The GREAT Introducing Ms. American 3.14159 Caper

[JCAllison]

Hey All,
Permit me to introduce myself. I am JCAllison, 80 years old, and caretaker of Ms. American 3.14159, the ONLY 1964 Ford Galaxie 500, Four-Door, Hard-Top, Fast-Back, Police Interceptor that Google finds on the WHOLE World Wide Web.

Have been lurking your very nice Forum for some time. AND met Mr. KULTULZ back in 2007, over at the FordMuscleForum.

Ms. American was bought by my Father in March of 1964, was my Mother's Daily Driver, and when she could no longer see well enough to get her driver's license, she told my Father that she'd drive without a license. My Father, in order to keep that from happening, called me from Cherry Valley, California in June of 1986, and said: "You've always liked this old Ford, if you'd like to have it, come get it."

As he understood the law in California, you can't just GIVE someone a car. You HAVE to sell it. So he charged me $1.00!

I drove Ms. American from Cherry Valley to Houston, Texas 33 years ago yesterday (June 6, 1986), and the old Gal has lived with me all those years. She is in better shape today than she was when I got her.

I don't yet know how to post an image on this Forum, but have many JPGs of all kinds of stuff. If someone could give some hints on how to do that, it would be greatly appreciated.

Would like to say a special hello to Mr. Kultulz, to whom I haven't spoken in many years. So "HI! Mr. K", hope you are doing well.

Take care everyone, will post more later.

JC

[KULTULZ]

JC! ...

I'll be damned ...

Glad to hear you are getting along well and you still have your P-CODE.

Man' I was in love with that '64. I still have photos of it somewhere ...

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

JC! ... I'll be damned ...

Hey Mr. K,
Surprise!

Glad to hear you are getting along well and you still have your P-CODE.

The old Gal is in the best shape she's ever been in since coming to live with me.

Completely rebuilt her PI Front Suspension, that doesn't have the "Easy Rider" dropped Front Lower Control Arms connections.

Put in all NEW Brake Lines, Wheel Cylinders, and Master Cylinder.

Had Champion Carburetors in Arlington, Texas (they took over Pony Carbs when John Enyart passed) rebuild the Autolite 4100 C4AF-9510-DG, and it was just GORGEOUS.

THEN, could never get the 4100's Rube Goldberg Choke System to work. So installed a "Mustangs Etc." Manual Choke System, and it made all the difference in the world about how the 3.14 STARTS.

The Manual Choke closes the PRIMARY Choke Plate, and have the Primaries Throttle Plates adjusted COMPLETELY CLOSED. Installed a Fuel/Air Mixture Screw in the Threaded Hole that keeps the Secondary Throttle Plates from sticking in their bores, and have the 4100 Idling on the Secondaries.

This keeps the Distributor from seeing any vacuum from the Primaries at idle.

With the Pertronix Ignitor III, and 60,000 Volt Pertronix Flamethrowere HC Ignition Coil, the 3.14 starts and runs MARVELOUSLY.

Man' I was in love with that '64. I still have photos of it somewhere ...

If someone would let me know how to post JPGs here, I'd send you more.

Have kept a complete image documentation of EVERYTHING that has been done.

BTW, in the 12 years since I met you, I've become a fair to middling mechanic!

Don't know if you remember Lorrie Van Haul, the 1967 Dodge P200 Post Office Vehicle which is Ms. PI's Running Mate/Chase Truck, but am in the process of completely rebuilding her Right Hand Drive Manual Steering System.

She is doing GREAT! Have to say that her MIGHTY 225 Slant Six is the SWEETEST Engine I've ever had. I LIKE the 3.14 FE, but I LOVE the /6!

Anyway, nice to hear from you. Was casting about for a NEW Ford Forum for Ms. American, and when I saw your name here at FordBarn, I registered, and here we are.

Hope this finds YOU doing well. Have MUCH to talk about. Take care.

JC

[5851a]

Nice to hear about Miss American, followed on FM until they changed passwords on me and gave me a 20 digit alphanumeric password.

[KULTULZ]

JC, send me the photos on a PM and I will post them for you. I will also describe how to post photos.




Now that was dumba$$, how can he PM if he can't attach photographs ... ?

Yes, I remember your parcel van and yes, the MOPAR SLANT SIX was a tough engine.

[JCAllison]

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Originally Posted by KULTULZ

JC, send me the photos on a PM and I will post them for you. I will also describe how to post photos.

Hey Mr. K,
Let me see if I can figure this out...

Now that was dumba$$, how can he PM if he can't attach photographs ?

Am not sure, but I think I've attached a JPG of Ms. American. It hasn't show up anywhere that I can see, but it may be that it has to be posted before it shows up.

Yes, I remember your parcel van and yes, the MOPAR SLANT SIX was a tough engine.

Her name is Lorrie Van Haul. She's my sweetheart.

Well, I just previewed this post, and wonder of wonders, there is a JPG of Ms. American attached.

And this is a generic Question... Has anyone ever seen a Fastener like the one on the Left in the attached JPG? If you have, how does one get it to come off of the Screw to which it is fastened?

Inquiring minds want to know.

JC

[rotorwrench]

I can't tell for sure what the fastener is but it looks similar to a rivet nut. I use several types of rivet nuts. They are manufactured under several trade names. If that's what it is and it has come loose, they can be difficult to remove. Some have serrations on the body and some have to have a key way filed in to keep them from rotating if they come loose. I usually grind the screw head off when possible. Drilling may be possible if a person can keep it from rotating. Not a fun job if that is what you've got there.

I've seen a few 4-door hardtops in both Galaxie and Marauder trim. They are nice cars. The back doors are hard to spot on some depending on the paint scheme. I've always been partial to the FE 390 engines too.

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

I can't tell for sure what the fastener is but it looks similar to a rivet nut. I use several types of rivet nuts. They are manufactured under several trade names. If that's what it is and it has come loose, they can be difficult to remove. Some have serrations on the body and some have to have a key way filed in to keep them from rotating if they come loose. I usually grind the screw head off when possible. Drilling may be possible if a person can keep it from rotating. Not a fun job if that is what you've got there.

Hey Mr. RW,
Turned out the THINGY was a Nyloc Nut!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nyloc_nut

I've seen a few 4-door hardtops in both Galaxie and Marauder trim. They are nice cars. The back doors are hard to spot on some depending on the paint scheme.

Am attaching some more JPGs of Ms. American

I've always been partial to the FE 390 engines too.

I call Ms. American's Engine "The 3.14". It's a P-Code 390 FE. Solid Lifters, Cast Iron Shorty Headers. And the Police Interceptor has Kelsey Hayes Severe Service Wheels. She is driven rather gently, though on occasion she is taken to 5,500 RPM in second gear to clean out the carbon. She does it effortlessly, and is turbine smooth.

Anyway, thanks for the response. Am glad the Nyloc Nuts were not the exotic stuff of which you spoke.

Take care.

JC

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by JCAllison

Completely rebuilt her PI Front Suspension, that doesn't have the "Easy Rider" dropped Front Lower Control Arms connections.

Had Champion Carburetors in Arlington, Texas (they took over Pony Carbs when John Enyart passed) rebuild the Autolite 4100 C4AF-9510-DG, and it was just GORGEOUS.

THEN, could never get the 4100's Rube Goldberg Choke System to work. So installed a "Mustangs Etc." Manual Choke System, and it made all the difference in the world about how the 3.14 STARTS.

The Manual Choke closes the PRIMARY Choke Plate, and have the Primaries Throttle Plates adjusted COMPLETELY CLOSED. Installed a Fuel/Air Mixture Screw in the Threaded Hole that keeps the Secondary Throttle Plates from sticking in their bores, and have the 4100 Idling on the Secondaries.

This keeps the Distributor from seeing any vacuum from the Primaries at idle.

JC

The car didn't have the lower control arm pivots from the factory did it?

As for the carb modification(s), you have come a long ways since back when ...

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by 5851a

Nice to hear about Miss American, followed on FM until they changed passwords on me and gave me a 20 digit alphanumeric password.

Had the same kind of problem when Vertical Scope bought FM.

JC

[Coosawjack]

I'm finally here JC....WHEW!!

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

The car didn't have the lower control arm pivots from the factory did it?

Hey Mr. K,
No. It has long, straight 9/16 Diameter Bolts that go through off-set pieces that fit into the Front and Back of the Front Crossmember. See the JPGs of those Units.

As for the carb modification(s), you have come a long ways since back when ...

When I first met you, Ms. American had a Holley 4150, w/ Vacuum Secondaries. Doing all the stuff that has been done to the old Gal has been a learning process.

Am attaching the Autolite 4100's "Mustangs Etc." Manual Choke setup.

Also Mr. K, have completely rebuilt the Window Escapements and Windwings. That was GREAT fun.

Will also have to tell you about Rosemary's Miscarriage sometime!

JC

[KULTULZ]

Is (was) this the OEM manual choke setup for the 289HP? Very hard to find.

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

Is (was) this the OEM manual choke setup for the 289HP? Very hard to find.

Hey Mr. K,
No. It's a Mustangs Etc. Manual Choke System. See here:

https://www.mustangsetc.com/hi-po-ma...onversion-kit/

So simple. I could never get the Autolite 4100 Rube Goldberg Choke System to work. Got this. It COMPLETELY transformed the 3.14. That along with Rosemary's Miscarriage!

JC

[mercman from oz]

It is very refreshing to see a Four Door Hardtop being loved. Unfortunately, most collectors believe that Two Door Hardtops and Convertibles are the only body styles worth collecting. Love it.

[craig]

I maybe mistaken, but I think the hand choke mechanism from a 2100 Autolite on a 292 or 352 pickup/light duty truck is the same thing as the Mustang 4100 used

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by mercman from oz

It is very refreshing to see a Four Door Hardtop being loved. Unfortunately, most collectors believe that Two Door Hardtops and Convertibles are the only body styles worth collecting. Love it.

Hey Mr. MM,
Actually, I'm not a collector. I'm an inheritor. Ms. American was my Mother's Daily Driver till she could no longer pass the Eye Test to get her Driver's License. She threatened to drive without a license. So my Father had to get rid of her car. He knew that I liked the old Gal, and so he sold her to me for $1.00!

Being a P-Code make her unusual, and quite rare seeing as to how MOST Police Interceptors were Mayberry Special Four-Door Sedans. If you Google: 1964 Ford Galaxie, Four-Door, Hard-Top, Fast-Back, Police Interceptor, Ms. American will be the only one you will find on the whole World Wide Web.

BTW, when I first met Mr. Kultulz back in 2007, his comment was to the effect that he was jealous of that car, and warned me not to leave the keys in the ignition!

Anyway, I really appreciate your recognizing that even though she is a "MoreDoor", or "Door Factory" (have heard her called both by people who are, as you noted, of the opinion that Two-Door Hardtops, and Convertibles are the only way to go) she is still loveable.

She's getting ready to have her Odometer turn over to 00000 for the third time. And she is STILL quite a potent Lady. When we were both younger, she surprised many a Honda and Toyota. We no longer do stuff like that because our need for speed has diminished considerably, but the old Gal can still manage to cause a gathering in a parking lot.

You'd be surprised at how many people had a relative who had one JUST LIKE THAT!

BTW, here is a JPG of Ms. American's running mate, and chase truck. This is Lorrie Van Haul, the last (out of 3,500 built) 1967 Dodge P200 Post Office Vehicle that has lived with me since 1975. She too has some amount of ability to gather a small crowd.

Anyway, time for meds and bed. Hope you are doing well. Take care.

JC

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by craig

I maybe mistaken, but I think the hand choke mechanism from a 2100 Autolite on a 292 or 352 pickup/light duty truck is the same thing as the Mustang 4100 used

You're correct, used on both 2100/4100 SERIES.

I just had no idea it was available re-pro.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by JCAllison

BTW, when I first met Mr. Kultulz back in 2007, his comment was to the effect that he was jealous of that car, and warned me not to leave the keys in the ignition!

JC

You still had better tuck her in good at night is all I can say.

It is a beautiful body style for a 4DR, as it didn't have that period BOX TOP roof, was a true HDTP and of course the POLICE PACKAGE.

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

You still had better tuck her in good at night is all I can say.

Hey Mr. K,
The attached JPGs show the Car Port where Ms. American is ensconced when she is not being driven.

There is a somewhat mysterious story about this Car Port:

Before the Car Port was here, Ms. American languished under a large piece of Vizqueen Plastic, held in place by a HEAVY Canvas Tarp with Ropes that wrapped around her Front and Rear Ends. The reason for this covering is because the old Gal is not Water Tight, and if it rained on her, her Carpets would get wet, and moldy. As you can see in the attached JPGs, she is under this covering.

So each time that she was called on to go out and about, OR to be worked on, the Plastic and Tarp had to be removed, carefully folded, and stowed.

Then when she was returned to her Parking Place, the carefully folded (so as to make reapplication simple) Plastic and Tarp had to once again be put over her. It was a kind of a PITA, but necessary.

The upshot of all this is that it was so much easier to just get into Lorrie Van Haul, and head out. The result of THAT was that Ms. American didn't get driven very much. This situation had been discussed on one of the Ford Auto Forums.

Then one day, the phone rang. A lady's voice asked: "Mr. Allison?, when would be a convenient time for our crew to come and install your NEW Car Port?"

Thinking this was someone trying to sell me a Car Port, I replied: "Oh, I can't afford a Car Port at this time."

The lady replied: "No, no, no. It has already been paid for!"

"By whom?" I asked.

To which she replied: Well, THAT is our little secret!"

My first inclination was to suspect that there was some kind of "catch" to this approach, and so I said: "Secret? Whose little secret?"

The lady replied: "Mine, and the person who has paid for it."

"Are you kidding me?" was my retort.

"No," said the lady, "would Tuesday Afternoon be convenient?"

Well, being someone who seldom is surprised by anything anymore, I said: "Yes. I'm here all time."

She went on to confirm the address, and told me to expect the crew to arrive the next Tuesday Afternoon.

And sure enough, about 3:30 p.m. the next Tuesday, up pulled a BIG Dually, towing a Trailer, and three Latino guys get out; One came to where he could talk to me, and confirm that I was Mr. Allison. When I admitted to THAT, he turned and gave a nod to his compadres, and they went into a coordinated routine of unloading pre-welded Square Tube Frames, and LONG pieces of Formed Sheet Metal.

The lead Chicano, asked where I would like the Structure installed, and with that we kind of surveyed the area, and determined that it would fit right in front of the House.

He got out a Rattle Can of Black Spray Paint, and with a Template, and Tape Measure, sprayed where the Corners would be, and then the most WONDROUS Ballet of activity took place.

These three fellows, had OBVIOUSLY done this routine BEFORE.

It was a highly choreographed succession of events, where they fastened TWO long Square Tube Assemblies to the Concrete, by drilling and pounding Anchors in place, then bolting the Assemblies to the Pavement.

Then the Upright Square Tube Assemblies were installed on the Anchored Assemblies.

Then the Formed Sheet Metal was fastened to the Uprights with Self-Threading Sheet Metal Screws.

This whole performance lasted a little less than an hour, and when they finally started putting their equipment away, THERE was the Car Port in all its GLORY.

The leader of the pack, had me sign a document, gave me a copy, and off they went in the BIG Dually, towing a now empty Trailer.

I still don't know who sprang for the Car Port, but Ms. American no longer has to live under a sheet of Plastic held down by a Canvas Tarp, although if we are scheduled to have a Severe Weather Event, where wind might blow Rain onto the old Gal, the Plastic and Canvas is put over her.

I asked a person who I suspected had done this for Ms. American, and that person denied any involvement. So I have come to attribute this to the homily that goes: "Everything happens when it is supposed to happen." And am glad for Ms. American that she doesn't have to live a life of being covered up all the time.

It is a beautiful body style for a 4DR, as it didn't have that period BOX TOP roof, was a true HDTP and of course the POLICE PACKAGE.

Was one time talking to a fellow in the Grocery Store, and he asked: "How are Ms. American, and Lorrie Van Haul doing?" I replied: "It's like being married to a couple of old ladies!" There was an elderly woman who heard this, and not knowing that we were talking about vehicles, said: "Well, I can tell you, it's no picnic being married to an old man either!"

But in actuality, I have likened these two OLD vehicles to Ms. American being Raquel Welch, and Lorrie Van Haul being Rosie O'Donnell!

Anyway, about the Mustang Etc. Manual Choke System. Am going to start a NEW Thread about it, with a bunch of JPGs. And what was gone through to get it installed, and fitted to the 3.14's Autolite 4100 C4AF-9510-DG Carburetor. Should be informative should anyone choose to put one on their ride. Watch for it.

Take care now, you hear?

JC

[KULTULZ]

You know I am just joshing you, right?

I have an extreme allergic reaction to rock salt propelled from a 12GA ...

Getting all the glass aligned on a 4DR HDTP can be a challenge.

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

You know I am just joshing you, right?

Hey Mr. K,
Of course! But you know what? If someone DID kype Ms. American, I'd rest easier knowing it was YOU, because she'd be in the very best of hands!

I have an extreme allergic reaction to rock salt propelled from a 12GA ...

Well, I don't have a "12GA", but I DO have a .357 Magnum Colt Python and there HAVE been people who are known to have died of Lead Poisoning (but not at my hand)!

Getting all the glass aligned on a 4DR HDTP can be a challenge.

VERY TRUE. Ask me how I know!

There are a couple of parts called the Dovetail, and the Dovetail Striker (see attached illustration) which are right at the TOP of the FRONT of the Rear Door whose function is to pull the front of the Rear Window snug against the back of the Front Window.

Those two parts are boogers to install, and even bigger boogers to properly adjust! Took removing EVERYTHING a number of times to finally get it right.

BUT the next person who sees the Window Escapement Mechanisms in Ms. American is going to be impressed.

First, just getting the Interior Trim Panels off, they will find them with Aluminum Foil adhered to the back of the Panels to make them impervious to moisture, which will make the Fiber Board on which the Vinyl is attached last forever. See attached JPGs:

Then they will find the Moisture Barrier that was just a sheet of paper when it came from the factory, is now THREE layers of Press&Seal (see attached JPGs)

And then they will find all the Escapement Parts, and Wind Wing mechanisms have been painted with the SAME Black and Gold color scheme of the Engine Compartment and the 3.14. See attached JPGs.

All of the Channel Riders, were put in with lots of Marine Lube, and the stuff should never get hard like the ORIGINAL Grease used by the Factory.

Also, the interiors of the Doors have been given a layer of Under Coating.

Actually, it was quite a fun project, and turned out REALLY well. The Windows all work as good, if not better than when NEW. They are smooth, and easy. Should last a long time. It was a lot of effort, but nothing exceeds like excess!

Anyway, it's time for me to clean up the mess left from feeding the five felines that are my family, and then get on with the day, in which Lorrie Van Haul is going to get her Door Handles replaced and her Door Latches reinstalled.

Hope this finds YOU doing well, and taking excellent care.

JC

[rotorwrench]

The one thing that killed me about the Autolite 4100 is the secondary operating diaphragms. They are very thin and not much extension past the edge of the casting flange. They would work OK for a while then the diaphragm would fail and leave me with a two barrel carb. I had an old 64 T-bird that the carb and all the electric & vacuum stuff gave me fits so it went on down the road without me. It took me a long time just to get the cruise-o-matic to work well again let alone trying to keep the AC working and all the electric windows. I stick with the more manual cars now days and leave the real fancy Lincolns & T-birds to the guys with deeper pockets. A 63 Galaxie or Marauder fast back may show up in the driveway one day though. I think I'll look for the manual secondary Holley type carb for that one along with a T85-R11N for an overdrive or maybe a super T10 4-speed transmission.

[scicala]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

Is (was) this the OEM manual choke setup for the 289HP? Very hard to find.

I've seen those manual choke set ups for the 4100's on EBAY before. Somebody must reproduce them. I believe it's identical to the ones on 289 Hi Po's.


Sal

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by craig

I maybe mistaken, but I think the hand choke mechanism from a 2100 Autolite on a 292 or 352 pickup/light duty truck is the same thing as the Mustang 4100 used

Hey Craig,
Personally know nothing at all about this. It just so happened that either Amazon, or eBay was tracking my activity, and sent the suggestion about the Mustangs Etc. Manual Choke Mechanism. It had a URL, and the Webpage that came up had a very nice Video of the Device.

It's a bit pricey being over $80.00, but back when I was much younger, I had loaned an uncle a bit of money out of each one of my paychecks, and he promised when I got too old to be employable, that he would pay me back some every month. So now, it's not hard-earned cash that I'm spending, it's FREE MONEY sent each month from my fabulously wealthy Uncle!

So I thought: "What the heck!", and ordered one of those puppies. Have to say that what it did for Ms. American was nothing short of MIRACULOUS! Best $80.00+ I ever spent on the old Gal.

Am going to do a NEW Thread about it, with some of the stuff that needed doing to get it to all work properly, with JPGs and everything. It should be interesting if you're in to that kind of thing.

Anyway, hope YOU are well.

JC

[JCAllison]

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Originally Posted by rotorwrench

The one thing that killed me about the Autolite 4100 is the secondary operating diaphragms. They are very thin and not much extension past the edge of the casting flange. They would work OK for a while then the diaphragm would fail and leave me with a two barrel carb.

Hey Mr. RW,
Have never had that kind of problem. But thinking about it, are you aware of the little SCREW in the Hole in a NUB that is supposed to be turned till it hits a Lever connected to the Throttle Plates in the Secondary Bores? That little SCREW is there to keep the Secondary Throttle Plates from STICKING in the Venturi Bores. Will comment on THAT if you say you don't know about it. If you DO know about THAT, then there is something else that I have to comment about.

I had an old 64 T-bird that the carb and all the electric & vacuum stuff gave me fits so it went on down the road without me. It took me a long time just to get the cruise-o-matic to work well again let alone trying to keep the AC working and all the electric windows. I stick with the more manual cars now days and leave the real fancy Lincolns & T-birds to the guys with deeper pockets.

Have to give you an "AMEN"!" to THAT! Ms. American too is a PURE vehicle. No Power ANYTHING except the P-Code 390 FE (I call it the 3.14). No power Steering, no power Brakes, no power Windows, no power Seats, no Automatic Transmission (although the Overdrive pretty much controls itself), and while she DOES have a Clock, it is right only twice a day, and there is no Radio, but there IS a genuine Radio Delete that covers the hole where the Radio would be if she had one. BTW, a Radio Delete is a "rare" item!

A 63 Galaxie or Marauder fast back may show up in the driveway one day though. I think I'll look for the manual secondary Holley type carb for that one along with a T85-R11N for an overdrive or maybe a super T10 4-speed transmission.

Am not familiar with the R11N, but Ms. American has a T85 w/ Overdrive (is THAT an R11N?). Have to say that with the 4.11:1 Differential, she has an adequate amount of "scat", but drop into Third Overdrive, and it's like having a 3.33:1 Gear. At 70 MPH, the 3.14 isn't turning even 3,000 RPM! And the jolt that comes when the 3.14 kicks out of Overdrive to straight Third never ceases to amaze me.

Also, the 3.14 was rebuilt in 1989, and got a Holley 4150 with Vacuum Secondaries. It was all right, but when I accidentally found the ORIGINAL PI Carburetor (an Autolite 4100 C4AF 9510 DG), off came the Holley, and it is sitting here on the Shelf with a fritzed Secondary Float Bowl.

Am serious about the little SCREW on the 4100 Secondaries Lever. There is much to be known about it, and there are JPGs of how it is set up on Ms. American. Don't know if you know Ross over at FordMuscle, but he hinted at what has been done to Ms. American on THAT account. Pretty amazing stuff.

Also, have mentioned Rosemary's Miscarriage a couple of times hoping someone would ask about it, but no one had taken the bait. That too is a little bit interesting. Maybe Mr. Kultulz will nibble.

Anyway, hope you are having a GREAT weekend.

JC

[rotorwrench]

It may be but it could also be the earlier R11C. I think the later unit was using nodular cast iron technology to give it more strength for use in pickup trucks with overdrive and FE engines. I don't mind a 3 on the tree at all. The floor shift types can get in way sometimes. The earlier T85 is still a strong unit. Even the 9-inch rear axles started using nodular castings eventually. All for stronger structure I'm sure.

A friend of mine had a police FE 390 motor from an old 1961 police car with the solid lifter set up. He put it in his 63 4-door and ran the hell out of it. He eventually got hit from behind by a street sweeper and started tinkering with the 66 Fairlanes with small blocks but he always wanted to go back to the 390. Sadly he passed about 10-years ago so he never got to get another one.

If your 4100 keeps working then go with it. You've got a lot invested there for originality. They do real well when everything is functioning correctly. They actually don't do too bad on mileage either.

The jolt you feel it the coil getting shut off for a split second so as to allow the drop down from planetary to 1:1 drive. It really gives a kaboom at kick down when they go full tilt in 3rd gear.

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

You still had better tuck her in good at night is all I can say.

It is a beautiful body style for a 4DR, as it didn't have that period BOX TOP roof, was a true HDTP and of course the POLICE PACKAGE.

Hey Mr. K,
How do you get the image to appear as it does in your post. I'd like to be able to insert the image with text above and below it, and have the image appear full size instead of being a bunch of thumbnails at the bottom of the post.

Inquiring minds want to know.

JC

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

It may be but it could also be the earlier R11C. I think the later unit was using nodular cast iron technology to give it more strength for use in pickup trucks with overdrive and FE engines.

Hey Mr. RW,
Had never been aware of the Overdrive being called an R11, or what the differences were. Pretty interesting.

I don't mind a 3 on the tree at all. The floor shift types can get in way sometimes.

The Column Shift on the 64 Galaxie has always worked well, although a while back, it seemed to had gotten quirky. Turned out it needed a bit of Lubrication. Used some Greasless Spray-On stuff, and it straightened right up.

The earlier T85 is still a strong unit. Even the 9-inch rear axles started using nodular castings eventually. All for stronger structure I'm sure.

Have heard of "nodular", but am not sure exactly what it is.

A friend of mine had a police FE 390 motor from an old 1961 police car with the solid lifter set up.

Had, some time ago, read where the Solid Lifter Blocks didn't have the Oil Galleries drilled like the Hydraulic Lifter Blocks had in order to supply the Hydraulic Lifters with Oil, but when the 3.14 was rebuilt, we found that it DID have the Oil Galleries supplying the Lifters Bores with Oil drilled. We concluded that THAT would be all right, and that it would lubricate the Solid Lifters in their Bores.

He put it in his 63 4-door and ran the hell out of it. He eventually got hit from behind by a street sweeper and started tinkering with the 66 Fairlanes with small blocks but he always wanted to go back to the 390.

Some time ago, had a conversation with Greg Donahue, and he made the comment that some people LIKE the Solid Lifter setup, but some DON'T.

Sadly he passed about 10-years ago so he never got to get another one.

They are somewhat rare.

If your 4100 keeps working then go with it. You've got a lot invested there for originality. They do real well when everything is functioning correctly. They actually don't do too bad on mileage either.

The Carburetion part of the 4100 is GREAT, but the Automatic Choke Mechanism was a Rube Goldberg type device. Having Hot Air coming up from the Headers, and all that went with THAT was a constant problem. Tried to alleviate it with an Electric Choke Cap, but THAT created its OWN set of problems. Then went to a Manual Choke. THAT made all the difference in the world. AND it cleaned up the appearance of the 4100. The appearance of the 4100 when it got back from Champion Carburetors in Arlington, Texas was AMAZING, and it has worked just GREAT since then.

The jolt you feel it the coil getting shut off for a split second so as to allow the drop down from planetary to 1:1 drive.

RIGHT! The Under Dash Instrument Array shows the Voltmeter DROP to Zero, and Back Up to 14 Volts when the Overdrive Kick-Down is activated by pushing the Accelerator to the Floor. And the 4100 is WIDE-OPEN when the Ignition comes back on.

It really gives a kaboom at kick down when they go full tilt in 3rd gear.

Yes, it does. And it is even a bigger "kaboom" when kicking out of Overdrive in 2nd Gear! The Overdrive Solenoid allows the Overdrive to drop in at 32 MPH, so it is possible to get unto 1st Overdrive, but while that IS possible, it seldom is done.

On another note: Noticed your Avatar. Is that YOU in the picture? And isn't the aircraft behind the figure a B17? Also, see that you are in San Antonio, Texas. You're relatively close to where Ms. American and I live. We're in Onalaska, Texas, which is 33 miles East of Huntsville. It's where Texas Highway 190 crosses the Trinity River. They dammed the Trinity to create Lake Livingston. Lake Livingston is the reservoir that supplies Houston with Water. Lake Livingston will never go dry as long as Dallasites continue to flush their toilets!

So the present Caper here is putting NEW Door Handles on Ms. American's Running Mate, and Chase Truck, Lorrie Van Haul. Have to work early in the morning because it's the time of year that it's getting HOT at around 10:00 a.m. Supposed to get up to 94 here today. That's the hottest temp so far this year. Also, because of the Gulf Moisture, and the Respiration of the Sam Houston National Forest, it just get almost unbearable to be outdoors, which is not to mention the Mosquitoes.

Anyway, hope this finds YOU having a GREAT weekend. Take care.

JC

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by JCAllison

Hey Mr. K,

How do you get the image to appear as it does in your post. I'd like to be able to insert the image with text above and below it, and have the image appear full size instead of being a bunch of thumbnails at the bottom of the post.

Inquiring minds want to know.

JC

It's within UBB CODE - https://www.mikeholt.com/instructor_forum/ubbcode.html

The trick on this forum is to upload the photo - MANAGE ATTACHMENTS - so it is embedded here and then add the photo within [img][/img] within the POST MESSAGE as most any image without this forum address will drop at some point.

After seeing the thumbnail on PREVIEW POST, right click on it and you will see SOURCE. Copy and paste the URL within [img][/img] wherever you want the enhanced photo in your post.

Hope that made sense.

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

It's within UBB CODE - https://www.mikeholt.com/instructor_forum/ubbcode.html

The trick on this forum is to upload the photo - MANAGE ATTACHMENTS - so it is embedded here and then add the photo within [img][/img] within the POST MESSAGE as most any image without this forum address will drop at some point.

After seeing the thumbnail on PREVIEW POST, right click on it and you will see SOURCE. Copy and paste the URL within [img][/img] wherever you want the enhanced photo in your post.

Hope that made sense.

Hey Mr. K,
Am thinking I understand, but the proof of the pudding will be in the doing. We'll see.

Want to get used to doing it before doing the tutorial about the Mustangs Etc. Manual Choke System.

BTW, are you EVER going to ask about Rosemary's Miscarriage? Am itching to tell you about it. There's a good story just waiting to be told!

Take it easy.

JC

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by JCAllison

BTW, are you EVER going to ask about Rosemary's Miscarriage? Am itching to tell you about it. There's a good story just waiting to be told!

Take it easy.

JC

OK, I'll bite ...

I have to take it easy. At my age it is hard to come by ...

[KULTULZ]

Had Champion Carburetors in Arlington, Texas (they took over Pony Carbs when John Enyart passed) rebuild the Autolite 4100 C4AF-9510-DG, and it was just GORGEOUS.

THEN, could never get the 4100's Rube Goldberg Choke System to work. So installed a "Mustangs Etc." Manual Choke System, and it made all the difference in the world about how the 3.14 STARTS.

The Manual Choke closes the PRIMARY Choke Plate, and have the Primaries Throttle Plates adjusted COMPLETELY CLOSED. Installed a Fuel/Air Mixture Screw in the Threaded Hole that keeps the Secondary Throttle Plates from sticking in their bores, and have the 4100 Idling on the Secondaries.

This keeps the Distributor from seeing any vacuum from the Primaries at idle.

JC, when you have the time, did the choke kit manufacturer suggest setting the carb up this way?

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

JC, when you have the time, did the choke kit manufacturer suggest setting the carb up this way?

Hey Mr K,
No. In fact when they rebuilt the 4100, they (supposedly) tested it on a 390 FE, Test Engine, and (again supposedly) did a bunch of adjustments.

And the Screw that is in the threaded Nub on the Port Side of the Carburetor, that is adjusted to keep the Secondary Throttle Plates from sticking in the Secondary Venturis, was ground off flush with the Bottom of the Threaded Nub in which it is screwed.

Used a Craftsman RotoTool, and a small Cutting Wheel to put a small Screwdriver Slot in the Screw's under-end, and removed it so that an Air/Fuel Mixture Screw (with the Needle Point ground down flat) could be put up into the threaded Nub Hole.

That AFM Screw is able to be turned Righty Tighty to increase the opening of the Secondary Throttle Plates, or turned Lefty Loosey to decrease the opening of the Secondary Throttle Plates. And because they are opened to allow Air through them, the Throttle Plates NEVER go completely closed and so NEVER stick in the Venturi Bore.

Some years ago, it occurred to me that if there was a Screw in that threaded Nub Hole, that it would be possible to make the 3.14 idle on the Secondaries. So I have it a try, and sure enough it worked. Reported that on the FMF, and one of the guys there berated me for doing it saying it WOULDN'T work. I responded with it WOULD work, and in fact it was already being done.

It was some time later that Ross (remember Ross with the 429 Mustang?) was kind of mentoring me, and he just hinted at doing what I had already been doing with a temporary Bolt, which had to be turned with a Wrench.

But it wasn't until the 4100 was gotten back from Champion Carburetors that it was found that the AFM Screw was of the same size and thread as the Screw in the threaded Nub Hole. THAT made it possible to turn the Knurled AFM Screw with one's Fingers, while the Engine is running.

The MAIN thing about this is that since the 3.14 is starting and idling on the Secondaries, and the Primaries are COMPLETELY CLOSED, there is NO Vacuum Advance taking place in the Distributor. That makes the 3.14 start easier because it keeps the Initial Timing from advancing when cranking.

Also, since the Curb Idle Screw on the Primaries is Completely off the Adjusting Pad when the Accelerator is off, the Secondaries, which don't change maintains the Pre-Set Idle. One can come to a stop without any Vacuum, AND the Idle never changes.

Look at the LARGE JPG of the Manual Choke Setup. At the LEFT end of the Bolt that the Manual Choke Cam pushes, you can see (pretty clearly) the AFM Screw, and how it is up against the Secondary Throttle Plate Shaft Lever.

I don't think that whomever designed the 4100 intended for this to be done to it, but there it is!

Anyway, have already this morning cleaned and stripped one of Lorrie Van Haul's Door Latches. Am just taking a break before doing the other one.

Have a GREAT Sunday.

JC

[KULTULZ]

But it wasn't until the 4100 was gotten back from Champion Carburetors that it was found that the AFM Screw was of the same size and thread as the Screw in the threaded Nub Hole. THAT made it possible to turn the Knurled AFM Screw with one's Fingers, while the Engine is running.

The MAIN thing about this is that since the 3.14 is starting and idling on the Secondaries, and the Primaries are COMPLETELY CLOSED, there is NO Vacuum Advance taking place in the Distributor. That makes the 3.14 start easier because it keeps the Initial Timing from advancing when cranking.

Also, since the Curb Idle Screw on the Primaries is Completely off the Adjusting Pad when the Accelerator is off, the Secondaries, which don't change maintains the Pre-Set Idle. One can come to a stop without any Vacuum, AND the Idle never changes.

Look at the LARGE JPG of the Manual Choke Setup. At the LEFT end of the Bolt that the Manual Choke Cam pushes, you can see (pretty clearly) the AFM Screw, and how it is up against the Secondary Throttle Plate Shaft Lever. I don't think that whomever designed the 4100 intended for this to be done to it, but there it is!

I'll be ****** (well, actually I am).

I have never heard of this but it makes complete sense. You have done what FORD tried to do with years of emission calibrated carburetors and throttle solenoids.

THANX! for the education.


BTW - The original Design was HOLLEY.

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

I'll be ****** (well, actually I am). I have never heard of this but it makes complete sense. You have done what FORD tried to do with years of emission calibrated carburetors and throttle solenoids.
THANX! for the education.

Hey Mr. K,
Don't know if you ever knew or realized that back when we first met, I used to pour over YOUR posts, catching every nuance. Was amazed at how much information you had stored in your memory banks.

Don't know if YOU remember the discussion we had about Ms. American's Aluminum Intake Manifold. I was quite upset after finding out from John Smith's Book about the P-Code Engine having an Aluminum Intake Manifold. I was sure that someone whom my Father had work on the old Gal had STOLEN it, and put on an Iron one in its place.

And you soothed that upset by saying that the P-Code DIDN'T have an Aluminum Intake Manifold, and the rationale behind THAT assertion was: If the P-Codes DID have an Aluminum Manifold, then how come with all the PIs that were built, WHERE ARE ALL THOSE ALUMINUM MANIFOLDS?

Made me feel better all over!

NOW... Since no one will nibble at the Rosemary's Miscarriage bait, am just going to go ahead and relate a favorite story.

There is a very nice lady, that I call Ms. DXL who posts under the User Name of DesertXL. She has a SUPER Shop in Albuquerque, New Mexico. She does the ABSOLUTE prettiest work I've ever seen. Makes Chip Whazzisizface look like an amateur. And she one time posted a JPG of a Dual Exhaust System that she had built, that looked like it was ALIVE!

About that same time, I was working on another improvement to Ms. American, that would solve a common problem that is had with not only the Autolite 4100, but also the Bendix Stromberg Model W Carburetor on Lorrie Van Haul. Would imagine that there are other here who have had this same problem. And the problem is: That after a car sits for a while, the Gasoline in the Float Bowls evaporates. Then when one tries to start the Engine, one has to crank till the Fuel Pump gets enough Gas to the Carburetor for it to start.

So I had put together a device that would eliminate having to crank. It involves the use of a Carter Electric Fuel Pump, a One-Way Check Valve, a Fuel Filter to protect the Carter, and it has a TWO WAY Toggle Switch that when it is clicked one way it turns the Carter ON and it stays ON. Click it the other way, and it turns the Carter ON, but turns OFF if you don't hold it ON.

And since the Carter will pump through the 3.14's Stock Fuel Pump, it can be used to prime the 4100, it can also be used when running fast to make sure that the 4100 stays full of Gas. Here is what it looks like:



Now, the reason it is called "Rosemary's Miscarriage", is because after seeing Ms. DXL's LIVING Exhaust System, which looked like the Frankenstein Monster, compared with this measly little Primer Pump which it made look like Rosemary's Baby, except it wasn't born, it was miscarried.

Anyway, Rosemary's Miscarriage keeps from having to crank Ms. American's Starter, by first Priming the 4100 before starting.

It has undergone some modifications since the JPG was taken, and it has gotten a cover put over it to keep it from getting wet, but it works WONDROUSLY, and should last a long time.

Anyway, am cleaning the Fasteners on Lorrie Van Haul's Latches in preparation for installing her NEW Door Handles.

Take care.

JC

[KULTULZ]

About that same time, I was working on another improvement to Ms. American, that would solve a common problem that is had with not only the Autolite 4100, but also the Bendix Stromberg Model W Carburetor on Lorrie Van Haul. Would imagine that there are other here who have had this same problem. And the problem is: That after a car sits for a while, the Gasoline in the Float Bowls evaporates. Then when one tries to start the Engine, one has to crank till the Fuel Pump gets enough Gas to the Carburetor for it to start.

So I had put together a device that would eliminate having to crank. It involves the use of a Carter Electric Fuel Pump, a One-Way Check Valve, a Fuel Filter to protect the Carter, and it has a TWO WAY Toggle Switch that when it is clicked one way it turns the Carter ON and it stays ON. Click it the other way, and it turns the Carter ON, but turns OFF if you don't hold it ON.

And since the Carter will pump through the 3.14's Stock Fuel Pump, it can be used to prime the 4100, it can also be used when running fast to make sure that the 4100 stays full of Gas. Here is what it looks like:

Great Design!

You have this back @ the fuel tank with gravity drop?

There have been some discussions here and you show the correct way to plumb it (IMO).

Maybe that lady was the one that paid for your canopy ...

[rotorwrench]

A lot of those electric pumps allow fuel to pass through when they are shut down. It just depends on what design of pump is used. That set up will work very well although somewhat complex.

On your carb set up I'll add this info but if it's working it doesn't mean you should change anything. The secondaries don't really start to draw much of any fuel until the plates are opened far enough for the venturis to start their magic. The only idle circuitry is on the primary side and it only works when the throttle plates are open enough to allow a draw due to the low pressure there. With the secondaries open, it's allowing ambient air pressure to go through there causing a lean condition. You have some sort of balance going on there but it's not the way it was designed to work. The secondary fuel circuit is all up in the secondary feed horn area in the venturi where the idle circuit is down near the primary plates when they are in the slightly open condition. The vacuum advance just has to be relaxed in a retarded position to get a start. That's why timing is set at idle with the vacuum can disconnected & line plugged. This gives you the start condition. It takes a while with throttle plates near closed to get enough low pressure draw to get the advance diaphragm completely pulled tight. You also need the vacuum to draw the warm air for the automatic choke stove. Your problem with the choke stove may have been due to the high performance cast iron headers if that's what you have. I'm not sure how the warm air line connects up to that set up since I have no experience with them. Manual choke is damn sure more reliable in any case so I don't see a thing wrong with that.

My avatar is a photo of my Pop at the Celone Airfield near Foggia, Italy in late 1944. He was a copilot in the crew of that plane at the time. My military time was US Army helicopter engine repairman but that was a long time after that photo was taken. I have a helicopter customer up on the south end of lake Conroe so that's getting closer to your neck of the woods. It's hotter than hades here too.

[KULTULZ]

If the carb/engine responds to idle air mixture screw adjustments as he has it set up, he should be fine.

As for the ported vacuum signal, it may come in @ idle to some degree, and that is why they have you disconnect it and set to OEM curb idle when setting basic timing.

[KULTULZ]

JC Said-

Don't know if YOU remember the discussion we had about Ms. American's Aluminum Intake Manifold. I was quite upset after finding out from John Smith's Book about the P-Code Engine having an Aluminum Intake Manifold. I was sure that someone whom my Father had work on the old Gal had STOLEN it, and put on an Iron one in its place.

And you soothed that upset by saying that the P-Code DIDN'T have an Aluminum Intake Manifold, and the rationale behind THAT assertion was: If the P-Codes DID have an Aluminum Manifold, then how come with all the PIs that were built, WHERE ARE ALL THOSE ALUMINUM MANIFOLDS?

Made me feel better all over!

I think the confusion at that time was their seeing those HP exhaust manifolds and immediately thinking it was a period 390/406/427HP. Those did come with ALUM INTAKES.

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

Great Design!

Hey Mr. K,
As mentioned previously, there have been some modifications made AFTER this JPG was taken. It turned out that the Gasoline coming out of the Tank, around the Hose bends, through the Check Valve (that is there to keep the Carter from just pumping the Gas back to where the Gas comes out of the Tank), then forward to the Stock Fuel Pump. BUT when the Hoses got warm, they would kink. and the only way to keep the 3.14 running was to turn on the Carter. Modified the setup to where the BENDS were Solid Tubing seen here:



Here is a view of Rosemary's Miscarriage installed from the OTHER end:

You have this back @ the fuel tank with gravity drop?

Yes, but it's just connected to the Tank Outlet, as you can see in the above JPGs, so I don't know about it being a Gravity Drop!

There have been some discussions here and you show the correct way to plumb it (IMO).

It's VERY direct. The Carter won't let Gas flow through it unless it is running. The Stock Fuel Pump WILL let Gas flow through, which is why the Carter can prime the 4100 without the 3.14 running. Also there is a Fuel Pressure Regulator set at 5.5 PSI that is mounted between the Stock Fuel Pump and the 4100 so that when BOTH Fuel Pumps are running, they won't overpower the Needles and Seats in the 4100. Here is a JPGs of THAT:


AND

Maybe that lady was the one that paid for your canopy ...

BINGO! That was MY suspicion too. Asked her about it, and she denied it. So either she didn't, or of course she WOULD deny it. Anyway, Ms. American and I both appreciated it, and thanked whomever did the springing for the Car Port profusely.

Anyway, it appears that your tutorial of how to put full size images in the post was succinct enough for even ME to understand. Thanks for the education. It's now onward through the fog.

JC

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

A lot of those electric pumps allow fuel to pass through when they are shut down. It just depends on what design of pump is used. That set up will work very well although somewhat complex.

Hey Mr. RW,
Don't know what could be eliminated to make it simpler without it not being able to function.

On your carb set up I'll add this info but if it's working it doesn't mean you should change anything. The secondaries don't really start to draw much of any fuel until the plates are opened far enough for the venturis to start their magic. The only idle circuitry is on the primary side and it only works when the throttle plates are open enough to allow a draw due to the low pressure there. With the secondaries open, it's allowing ambient air pressure to go through there causing a lean condition.

Have to say that the condition of the Idle is VERY responsive to the FAM Screw with which the Secondaries are opened/closed. The Idle is VERY consistent.

You have some sort of balance going on there but it's not the way it was designed to work.

YES. BUT it does work.

The secondary fuel circuit is all up in the secondary feed horn area in the venturi where the idle circuit is down near the primary plates when they are in the slightly open condition. The vacuum advance just has to be relaxed in a retarded position to get a start. That's why timing is set at idle with the vacuum can disconnected & line plugged.

The 3.14 has initial timing of 12 degrees BTDC. At 80 years old, my vision isn't what it used to be. So I did some custom work on the Damper to make it easier to see. This is what was done:

AND

The left side of the Blue Mark is 16 Degrees BTDC. Was going to use that as the Primary Timing, but it made starting HOT difficult, so dialed it back TWO Color Marks to 12 Degrees BTDC, and it is good to go.

This gives you the start condition. It takes a while with throttle plates near closed to get enough low pressure draw to get the advance diaphragm completely pulled tight.

Yes.

You also need the vacuum to draw the warm air for the automatic choke stove. Your problem with the choke stove may have been due to the high performance cast iron headers if that's what you have.

Well, there is an interesting anecdote about THAT... Though I was never told about it, apparently my Mother was in a Right Front End Fender Bender at some time before Ms. American came to live with me. In working on the old Gal's Brakes, I found the Left Front, and BOTH Rear Brake Back Plates were BLACK. The Right Front Brake was MAROON. Then when working on the Heater, I found that the Pleated Rubber Connector between the Air Inlet of the Heater, and where the Air comes in wasn't right. It had had a piece of Sheet Metal made into an oval Tube, and was sealed up with DumDum. Quite BOTCHED, to say the least. Then when rebuilding the Front Suspension, found that the Right Front PI Parts were marked as C3A, instead of C4A like the Left Front Parts. Also, it is apparent that the Right front Fender has been repaired, and the Outside Headlight Bezel doesn't fit as well as the Left Front Bezel. With all that said, there is one OTHER thing to note. The PLACE in the Passenger Side Cast Iron Shorty Header where the Choke Stove should fit, has a DELETE welded into it, but the Driver's Side is OPEN! This is an indication that the Right Front Fender Bender took out the Passenger Side Cast Iron Shorty Header, and so they got replaced with a pair of Headers for a Three Two Barrel Set! And when the old Gal came to live with me, it had an ELECTRIC CHOKE CAP, and not the Hot Air Choke setup. So the Hot Air Choke setup had nothing to do with the 4100's Choke difficulties.

I'm not sure how the warm air line connects up to that set up since I have no experience with them.

I had intended to attempt to put the Hot Air Choke setup back on the 4100. Bought the Choke Stove that goes into the Exhaust Header from Greg Donahue. It was a little more than $50.00. But then I found the DELETE welded into the Passenger Side Header and that scotched the deal. Nonetheless, the Stock Choke System on the 4100 was a Rube Goldberg Device. Talk about complex. One would have had to be a magician to make it work properly. Deep sixing it was the best thing to happen to the 4100.

Manual choke is damn sure more reliable in any case so I don't see a thing wrong with that.

It was a MIRACULOUS transformation.

My avatar is a photo of my Pop at the Celone Airfield near Foggia, Italy in late 1944. He was a copilot in the crew of that plane at the time.

It appears to be a B17.

My military time was US Army helicopter engine repairman but that was a long time after that photo was taken. I have a helicopter customer up on the south end of lake Conroe so that's getting closer to your neck of the woods.

Speaking of Helicopters, my Mother's kid brother (Christian Fink), was a dive bomber pilot on the USS Enterprise during WWII, and then later was a Chopper Pilot on the Admiral Byrd Antarctic Expedition. He was the 23rd Helicopter Pilot licensed by US Navy. See Here:
https://cdnc.ucr.edu/?a=d&d=CJ199910...-txIN--------1

It's hotter than hades here too.

Know what you mean. But YOU guys don't have the humidity that we have here in the Sam Houston National Forest. I go through five T-Shirts a day. They just get wringing wet from sweat, and it's so humid that it doesn't evaporate. The condition is called "clammy". Uncomfortable.

Anyway, thanks for the informative response. Hope you're having a GREAT Sunday. Take care.

JC

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

If the carb/engine responds to idle air mixture screw adjustments as he has it set up, he should be fine.

Hey Mr. K,
Have to say that Ms. American's 3.14 Starts and Runs the BEST now than it ever has in the 33 years that she lived with me. She had always been hard to start, and though she ran alright, she was NEVER as happy as she is now.

As for the ported vacuum signal, it may come in @ idle to some degree, and that is why they have you disconnect it and set to OEM curb idle when setting basic timing.

When the 3.14 was last timed to 12 degrees BTDC, the connection to the Vacuum Canister on the Distributor was clamped off with a pair of Hemostats. BUT... and I never have understood this, when starting the 3.14, doesn't the Centrifugal Advance Mechanism in the Distributor do something?

JC

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

I think the confusion at that time was their seeing those HP exhaust manifolds and immediately thinking it was a period 390/406/427HP. Those did come with ALUM INTAKES.

Hey Mr. K,
It was FE and going Broke (Gary Kitchens), and Mr. Deadhorse (remember them?) who kind of hoo-hawed Ms. American when I first posted to FordMuscle on Christmas Eve of 2007. Neither of them had ever heard of a "Four-Door Hard-Top Convertible" (that's what they were called back in the day). I remember Mr. Deadhorse saying he'd sure like to SEE one of them! You were the one who finally straightened them out of what a "Hard Top Convertible" was. BTW, had an E-Mail from Gary Kitchens last Thursday (June 6,) wishing Ms. American and me a happy 33rd Anniversary. He remembers that because that was also the day that he was in his catastrophic car crash. He seems to be doing fine.

BTW, how do you get rid of the unnecessary Thumbnails after the full size JPGs are in the post?

Anyway, am hungry. Going to have something to eat. Hope YOU are well.

JC

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by JCAllison

Hey Mr. K,

When the 3.14 was last timed to 12 degrees BTDC, the connection to the Vacuum Canister on the Distributor was clamped off with a pair of Hemostats. BUT... and I never have understood this, when starting the 3.14, doesn't the Centrifugal Advance Mechanism in the Distributor do something?

JC

Not really. Centrifugal advance (if it's working correctly and hasn't been re-curved) will be minimal @ START. That is why timing is set @ curb idle with no vacuum signal. Look in your SHOP MANUAL at SPECIFICATIONS and you should come across DIST TIMING CURVE.

[scicala]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

"The left side of the Blue Mark is 16 Degrees BTDC. Was going to use that as the Primary Timing, but it made starting HOT difficult, so dialed it back TWO Color Marks to 12 Degrees BTDC, and it is good to go."




If I'm looking at the picture of the balancer correctly, to the left of the blue mark would be ATDC and not BTDC. Assuming the engine rotation is clockwise.


Sal

[40cpe]

If the blue mark is 16 degrees, I'm deducting that each color segment is 2 degrees, so the left side (or bottom) of the first red mark is TDC. Each red mark after that is a 10 degree increase for a total of 50 degrees marked out on the balancer. Is that right Mr Allison?

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

Not really. Centrifugal advance (if it's working correctly and hasn't been re-curved) will be minimal @ START.

Hey Mr. K,
When the PerTronix Ignitor III was installed, NEW Centrifugal Springs were put into the Distributor. One was heavier than the other, but I don't recall what their numbers were. It was done at the mentorship of Ross over at FordMuscle. There was also some work done on the Centrifugal Weights themselves in that the Slots had worn a small bit, and that got smoothed out. Am thinking that there are JPGs of them somewhere, but will have to find them because I've slept a number of times since messing with it all, and can't remember where they are stored! I told my doctor that I can't remember things from minute to minute anymore. She ask: How long has this been going on?" I said: "How long has WHAT been going on?"

That is why timing is set @ curb idle with no vacuum signal. Look in your SHOP MANUAL at SPECIFICATIONS and you should come across DIST TIMING CURVE.

All right. Strange thing though, the 1964 Ford and Mercury Shop Manual specifies that the P-Code Engine has an Initial Timing of 5 degrees BTDC! Is THAT nutty, or WHAT? But THAT isn't the as bad as the 1967 Dodge 225 Slant Six Specification that says that the Initial Timing should be set AT TDC! No advance AT ALL!

As mentioned previously, the 3.14 is initially at 12 degrees BTDC, and Lorrie's Mighty 225 Slant Six is set at 6 degree BTDC initially. Although, I don't know what the "All In" reading on the 3.14 is presently, there WAS a time when with the 3.14 revved WAY UP, the Timing light showed that the Pointer was WAY PAST the 50 degrees BTDC mark!

BTW, this whole subject is somewhat blurred in my comprehension. Factors are numerous, and instrumentation to account for them all goes far beyond just my simple Timing Light, and Vacuum Gauge. But then again, am NOT trying to tune the 3.14 for any kind of MAXIMUM.

JC

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by scicala

If I'm looking at the picture of the balancer correctly, to the left of the blue mark would be ATDC and not BTDC. Assuming the engine rotation is clockwise. Sal

Hey Mr. S,
No... The left side of the FIRST RED MARK on the Left is TDC. All the colors are BTDC, with the left side of the BLUE MARK being 16 degrees BTDC. And YES, looking at the Front of the 3.14, it DOES turn Clockwise.

JC

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by 40cpe

If the blue mark is 16 degrees, I'm deducting that each color segment is 2 degrees,

Hey Mr. 40C,
BINGO!

so the left side (or bottom) of the first red mark is TDC.

YES.

Each red mark after that is a 10 degree increase for a total of 50 degrees marked out on the balancer.

YES.

Is that right Mr Allison?

Perfect score! You get an A+!

And have to say that putting those colors on the Damper (which, BTW, is the ORIGINAL Damper rebuilt by The Damper Doctor) has made timing the 3.14 easy peasy for these OLD eyes. Had, before putting the colors on the Damper, just put White Paint in the Degree Marks, but couldn't see them worth a damn.

Anyway, am hopefully going to get Lorrie Van Haul's NEW Door Handles installed this morning before it gets too hot. And if I have to get out and about, it will hopefully be in Ms. American.

Take care.

JC

[KULTULZ]

JC wrote -

All right. Strange thing though, the 1964 Ford and Mercury Shop Manual specifies that the P-Code Engine has an Initial Timing of 5 degrees BTDC!

Is THAT nutty, or WHAT? But THAT isn't the as bad as the 1967 Dodge 225 Slant Six Specification that says that the Initial Timing should be set AT TDC! No advance AT ALL!

There is advance, it is within how the centrifugal advance curve is calibrated.

Bumping the timing (twisting the DIST) increases performance and/or may damage the engine.

This should help - https://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2000/03/timing/

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by JCAllison

Hey Mr. RW,

Had, some time ago, read where the Solid Lifter Blocks didn't have the Oil Galleries drilled like the Hydraulic Lifter Blocks had in order to supply the Hydraulic Lifters with Oil, but when the 3.14 was rebuilt, we found that it DID have the Oil Galleries supplying the Lifters Bores with Oil drilled. We concluded that THAT would be all right, and that it would lubricate the Solid Lifters in their Bores.

Some time ago, had a conversation with Greg Donahue, and he made the comment that some people LIKE the Solid Lifter setup, but some DON'T.

They are somewhat rare.

JC

Here is a forgotten factoid regarding the 61/64 390PI -

The 1961–1965 390 Police Interceptor and High-Performance blocks (C1AE-V, C2AE-BC, C2AE-BE, C2AE-BR, C2AE-BS, C3AE-KY, C3ME-B, C4AE-F, and C5AE-B) have heavier main-bearing caps and drilled oil passages for hydraulic lifters.

The trick here is: Ford never drilled the oil passages from the main galleries to the twin lifter oil galleries, which means no oil pressure to these galleries. Hydraulic lifters cannot be used in this block.

Just so you know ...

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

There is advance, it is within how the centrifugal advance curve is calibrated.

Hey Mr. K,
I understand THAT, but I don't understand THAT!

Bumping the timing (twisting the DIST) increases performance and/or may damage the engine.

Alas, this is what I've been doing, but not only with a Timing Light, but with a Vacuum Gauge connected to the Intake Manifold, and an Actron Tachometer.

This should help - https://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2000/03/timing/

Seems to me that I had seen that article before. Got to reading it again, but was distracted about half way through. Will get back to it when it's too hot&humid here to do anything else.

Anyway, you doing all right? I'm getting ready to start ordering the parts and tools to do the Lorrie Van Haul Steering Conversion. And this morning am fabricating some REALLY spiffy parts to go on Lorrie's Door Latches. Weather is quite cool here this morning. THAT won't last long, so it's best I get to cracking on the Spiffy Parts before it gets too warm to be out.

Take care.

JC

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

Here is a forgotten factoid regarding the 61/64 390PI - Just so you know ...

Hey Mr. K,
Interesting info.

The Solid Lifters in Ms. American are "necked down between the Ends to let the Oil flow through the Lifter Bores as it traverses the Oil Galleries.

When I went to get the NEW Lifters, when rebuilding the 3.14 in 1989. The Counter Man at the Auto Parts Store had them, but they were quite expensive.

There was an old guy behind me who overheard this, and he tapped me on the shoulder, and told me that those lifters were also used in a Nash Rambler 6-Cylinder, and were a lot less expensive.

Asked the Counter Man about THAT. He also had the Rambler Lifters.

Turned out that ONE box of Nash Rambler Lifters would contain only 12 of them. It would take TWO boxes of the Nash Rambler Lifters, because the 3.14 needed 16 Lifters. BUT... TWO boxes of Nash Rambler Lifters was half the cost of ONE box of 16 Ford Lifters! Got the TWO boxes of Rambler Lifters, for half the price, and had 8 lifters left over!

Sometimes life is STRANGE!

About the image of the 1964 Galaxie XL Four-Door Hardtop... Look at it compared to large JPG you have of Ms. American. Notice the stance. The XL sits a little UP in the FRONT, whereas Ms. American, sits a little UP in the REAR. Happen to like the bit of a RAKE that the old Gal has better than the DRAG of the XL. That RAKE was the result of having the Rear Springs "re-arched" at Heitman's in Houston.

The guy that did the re-arching was a TRUE CRAFTSMAN with a BIG SLEDGE HAMMER. Knew EXACTLY where to hit the Spring to make it conform to the Template against which he checked the Springs. Was amazing to watch him work.

Anyway, am off to fabricate some SPIFFY parts for Lorrie's Door Handles.

Hope you are well.

JC

[Nite-owl]

Hi there,

I, too, have finally made it!

Second time JC has "forced"me to move. The things one does.

Mel

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by Nite-owl

Hi there, I, too, have finally made it!

Hey Mel,
NICE TO SEE YOU!!! Welcome to FordBarn.

Second time JC has "forced"me to move. The things one does. Mel

Know what you mean. Ms. American did the same to ME!

Hey All, This is Mel, from the Netherlands. He has a GORGEOUS 63 Galaxie named "Thirsty Lady". He, as I understand it, took it completely apart, and put it back together after cleaning and fixing EVERYTHING. Though he posts under the User Name of Nite-owl, he one time told me that he watches Ms. American and me like a HAWK!

Anyway Mel, am able to mention Lorrie Van Haul here, but don't post about her. That is done over at:

https://ramchargercentral.com/vans-caravans/

Just in case you'd like to hear the latest about Lorrie.

Anyway, glad to see you. Take care.

JC

[Coosawjack]

Hey there Mel......GLAD to see you made it over here!!

[Nite-owl]

Hi there,

Hey there Mel GLAD to see you made it over here!

It took some time to get here. Waiting and waiting for conformation. Never got it, but, allofasudden was granted entry without any notice! Have the same problem with the Dodge site. Not in yet.

Mel

[Nite-owl]

Hi there,

Though he posts under the User Name of Nite-owl, he one time told me that he watches Ms. American and me like a HAWK!

Owls are just as vigelent as Hawks are. I call myself Nite-owl because, to keep up with USA, I burn the midnight oil.

Mel

[JCAllison]

Hey All,
Saturday, June 13, 2019, Early Evening Update:

Just got in from having started Ms. American. She usually gets started every Sunday, but she hadn't been started since Sunday before last.

Opened her Hood and connected her Quick Disconnect Battery Switch.

Got in, noting that the Courtesy Lights worked, and turned on Rosemary's Miscarriage.

Counted 60 heartbeats. Gave the Accelerator four pumps, holding the last one while pulling out the Mustangs Etc. Manual Choke Knob.

Keyed the Starter, and the 3.14 came to life instantaneously. Had to hold the Accelerator till the Temperature Gauge moved up to the 100 degree mark, then slowly pushed in on the Manual Choke Knob. The 3.14 settled into a turbine smooth 650 RPM Idle.

Let it Idle till the Temperature Gauge read 160, which is the old Gal's Operating Temperature.

Watched the 3.14 run a while, checking for anything untoward. There was nothing.

Revved the 3.14 up a number of times, holding at about 3,000 RPM till the Top Radiator Hose got too hot to hold.

Got into the Driver's Seat, and revved the 3.14 three more times, and turned off the Ignition. The 3.14 just stop running. No run on. Told the old Gal that the next time we have to go out, it will be in her.

Got out, turned off the Quick Disconnect Switch. Closed the Hood, told the old Gal that I love her, and came in.

Anyway, all is well with Ms. American.

Will keep you all updated if, when, and as progress occurs. Take care everyone.

JC

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by Nite-owl

Hi there, Owls are just as vigelent as Hawks are. I call myself Nite-owl because, to keep up with USA, I burn the midnight oil. Mel

Hey Mel,
Just a short note, as it's time for meds and to bed. It has been a GREAT day. Finished Lorrie's Handle Caper. And now it's onward through the fog.

Hope YOU and Thirsty Lady are doing well.

JC

[JCAllison]

Hey All,
Saturday, June 22, 2019, Morning Update:

Gentlemen... Position is EVERYTHING!

Went out to the Car Port with a SHORT 1/2" Box End Wrench, and a can of RAID Flying Insect Killer. Sprayed around and under Ms. American whose Front End is UP on the Ramps. Opened the Hood to let the light into the Engine Bay.

Got down onto the ground as usual, and worked my way head-first UNDER the old Gal's Front End. Reached past the BACK of the Cast Iron Shorty Headers, and felt the FRONT of the Starter. Continued to feel the Starter till the Stud to which the Cable from the Solenoid is fastened was located. THAT Stud is leaning about 45 degrees to Starboard. Tried to access it with the SHORT 1/2" Box End Wrench, but there was NO WAY to do it. DRATS!

Laid there for a bit reconnoitering the situation, and trying to figure out WHY, when I could FEEL the Nut, that I couldn't get the Wrench into position to fit ON TO the Nut. In doing this analysis, I came to realize that it wasn't the Nut's fault. And it wasn't the Wrench's fault. And it wasn't the fault of my Fingers. The fault laid at MY WRIST!! While my Hand, and Fingers bent the right way, MY WRIST DIDN'T!! If only my WRIST would bend the OTHER WAY, reaching the Nut with the Wrench could be accomplished.

Alas, WE are just not built THAT way... BUT, then the thought occurred to me that if I would get under the old Gal's Front End FEET FIRST, that my Right Hand could feel the old Gal's Starter, and MY WRIST would BEND THE OTHER WAY!!

Well, instead of getting out from under Ms. American, it was with some amount of effort that I swung my head to the Starboard, and drew my Legs past the Left Front Ramp, then stretched out with my Feet pointing back towards the Differential. Reached up with the Wrench in my Right Hand, and as SLICK as could be, the Wrench went right onto the NUT.

Was able to easily TIGHTEN it about a quarter turn!

Then re-positioned the Wrench, and got about another 1/16th of an inch of rotation before the Nut wouldn't go any further.

Had intended to take the Key Ring with the Ignition Key on it, but one cannot think of EVERYTHING.

So NOW the next thing to do was to get myself out from under Ms. American's Front End. Grasped the Sway Bar with both Hands and pulled my Body forward. The next place to grab was the Top of the Front Bumper.

Then by scooting forward far enough was able to get my Legs past the Left Front Ramp. Was then lying on my back in front of Ms. American. It was but a matter of rolling over, and getting into a kneeling posture. Then reaching up to the front of Engine Bay, was able to pull myself into a squat position. Then using both hands on the Top Front Cross Member was able to stand up.

That may not sound like much, but at this point in my life, it's a semi-major maneuver.

Am betting that the tightening of that NUT is going to make all the difference in the world as far as having Ms. American Start-Up without all the former hesitation.

Anyway, will be cleaning up the Cat's Mess in the Kitchen, and then will take the Keys out and see if what was done has improved the situation. Will keep you all updated if, when, and as progress occurs.

Take care everyone, and remember: POSITION IS EVERYTHING!!!

JC

[40cpe]

I am of the opinion that all the ups and downs, stretching, straining, and contortions involved in keeping our old cars helps keep us flexible. Where would we be without them?

[Coosawjack]

BRAVO JC!!

I felt every move, scoot and contortion you went through............GOOD WORK and glad you returned to upright with relatively little effort!!

Have a good day my friend!!

[JCAllison]

Originally Posted by 40cpe

I am of the opinion that all the ups and downs, stretching, straining, and contortions involved in keeping our old cars helps keep us flexible.

Hey Mr. 40C,
Couldn't fail to disagree with you less! And you know what else? It makes resting so much easier.

Was in a catastrophic Murdercycle crash on April 27, 1987, which broke the Femoral Head off of the Left Femur, and crushed my Right Foot. I now have a Left Leg that is 2" shorter than my Right Leg, walk with a terrible limp, even with the Cane. But, when I go to the Grocery Store, I refuse to use the little Scooters to shop, because as soon as I start doing stuff like that, I won't be able to walk at all.

A while back, the Primary Care Physician at the local Clinic arranged to have a Physical Therapist visit me twice a week. That lasted a week and a half. What the PT was having me do was like sit in a chair, and raise my hands over my head, rock my feet back and forth, like heel&toe. He was treating me as if I was too old to do anything, but when he found out that I work on the Cars, and do the housework, and do exercises like push ups, and planks, he told the PCP that what he was having me do was useless. That maybe in another ten years, it might help, but even with the Murdercycle injuries, I was in about the same shape as a healthy 60 year old.

Still, there IS the need to be careful. As Coosawjack has told me many times: "Gravity is NOT your friend!" Got to be careful to not fall, trip, or stumble. So in addition to working "smarter", one has to work "more carefully". It takes slowing down, not rushing anything, thinking things out, and as Dirty Harry said: "A man has got to know his limitations."

Where would we be without them?

We'd just be feckless old farts! There's nothing worse than being feckless!

So at this time, everything is caught up. Am going to go out and see if what was done this morning has helped at all. If it has, then GREAT! If it hasn't, there is sitting here on the Shelf a BRAND NEW Starter, but I'm of the opinion that installing it is just a bridge too far.

May have to take it to Wesley Smith at Smith Auto Electric and have HIM install it along with the NEW Solenoid to Starter Cable. Don't know how much it would cost, but Wesley has always been very fair with me, and he particularly LIKES Ms. American. There aren't many mechanics around here that I'd trust Ms. American to, but Wesley isn't one of them.

Anyway, it shouldn't be long before we know if Ms. American is going to respond to my intimacies with her this morning. We'll see. Will let you know how it goes.

KOKO (Keep On Keeping ON)

JC

[JCAllison]

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Originally Posted by Coosawjack

BRAVO JC!! I felt every move, scoot and contortion you went through............GOOD WORK and glad you returned to upright with relatively little effort!!

Hey Jack,
Me too!

Have a good day my friend!!

Well, just got in from going out to start Ms. American. Have to say it has already been a GREAT day.

Keyed the Starter... ABSOLUTELY NO HESITATION! The 3.14 cranked STRONG, and STARTED RIGHT UP!

Put her in reverse, and gave her a little Clutch, and she backed down off the Ramps. Had to hit the Brakes! And while doing that the Engine stopped.

Re-Keyed the Starter, and again ABSOLUTELY NO HESITATION! The 3.14 cranked STRONG, and STARTED RIGHT UP!

The old Gal is BACK! Those two starts were the ABSOLUTE BEST that she has EVER done since coming to live with me on June 6, 1986! Am so proud of her! This has been a long time coming.

Am going to have something to eat, take a bit of a break, and then get on with the day.

It'll be out to see how the NEW SawZall is going to do. Checked the place that needs to be cut. This SHOULD be a walk in the park, and a piece of cake!

Also, WONDER OF WONDERS, it is overcast, relatively cool, and though it IS a bit humid, there are some zephyrs wafting about which makes it PERFECT weather for doing what needs be done.

Will let you know how it goes.

KOKO

JC

[Coosawjack]

GREAT news JC........KOKO yourself!!