Long Trip Preparations

[RockHillWill]

Is there a published list of items that you would consider taking along if you were intending to make a trip in excess of 3,000 to 4,000 miles.

What kind of modifications would you make to your Model A?

[hardtimes]

Originally Posted by RockHillWill

Is there a published list of items that you would consider taking along if you were intending to make a trip in excess of 3,000 to 4,000 miles.

What kind of modifications would you make to your Model A?

Hey Will,
'MODIFICATIONS' ...not going there...HERE,eh!!
However, very good question for good trip. Along the lines of 'list', wish you could be here to look at box of stuff that I got from an old timer years ago that directly relates to your inquiry. This box (or two?) contains all the stuff that a guy...going long distance in a Model A would need..short of heavy chassis/sheet metal. All new stuff, back when he made the collection. I've never used it, and likely never will... but remember that it was condensed down to meet the needs of this guy who drove thousands of miles each trip he made. I'll start off your list by say that a spare WATER PUMP and COMPLETE ENGINE GASKET SET is included. I guess that I could lay it all out an take pics if you need..just let me know
BTW...ooops, to answer your question , I know that in the past here informal 'lists' were made due similar question..but know of no formal list.sorry! MAFCA mabe has one?

[H. L. Chauvin]

In addition to basic tools such as wrenches, screwdrivers, etc., & a few suggested parts, just one (1) additional bare minimum, easy to carry lightweight item:

Your favorite Model A parts vendor's catalog, with your credit card number already posted in his file for unexpected emergencies -- vintage parts needed & not found at Autozone & the like could be obtained with a simple phone call & overnight delivery at your hotel or the address where you are staying.

[Mike V. Florida]

Originally Posted by RockHillWill

Is there a published list of items that you would consider taking along if you were intending to make a trip in excess of 3,000 to 4,000 miles.


What kind of modifications would you make to your Model A?

What to take (link) along with AAA and the national club rosters.
There are none necessary.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Well, maybe to answer your question with sincereity, and using your panel truck as an example, I would remove the original fan belt (due to rarity & expense) and take off on your trip. I am of the opinion there is no need for any spare water pumps, extra gasket sets, carburetors, or "crutches". All these items do is weigh down the vehicle! It boils down to you completely 'restored' every part your panel truck to original specifications. Therefore your truck is no different than it was when it was brand new. Back then when a car was new, no one carried spare parts like that, ...so there is not a need now unless someone feels there is a faulty part about to fail. Even so, like mentioned above having a few phone numbers of friends in your pocket will take care of everything else like finding someone to bring you items to make repairs.

[Fred]

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BOTH National Clubs Roster..

[Mitch//pa]

between AAA. 300 miles free and ford barn help cant be to far away

[Aok]

Portable computer or phone with web access any way you can connect to the Ford Bard Forum

[MikeK]

Things that are not an easy find when on the road-
Spare 6V bulbs.
Patch kit and a spare new tube.

Following up on what BRENT said, you may also want to remove easy-grab items like original rad and gas caps, collector YOM plates, etc.

[barnstuf]

When I was a bit younger than I am now I made my first trip of over 2500 miles and my tool kit was a screw driver and my spare part was a condenser. Carried both in the pocket of the drivers door. Did not need either. Modifications? zero, none.

[400A-64]

Preparations for the 1982 Around the World Tour can be found in the RESTORER magazine Vol 27 Iss 5, Jan-Feb 1983 page 24.
Please understand at the time we were not able to take along our CB's we had no Cell phones,no computers and alas NO FORD BARN !! There were no Model A parts dealers along the way...OH YES we had modifications, ( I hope not to be drummed out of the FORD BARN. ) In looking back in time I guess we were the trailblazers to the long distance tours that travel the world today. We managed 300 to 400 miles on some days, and had to deal with travel and car problems as they happened. Three years in the planning and just over four monthes of the tour...we never regretted the effort of a great journey!!!
Bruce Davis .
Tourmaster
[email protected]

[Randy in Illinois]

I use to carry 1 of everything, trouble is you never seem to find it when you need it. another idea is carry your national club rosterlike Fred said, they have address or phone # and would be glad to help another Model A'r, plan to see friends on your way. gives you a stop so things can be check over or fixed if need be. Don't forget towing on your insurance. It's not only for acidents but mechanical breakdown. The rest was covered. creditcard, basic parts that you should carry anyway ie. condenser, points, fan belt gaskets, wp packing, tools. the rest of the stuff gets too heavy and too much to unpack if you need them, If anything else breaks, fix it like they use to on the road. Good Luck

[Clem Clement]

I carry way too much. We were caught one time with a friend's car thru the fan blade and none of us mechanics had a pair of 90deg. needle nose plyers. I have an old military cloth tool bag that rides with me and doesn't rattle. From experience I carry parts that we had had trouble with on other trips: points, condensers in a ziploc bag, carb, gen, fuses, bulbs, bailing wire, misc.nuts and bolts, instant beeer, tow rope, wet jack, chock(s), good luck charms, throttle return spring, clutch arm, goop and grease.

[grantsauder]

I and a mate did a trip around Australia in 1963 with a 1930 Model A phaeton. We travelled for three months and covered 10,000 miles through the outback ,Sydney to Townsville, to Alice Springs, to Adelaide, to Perth and back to Sydney via Melbourne. Carried spare distributor as the points had to be reset every 500 mi. Small set of tools, pliers and No. 9 wire and one spare tire. The car was given to me by a little old lady down the street where I lived in Sydney. We had the Motor redone and did the rest ourselves. We made all the papers in the main cities. We only had to buy two tires and rebuild the front spring in Perth. Drank beer in the Black Swan Brewery and never had to buy in a Pub.Greatest time of our lives as single guys. Grant

[Tom Wesenberg]

No need to bring heavy parts. I'd carry an extra spare tire because mine are so old.
Basic wrenches and screwdrivers, a spare condenser, coil, a couple 6' clip leads, a quart of oil, and a spare girlfriend.

BTW, I just watched a 2 hour special on Johnny Carson and at the end he was "Carnac"

Shish......Boom.......Bah

What noise does a sheep make as it explodes?

[Logan]

Even if a car is 100% restored to how Henry had it and had a modern fan belt on it I wouldn't necessarily say to just take off driving across the country with basic tools. Just remember everything mechanical/electrical is prone to failure. BECAUSE shit happens sometimes whether we want to admit it or not.

[Jordan]

The people who run the great race have a support trailer for a reason!

[George Miller]

Basic wrenches, condenser, jumper wire.

[jmeckel]

On my trips I carry a spare fan belt, points, condenser, set of spark plugs, tire tube, tire patches, electrical tape, about 20' of 14 ga wire, a small coil of solid wire (never know what you need to "hay wire" together or up!) a few crimp on wire connectors, fuses, spare coil, 2 clip leads, small digital volt meter, MMO, 1 qt oil, jack, tire wrenches, basic hand tools, small socket set, hammer. If it is warm 1 gal of water. Most / all of this fits under the back seat of my Tudor. The oil, MMO, Water goes n the trunk on the back.

I have used the plugs, points, fan belt, and water all in the last year, I put on 2-4000 miles a year.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Speaking as someone who ran the GreatRace numerous times, I can tell you that not everyone has/had a large support trailer, and the ones that did were usually out at night trying to repair their modifications or poor craftsmanship!! I saw it WAY too often.

I do believe from personal experiences that if a car is truly restored with good quality parts, then it should be trouble-free for 3,000 miles. And, if something did break, help and/or a replacement part is only hours away.

For some of the new folks that have not seen this, Ron Cloat proved something that many might dream of, -but only a few are bold enough to try. Go read THIS and see why I say you don't need all the extra parts to carry with you.
.
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[Richard Wilson]

The more that I have driven my Model A's the fewer parts and tools I take with me. The guys that pack the most extra parts are almost always the least capable of repairing their car on the side of the road anyway.

[TDO]

I carry points,plugs, 2 condensers, I've changed over to modern points and I find the condensers are made in china (not very good) basic tool set, water, oil, and a good mechanic book also a good volt meter. Any one know where you can buy USA made modern type condensers.

[John LaVoy]

Having traveled thousands of miles in everything from a bone stock Model A to one that is modified for comfort and reliability the only time the Model A did not get me home was when the block started leaking through pin holes from rusting out from the inside. There was no easy fix to that. On all the other trips if there was a problem we were able to locate parts from Model A owners or a regular auto parts store.

Don't be overly concerned if you have done a thorough restoration then you should be good. Sounds like you have done some mechanical repairs and restoration so there shouldn't be a problem.

You didn't indicate where you were going to be going on your outing. Give local folks a heads up and they might invite you to meetings or give you the use of a garage for servicing your Model A on the road.

[P.S.]

Originally Posted by John LaVoy

Give local folks a heads up and they might invite you to meetings or give you the use of a garage for servicing your Model A on the road.

That's an excellent point, John. Will definately do that when we take a really long trip in the car.

BTW, it was nice speaking with you at the Turlock meet. My wife really enjoyed your taking the time to help us, and your willingness to help the newbies left a lasting impression on her.

---

Heck, if anyone is traveling through this area and wants to use my (tiny) garage to service their Model A, they are welcome to anything they need that is here.

[FL&WVMIKE]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

Well, maybe to answer your question with sincereity, and using your panel truck as an example, I would remove the original fan belt (due to rarity & expense) and take off on your trip. I am of the opinion there is no need for any spare water pumps, extra gasket sets, carburetors, or "crutches". All these items do is weigh down the vehicle! It boils down to you completely 'restored' every part your panel truck to original specifications. Therefore your truck is no different than it was when it was brand new. Back then when a car was new, no one carried spare parts like that, ...so there is not a need now unless someone feels there is a faulty part about to fail. Even so, like mentioned above having a few phone numbers of friends in your pocket will take care of everything else like finding someone to bring you items to make repairs.

BRENT in 10-uh-C ................
Back when the "A"s were new, you could find "A" parts at every gas station, hardware store, etc.
Beside, not everyone has you expertise in repairing our beloved cars.
MIKE

[ora masters]

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wow brent that was great thanks

[Terry, NJ]

Wow Brent! Anymore stories like that?
Terry

[Terry, NJ]

Hey! What about modifications? All I'm reading about is emergency repairs. How do you modify your cars, reliably, for long distance? I know about pumping the tires up hard and waxing it, changing the oil, but what else is there?
Terry

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Terry, NJ

Wow Brent! Anymore stories like that?
Terry

While not totally the same but last Fall my wife & I drove our 1915 Model T about 700 miles in 4 days up the Blue Ridge Pkwy ...and I purposely did not take any spare parts except for an extra ignition coil and some engine oil. Also only took tools that would have been supplied with the vehicle when originally sold. I did this as a simple exercise to see if a car could still do it.

,
'

[Doug in NJ]

What would make a fan belt fail after 4000 miles? Modern belts on modern cars have much more tension, run a lot faster, and last maybe 10 times longer.

Doug

Originally Posted by jmeckel

I have used the plugs, points, fan belt, and water all in the last year, I put on 2-4000 miles a year.

[P.S.]

Originally Posted by Doug in NJ

What would make a fan belt fail after 4000 miles? Modern belts on modern cars have much more tension, run a lot faster, and last maybe 10 times longer.

Doug

If the pulleys are not aligned properly, the fan belts fail quickly.

Also, you'll notice that modern serpentine belts are thinner and wider than the Model A V-belts. The thicker the belt, the more the outside material has to stretch every time it goes around a pulley.

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by Doug in NJ

What would make a fan belt fail after 4000 miles? Modern belts on modern cars have much more tension, run a lot faster, and last maybe 10 times longer.

Doug

I agree and after 10 years my fan belt still looks like the day I put it on. It hasn't even limbered up yet.

[Jordan]

Originally Posted by Doug in NJ

What would make a fan belt fail after 4000 miles? Modern belts on modern cars have much more tension, run a lot faster, and last maybe 10 times longer.

Doug

He didn't say he replaced it after 4,000 miles. He said he replaced it last year, and that he drive 2-4,000 miles a year. He didn't say how many years it had been on there.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Thinking about what the last 3 or 4 posters have said regarding the fan belt replacement, my question is do y'all carry all these spare parts because you are not maintaining the vehicle at home? In other words, do you just wait for something to break while you are driving before you are forced to stop and replace it?


.

[Richard Wilson]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

Thinking about what the last 3 or 4 posters have said regarding the fan belt replacement, my question is do y'all carry all these spare parts because you are not maintaining the vehicle at home? In other words, do you just wait for something to break while you are driving before you are forced to stop and replace it?


.

EXACTLY! My thought from the beginning. If a part is in good condition when you leave home, I would bet it is not going to fail in 100 - 200 miles on a tour. Model A's DO require routine maintaince. I have never seen a fan belt fail while on the road in 30 years of club tours.

[RockHillWill]

I sure have seen a lot of good advice here, and appreciate all that have responded.

I was just daydreaming the other day and have started to list the pros and cons of doing an extended tour, and the very best part of any project that I embark on is the planning and the preparation. It's the mental gymnastics of a project that has the appeal to me, and I was specifically interested in what I might need to be concerned with regarding the use of a GPS and a cell phone charger. Can these be done with standard 6V and generator? What are the advantages of converting to 12V? Would you have to chainge any of the existing wire harness components.

This 'idea' is a ways off and would encompass a trip exceeding 8,500 miles and I am just beginning to decide what preparations would have to be made, so I can get a better idea as to weather I actually want to do this or not.

Twice before in my life, I have embarked on a similar journey, of similar length, neither in a Model A, but both were seat of the pants endeavers and after the last one I decided to prepare better for the next/last one. With the advantage of hindsight, youth and ignorance is not as appealing as age and wisdom.

There are no gaurantees, but I have learned that chance favors the prepared mind.

I also spent a lot of time in one of my past occupations preparing for 'trips' that could be rather intense, and learned that for some reason, the more you prepared for a 'problem', the less likely it would happen, but if it did happen, you were better prepared to deal with it in a timely manner.

[jmeckel]

Originally Posted by Richard Wilson

EXACTLY! My thought from the beginning. If a part is in good condition when you leave home, I would bet it is not going to fail in 100 - 200 miles on a tour. Model A's DO require routine maintaince. I have never seen a fan belt fail while on the road in 30 years of club tours.

The fan belt that failed on me last year had been on the car for less than 500 miles, was purchased from an A parts store the year before, I think it was made far outside of the USA. It did not show any wear, just driving down the road and the thing shreaded it's self. Again a replacement parts quailty, which was why a set of points failed also. I am very careful to maintain my A properly, however when the parts fail because of poor manufacature it is best to have spares and know how to quickly replace them. The few parts I carry do not weight up much, fit under my back seat, and could save a tow. Besides it was kind of fun to have to do a little fixing after pulling into a field road, just like my Grandparrents used to tell us kids stories about doing when they went on trips, in the old days!

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Will, both the phone and the GPS can be operated/charged off of the 6 volt battery as is with no modification needed other than switch the battery polarity.

To add to your little dream, I think it would really cool if you obtained permission to remove the bed off of Miss Peggy's pick-up and built a bed that could become a camper / chuck wagon. Then just stock it with enough provisions (food, tools, misc) for you to drive some 100 miles North and jump on the Blue Ridge Parkway over around Boone. Then follow the parkway up northward bouncing from State Park to State Park (remember at your age you get a special rate on an annual Park Pass!!). Just think of this as your "Mini-Whinnie", --the little brother to your motorhome.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by jmeckel

The fan belt that failed on me last year had been on the car for less than 500 miles, was purchased from an A parts store the year before, I think it was made far outside of the USA. It did not show any wear, just driving down the road and the thing shreaded it's self. Again a replacement parts quailty, which was why a set of points failed also. I am very careful to maintain my A properly, however when the parts fail because of poor manufacature it is best to have spares and know how to quickly replace them. The few parts I carry do not weight up much, fit under my back seat, and could save a tow. Besides it was kind of fun to have to do a little fixing after pulling into a field road, just like my Grandparrents used to tell us kids stories about doing when they went on trips, in the old days!

Jon, I think what I am reading is poor quality reproduction parts (maybe the same as poor quality original parts) were your issue.

Since Jon recalls stories of his grandparent's trips, for a mind exercise (...as Will puts it ) here lets talk about what would happen if spares were not available when the belt broke. Personally I would have driven it on as-is. The Model-A cooling system does not need the water pump to turn for the engine to cool ....IF the radiator and the rest of the system is functioning properly. The system will thermo-syphon quite well. The engine does not need a cooling fan as long as there is enough forward motion to blow air through the radiator fins. If the engine pans are installed, the air moving under the vehicle also creates a "vacuum" if you will that also helps draw sufficient air through the radiator.

With regard to the points, I am not sure exactly what happened to yours but lets play out a couple of scenarios in our minds. If the points block wore out pre-maturely, then likely that is a dist. cam roughness issue. None the less, there is usually enough points 'block' left where a liberal amount of grease (wiped from around the shackles) can be applied to the cam to get you motoring again after a re-adjustment. Now this should be able to get us to the next town with an auto parts (--or on home). In our minds, lets just assume we have a couple thousand miles left on our trip though. If we decided not to use our trusty Roster but instead decided to repair it ourselves, the next town's auto parts would likely have a set of points where a replacement points block could be robbed off of some other application and either Super-glued or JB Welded to the Model-A points. If you wanted to be even more creative, a piece of hardwood whittled out and glued to the points arm would likely last a long time if oiled sufficiently.

My point is that often times back 60-70 years ago, just like today there was not an auto parts nearby that had Model-A parts available so folks assessed the situation and found creative ways to make something that was available work for them. A long piece of ¼" rope wrapped around the pump, generator, and crank pulley that is overlapped on the ends by an inch or so and then wired together will make a dandy fan belt in a pinch. Look at how Ron Cloat in his trip needed a radiator cap gasket so he used a Soda Can Insulator and cut one out. I have been touring in Model-As all of my 52 years, and I have yet to see an circumstance where a spare part carried under the seat was necessary to getting the Model-A home. Maybe that day will come for me but in my mind, the need for carrying spare starters, generators, carburetors, distributors, water pumps, etc. are just not needed.


.
.

[P.S.]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

Thinking about what the last 3 or 4 posters have said regarding the fan belt replacement, my question is do y'all carry all these spare parts because you are not maintaining the vehicle at home? In other words, do you just wait for something to break while you are driving before you are forced to stop and replace it?


.

No, not at all.

The reason for carrying a fan belt- It's cheap and doesn't take up much room, so why not?

Same goes for other parts. It's not that the fan belt on the car isn't checked and replaced when necessary, it's because things can (and will) happen. If the replacement part is cheap, small, and light enough to keep one in the car, then why not?

The other reason is peace of mind. Just knowing there's a spare belt, dist., carb, etc. under the back seat ready to go gives some of us OCD types a better feeling when pulling out of the garage and headed somewhere. You might feel differently, and that's cool. You know way more about cars than I do, that's for sure. For those of us with less experience, having a "plan B" just feels good.

[Richard Wilson]

Excellent point PS. "Peace of mind" is very important. Everybody has a different comfort level based on experience or lack of. I would rather see a Model A being driven with 500 pounds of spare parts in the back than a Model A left sitting in the garage because the owner is afraid he will break down.

[Doug in NJ]

I confess: I, too , have a spare fan belt in both of my old cars, for the reason that others said: it is small and cheap, and doesn't rattle around under the seat or in the trunk. But I store the best one between the water pump and the generator :-).

One other question: What would make a spark plug fail unexpectedly? Are they more likely to get replaced because they have gotten fouled, due to a problem somewhere else?

Doug

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by P.S.

No, not at all.

The reason for carrying a fan belt- It's cheap and doesn't take up much room, so why not?

Same goes for other parts. It's not that the fan belt on the car isn't checked and replaced when necessary, it's because things can (and will) happen. If the replacement part is cheap, small, and light enough to keep one in the car, then why not?

The other reason is peace of mind. Just knowing there's a spare belt, dist., carb, etc. under the back seat ready to go gives some of us OCD types a better feeling when pulling out of the garage and headed somewhere. You might feel differently, and that's cool. You know way more about cars than I do, that's for sure. For those of us with less experience, having a "plan B" just feels good.

I truly do not feel that I am worthy of such a statement because I put my pants on the same way as everyone else does. And for the record, I have a "Plan B" too but generally I think about it when the time comes that I need it. Richard is correct in that if that amount of spare parts is what it takes to drive the car, then Rock & Roll on!! To me the best 'Plan B' is knowing your vehicle well enough that you can feel/smell/see abnormalties as they begin to materialize so that one does not become stranded. That is probably why most of us do not care spare parts in our daily-drivers.

Oh, and or grins & giggles, how long do all those parts ride under the seat before they are used? A carburetor that is under the seat that is hidden from view for several years probably begins to rust inside the internal passages. THAT can't be good!!

[jmeckel]

Originally Posted by Doug in NJ

I confess: I, too , have a spare fan belt in both of my old cars, for the reason that others said: it is small and cheap, and doesn't rattle around under the seat or in the trunk. But I store the best one between the water pump and the generator :-).

One other question: What would make a spark plug fail unexpectedly? Are they more likely to get replaced because they have gotten fouled, due to a problem somewhere else?

Doug

When I purchased my A it had new style AC plugs, they worked fine, but one decided to start causing miss fires, I have had this same issue with the lower cost modern plugs in the old hit an miss engines I also retore and use. As well as the old 2 cylinder tractors that many of us around here still use, seems the modern gas can cause some issues, or at least that is what one old guy tried to tell me. I purchased a Wards NOS set of take a part plugs from a Ford Barner, and have zero problems since and they have many miles on them..

[MikeK]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

. . .To me the best 'Plan B' is knowing your vehicle well enough that you can feel/smell/see abnormalties as they begin to materialize so that one does not become stranded. . .

That certainly does wonders in reducing the drayage of stuff carried along! Unfortunately the opposite, ignorance is bliss, will also free drivers of the perceived need to perform routine maintenance, occasionally look things over, or even carry the simple tool kit Henry provided!

A more modern analogy:
Him: Honey, can I borrow your car? My serpentine's shredded. I have to go to the auto parts store. Her: OK, and can you get my car washed? A couple weeks ago a red symbol light came on right by the 45mph spot on the speedometer. It looks like a bucket with water waves under it. And have them turn the light off. I'm going to my sisters for lunch Tuesday, and have to take the interstate for a few miles. I don't wanna waste gas by driving a dirty car over 45.

[160B]

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I looked at all the posts and did not see a link to the list on the MAFCA web site so here it is.

http://www.mafca.com/tqa_m_be_prepared.html

[Chuck Sea/Tac]

[QUOTE=Clem Clement;593727]I carry way too much. , instant beeer,/QUOTE]

Interesting, just how tasty IS instant beer anyway?
I would have highlighted, don't know how on my phone.