Crank misaligned with FAM

[huddy]

Hi guys

Latest is that we were able to accomplish the timing by jacking a tire & removing all the plugs. Couldn't hardly budge the engine with the plugs in, so I suspect I don't have a compression problem. We did this in 3rd gear.

After being timed, the engine ran better than before. It was probably off time, plus the points were in horrible shape. They are new style and I have ordered the parts to convert it back to old style (points looked like something borrowed off an old garden tractor - we used a fine file and emery cloth to clean them, and the rotor was in contact with the plastic cam follower, pushing them off center).

Once we had the car running, we decided to check the rear mounts. Jacking the bell housing did not improve the alignment of the crank, and reversing the mounts would only make the problem worse. There's not much clearance to raise the back of the engine anyway - the battery cable hits the firewall, and even relocating the cable would only yield a half inch or so, and I don't want the engine that close to the body. Lowering the rear of the engine did no good either.

I'm going to see if anything can be done with the front mount. I don't know if it's original parts - the springs are conical rather than cylindrical. The replacements (Bratton's) appear to be cylindrical in the photos.

Again, thanks to all who responded for your words of wisdom.

Rgds
Ed

[huddy]

No problem here. I'm careful with anything that old anyway. I've ordered the crank wrench from Bratton's which has a hex box end to engage the pulley nut at the rear, and is bent to clear the pulley. It doesn't use the ratchet teeth on the front of the nut.

Originally Posted by 700rpm

Huddy, I didn't mean to imply that using the crank might damage the pulley; that is the right way to turn it. I meant applying some kind of pry bar or long screwdriver from the side might cause damage. Your crank should work fine if the ratchet bolt is in good condition.

[huddy]

Marco,

Thanks, yes I did. The two top springs are conical shaped and appear to be held with drilled bolts & castellated nuts. The mount is yoke shaped. There appears to be some space left in the bottom spring and I may see if I can pull the front of the engine down with that bolt.

Ed

Originally Posted by Marco Tahtaras

In my experience it's highly unlikely you have the original front mount springs. Did you check out the link in post #10? I'm betting on that being the problem. The good thing is appropriate springs are now readily available.

[Tom Wesenberg]

I've had a couple of those conical springs and they were connected to each other. I removed them and bought the correct springs. Adjusting the bottom spring then pulled the crank into perfect alignment to use the hand crank.

[pat in Santa Cruz]

Oh, those conical springs always mess up the crank alignment, as well as increase vibration. In the long run, the connection between them vibrates deep into the cross member, weakening it. The original mounts ( front and back) work the best because they were designed for the job by Ford engineers.

[huddy]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

I've ordered the original mount and springs & hardware from Snyder's; we'll see if it fixes the alignment problem. (I can't stand for anything not to be right).

[700rpm]

Originally Posted by huddy

Hi guys

Latest is that we were able to accomplish the timing by jacking a tire & removing all the plugs. Couldn't hardly budge the engine with the plugs in, so I suspect I don't have a compression problem. We did this in 3rd gear.

After being timed, the engine ran better than before. It was probably off time, plus the points were in horrible shape. They are new style and I have ordered the parts to convert it back to old style (points looked like something borrowed off an old garden tractor - we used a fine file and emery cloth to clean them, and the rotor was in contact with the plastic cam follower, pushing them off center).

Once we had the car running, we decided to check the rear mounts. Jacking the bell housing did not improve the alignment of the crank, and reversing the mounts would only make the problem worse. There's not much clearance to raise the back of the engine anyway - the battery cable hits the firewall, and even relocating the cable would only yield a half inch or so, and I don't want the engine that close to the body. Lowering the rear of the engine did no good either.

I'm going to see if anything can be done with the front mount. I don't know if it's original parts - the springs are conical rather than cylindrical. The replacements (Bratton's) appear to be cylindrical in the photos.

Again, thanks to all who responded for your words of wisdom.

Rgds
Ed

If you've got good compression you don't have a problem.

[Richard in Anaheim CA]

My old friend Urb Stair, now long gone, told me years ago take those things out and install stock mounts. They can't be beat. Urb posted regularly in The Restorer for years under his nom de plume, Red-E-Power and is also a contributor in the Tiny Tips book sold by MAFCA.

I now remove them and install stock rear mounts and stock front mounts in all my cars.

Richard
Anaheim CA.

[huddy]

From last year, believe it or not. I've been traveling a lot and haven't had a chance to do much actual wrenching until this week.

I removed the old front engine mount, which was NOT stock and had the two conical springs attached together, plus no spring below the crossmember.

I had the excellent repop front engine mount from Snyder's, and installed that (which was no picnic - there's not much room to work with if you don't remove the radiator*). Amazingly, the crank hole now aligns correctly with the crankshaft pulley. The engine looks "right" now, whereas it didn't look "right" before.

So here's a belated thanks to all those who provided advice and moral support!

* To remove the old front mount and install the new, I had to remove the hood, loosen the side/rear FAM mounts, remove the FAM transmission mount, and remove the alternator to make space to work in. I had to jack the engine upward an inch or two, which really made me uncomfortable. To install the new mount, I found that I had to put the lower spring, bushing, and nut on first, just a couple threads in place, then put the two upper springs on. In order to get them to fit, I threaded a cargo strap thru the bolt holes in the new mount, tightened over the radiator braces, first on one side, then the other, to pull the mount upward enough to force the springs in. Then I lowered the engine and bolted the mount in place. Finally I tightened the nut on the lower bolt so that the crank would engage, lined up the hole for the cotter pin, and installed the pin. Then, of course, undo everything I removed or loosened. Whew! But it was worth it.

I'm sure there's an easier way but I couldn't figure out anything better, and it worked for me.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Thanks for reporting back, Huddy, we been holding our breath, (WHHHEEEW!) It's been 11 months, you're slower than me.
Bill W.

[TDO]

I had the same problem with mine, not as bad as yours, I just put in the front float a motor mount and now the motor sets were it's supposed to. I already had the rear float a motor mount. worked for me, It also made my coupe run smoother. Mine also had an after market front mount and woulden't let the motor come down far enough.

[Purdy Swoft]

I'm not a fan of float-A-motor mounts. I do use the conical joined front mount springs and feel that they are an improvement. I have no pronlem with hand crank alignment. I don't use the rubber parts with the aftermarket mount springs but use a spring under the castillated nut under the front crossmember. I have found the aftermarket front mount springs to remove chatter when taking off in some cars with chatter. They may be called a band aid by some. Sometimes the easy way is best when it works. A lot of others must like them as well because they have been offered for many, many years. Just my experience with them. I can't guarantee that everyone will have the same results.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Originally Posted by Purdy Swoft

I'm not a fan of float-A-motor mounts. I do use the conical joined front mount springs and feel that they are an improvement. I have no pronlem with hand crank alignment. I don't use the rubber parts with the aftermarket mount springs but use a spring under the castillated nut under the front crossmember. I have found the aftermarket front mount springs to remove chatter when taking off in some cars with chatter. They may be called a band aid by some. Sometimes the easy way is best when it works. A lot of others must like them as well because they have been offered for many, many years. Just my experience with them. I can't guarantee that everyone will have the same results.

Vermin is identical, I took the rubber cones out of the "beehive" springs. I just have to crank down the lower nut little, so the crank will go in. Buster T. calls me a "CRANK NUT"!
Bill W.

[huddy]

Enrico* doesn't have a chatter problem - balanced crank & V8 clutch, starts & shifts smoothly. I didn't like the aftermarket front mount as I felt it kept the front of the engine too high. I don't have a problem with the FAM rear mounts - even if I did, I don't know where the originals are so I'm basically stuck with them.

*Enrico = Spanish for "Henry" since it's a SoCal car originally

[Purdy Swoft]

Originally Posted by huddy

Enrico* doesn't have a chatter problem - balanced crank & V8 clutch, starts & shifts smoothly. I didn't like the aftermarket front mount as I felt it kept the front of the engine too high. I don't have a problem with the FAM rear mounts - even if I did, I don't know where the originals are so I'm basically stuck with them.

*Enrico = Spanish for "Henry" since it's a SoCal car originally

I installed float-A-motor mounts in our 31 coupe back in 1980, still in it till this day. They aren't that bad if the rear mount part that connects to the universal joint housing is used. It did develope some chatter shortly after installation. I installed the aftermarket front mount springs and a Mallory dual point distributor and that mostly solved the chatter. I was told by one guy that the Mallory advanced so smoothly that it helped relieve the chatter. My daughter now has the coupe and drives it quite a bit. I've got a bunch of rear mount blocks but they would be a real pain to replace. My daughter is happy with it and I probably will never change them out, being as I don't have to..