Burt Lancaster pouring babbit?

[MrTube]

Watched the movie "The Train" with the wife last night.

Was surprised to see babbitt being poured for bearings. Had no idea steam engines used babbitt bearings?

[JoeWay]

Steam engines, line shafts, lathes, pumps, compressors, conveyors, sawmill equipment--almost every machine that turned had babbitt bearings.

Joe

[J Franklin]

Turbine jet engines use babbitt!

[MrTube]

If this is the case, why does it seem like many suggest engines with babbitt bearings cannot handle high rpms or high compression?

Last time I checked, the load on a steam locomotives connecting rods is probably out of this world and turbine jet engines are extremely high rpm.

I'm also curious if what was shown in the movie was accurate? it was only a 5 minute shot or so but I still found it interesting.

[Kevin in NJ]

What you need to keep in mind is there are many different types of Babbitt.

By changing the ratios of the materials you get different properties.

For simple turning shafts a high tin babbitt does fine. You are not worried about the impact loading effects found on engines.

For railroad use the loading is high force on the connecting rod, but they also have much larger surface areas. I do not know which babbitt they use, but babbitt is the easiest to work with in the field too. Any shop can make a mold and pour the babbitt and bore it to the size needed. The wheels have a large bearing with lots of area.

For restoring a historic table saw you can use a lead based babbitt. It is way easier to pour and bore.

The problem with the high strength babbitts is they use more higher melting temp components and that makes a proper pour substantially harder to make happen. The original type Babbitt used by Ford is very hard to get a good pour when you are doing a simple small single pot operation. A large shop set up to pour a bunch of blocks in one day can do attain better consistency as they use larger pots which will keep more stable throughout the pour time. But that is a long story we do not want to talk about now.

As for the force on the Babbitt, the key is balance. Too many engines are assembled with cranks ground wrong and the parts not even close to balanced. So it is out of balance and wiggling around. That does not make for happy babbitt. Throw in poorly poured babbitt with cracks waiting to happen and you get problems. Since people do not understand what was wrong from the start they just assume babbitt is bad when the real problem is a bunch of bad things coming together to make incorrectly poured babbitt fail quicker.

[2935ford]

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Whew! Makes ya wanna switch to inserts!
There aren't any pros like that around this neck of the woods.

[Steam Engine Pete]

Steam engines used alot of babbitt but the connecting rods are not. I can only speak with certainty about steam traction engines(tractors). They have what we call a "crankpin brass" They were lubricated by grease and tended to pound if loose or heat if to tight or lacking lubrication. If your crankpin and brass were not perfect they would do one or the other. Babbitt would melt out under these conditions.

I have seen crankpins actually smoke, sieze up and stop an engine. Loosen them up, cool them down, lube and go again. Did not do them much good but it worked and the were very durable.

Some brasses were repaired by pouring babbitt but if you had trouble you were done until you repoured. Mine use to have a babbitt repaired brass. Never melted it out. Now have a good crankpin and a new brass.

Pete

[Steam Engine Pete]

Not Model A related but since this discussion wandered into steam engines I had to share a picture of my pride and joy. 1912 Case 75 HP steam engine.





Thanks,
Pete

[THE "A" FAMILY]

Pete,
That is just way too cool. Thank you for showing us.

[MrTube]

Pete,

Was that going "balls out" ?? hard to tell by the picture but it looks like it to me.

I assume that engine also shoots exhaust steam up the smoke stack to pull air through the boiler tubes?

[MrTube]

Originally Posted by Jeff/Illinois

I like that movie. Good flick Burt Lancaster was one of the best.

I loved the decoy train depot scene when they duped the German officers on the train to think they had entered Germany and were going thru Zweibrucken. I have lived and worked there, my grandparents were from there still have family there, but THAT place on the film ain't Zweibrucken of course! Still neat to see.

Jeff, it was really crazy how they pulled that whole thing off.
Do you know the babbitt scene I'm talking about?

[Steam Engine Pete]

It was pulling fairly hard. I had also overfired a tad bit. Plenty of coal. Yes it does exhaust steam up the stack to create draft for the fire. The plow I am pulling is my former 8 bottom John Deere plow. I sold it when I bought my A in November. Still have the steam engine, that is not going anywhere.

When I bought the steam engine in 1992 I sold an AA truck, 50 Plymouth Special Deluxe and Harley Davidson Sportster.

I sold my 30 Tudor Sedan a few years later to help make the steam engine payments. My wifes late model car at the time also went away so we could afford the engine. She was madder than hell when I bought it but now she is also a licensed engineer.

The steam engine should not need any work for awhile so now I have my A. This one will not get sold to get anything else.

Steam engines can be a huge money pit!!!!