just listening to the problem my engine was having he gave a diagnosis of the fix. He was dead on. This site is better than bringing ur car to a mechanic. The best mechanics for the flat head in the world are on here and want to help.

10-04-2015, 03:30 PM	#30
scooder Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 2,593	Re: Engine knocking Did you try shorting the sparking plugs? Martin.

10-05-2015, 04:43 AM	#31
richard crow Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,770	Re: Engine knocking you say it started after you changed the carb . are you sure you did not drop something in the manfold . also check the carb for missing parts . remove spark plugs check them to see if something is hiting the plug.

10-05-2015, 06:32 AM	#32
leakers Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Tauranga , New Zealand Posts: 37	Re: Engine knocking The vacuum brake on the distributor !!! ..Maybe working differently because of different carb/conection? or vacuum taken from different port...or may simply be that the vacuum brake has been stuck in the past and has now moved and or freed up , causing the advance plate to move and cause a knock.. Not an ignition knock , but a mechanical knock in the distributor. Did you try taking the carb back off and putting the original one on.

10-05-2015, 06:59 AM	#33
VeryTangled Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: (Not far enough...) Outside of DC Posts: 3,387	Re: Engine knocking Hi Everyone, It's a little late for this suggestion, but TDS can you try a different distributor? You've said a couple of times that you can feel it vibrating. __________________ -Jeff H Have you thought about supporting the Early Ford V-8 Foundation Museum?

10-05-2015, 01:46 PM	#34
TDS Member Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Denmark, Aarhus Posts: 49	Re: Engine knocking Hi It started when I had another distributor installed. I replaced it with a rebuild distributor, I rebuild it myself. I thought it was an issue with the plunger and maybe incorrect timing. Replace didnt change anything. Tried to disconnect one sparkplug at the time but it didnt change anything. The knocking is clearly at the front of the engine. I dont think a bearing will that kind of knocking neither at the camshaft or the crankshaft. But maybe Im wrong?.. Going this far I should proberly take of the heads of too. Can I pull the camshaft out without removing the valves?. Is there other issues I need to be aware of if I pull the camshaft out?. Thanks.. Last edited by TDS; 10-05-2015 at 02:00 PM.

10-05-2015, 02:09 PM	#35
Bassman/NZ Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Napier, New Zealand Posts: 2,001	Re: Engine knocking No, you cannot remove the cam without removing all the valves. I'm following this with interest because I too have something similar. I have had my heads off twice, replaced the valves, guides and followers etc, had the distributer off (which is a Bubba rebuild), had the cam gear cover off, replaced #5 piston and rings and bearings, and still that persistent knock. Have you used a stethoscope (fancy name for a length of rubber hose) to try and isolate the knock? I did, and the #5 valve area is very noisy compared to other cylinders, but I can't trace the knock. Maybe you will have better luck than me. Last edited by Bassman/NZ; 10-05-2015 at 02:17 PM.

10-05-2015, 04:01 PM	#36
richard crow Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,770	Re: Engine knocking your first post said after you chaned the carb now you say after you changed the dist. which is it

10-05-2015, 04:46 PM	#37
19Fordy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Coral Springs FL Posts: 10,936	Re: Engine knocking Could it be piston slap?

10-06-2015, 09:21 AM	#39
Johnnydidd Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Overland Park, Ks Posts: 559	Re: Engine knocking I think you have something in a cylinder or rod bearing.

10-06-2015, 10:52 AM	#40
deuce_roadster Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Shelton, WA Posts: 3,800	Re: Engine knocking Check the carb and see if all 4 of the brass screws that hold the butterflies in are there. I was sure I had a rod bearing go and it was one of those screws came out and got into a cylinder.