The Ford Barn

2manycars · 09-02-2018, 05:01 PM

When I drove my 40 in the 60's, I could lock up all four wheels in a quick stop. Now I feel like fred flintstone. I have been fussing with the annoying lower mount adjustments, and not much improvement. I notice that the post war Lockheed brakes did not use the lower cam adjustment, but used a differnt shoe and mounting bolt. Supposedly these centered themselves. Is it possible to use the post war shoes and mounting bolts on the 40 backing plates? This would make adjustments easier, and probably result in better brakes.
Or should I just spend the big bucks and convert to Bendix self energizing brakes?
There are probably 4 times as many cars on the roads as there was in the 60's and we did not have cell phones, texting, and infotainment systems to make the roads more dangerous, so I think good brakes are more important than ever.

JSeery · 09-02-2018, 05:08 PM

Interesting question, I know very little about the Lockheed brakes, there may be some others that can provide some adjustment help. But that said the Bendix brakes are a definite improvement over the Lockheed brakes, and much easier to adjust.

V8COOPMAN · 09-02-2018, 06:47 PM

You mention "spending the BIG BUCKS...." ! You only need to spend about $400 on the two front backing plates. The old Ford drums work with the Bendix brakes. The rear LOCKHEED brakes work just fine in conjunction with the Bendix fronts. You MAY need to properly size the M/C to work with the Bendix brakes. DD

Fred A · 09-02-2018, 07:06 PM

Just out of high school, as a big spender, paid $600 for a nice '40 business coupe. Dad was away on a movie location and on return dictated that I leave the coupe in the drive until I installed Zephyr brakes. Lucky they were common in the low buck yards and were quickly torched off at the axles. He really knew his brakes. Still taking his advice. Good Luck: Fred A

hotcoupe · 09-02-2018, 10:18 PM

I'm planning to use Lincoln brakes (front & rear) on my '37 1/2 ton. I have '40 brakes on it now and I just don't feel confident, especially the way people drive today. Just consider the worst case scenario, what's it going to cost if you tag the guy in front of you.
Tom

2manycars · 09-03-2018, 09:12 AM

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I just spent another morning trying to adjust the Lockheeds and the brakes are pitiful. I will nurse it along until the cruise in season is over in a few weeks, and buy the bendix conversion.

Darrell S · 09-03-2018, 09:37 AM

Are the Lockheed brakes from 40 different from the brakes on the 48? Are the Lincoln brakes an improvement over the 48's also?

19Fordy · 09-03-2018, 09:41 AM

Nice looking 40. Are you 100% sure you are adjusting the 40 Lockheed brakes correctly? Re: Lincoln brakes: If your drums are truly "true" and not over .060 in. just buy the MT Products front and rear loaded backing plates and you are good to go. You can buy either backing plates with either the 1 3/4 in. or 2 in. brake shoes. To make the Lincoln backing plate fit flat against the spindle you have to grind away a small amount of metal from the top area of each spindle near the king pin. Use a die grinder. Easy to do. Go with the 2 in. If you do decide to buy the entire MT Lincoln kit with the easily removable drums be sure to use your old OEM FORD rear wheel bearings as the repro bearings may be imports of low quality. I bought the complete MT kit from Cornhuskers Rod and Custom. Owner goes buy the name "Krylon" on Fordbarn and HAMB. No complaints.

19Fordy · 09-03-2018, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darrell S

Are the Lockheed brakes from 40 different from the brakes on the 48? Are the Lincoln brakes an improvement over the 48's also?

Yes, they are an improvement as Bendix brakes are self energizing with improved stopping power. Lockheed are not self energizing. If you do a "Google" search on Lockheed and Bendix Brakes info. like this appears.
https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...1451&showall=1

rotorwrench · 09-03-2018, 09:44 AM

The Lockheed type have less mechanical advantage than the Bendix design but they can be made to work as good as when they were new. The best way to start out is to have the shoes matched up to the drums but the old shoe arc grinders are hard to find now days. The government wanted folks to turn them in when they were threatening a ban on the toxic fibrous type of asbestos such as was used in steam pipe insulation and any form that was ground down such as brake shoe lining dust. A lot of shops did that recall plus the modern Bendix types rarely needed arcing anyway so most shops didn't use them anymore.

When they are properly fit to the drums, they are easy to adjust. On drums that are worn out to the limits, a thicker lining was installed then arced down for better fit. If a person starts with new drums, it can make the job easier but the shoes would have to be hand fit if a person has no access to an arcing machine.

All this makes the M/T Lincoln style types look better all the time. Since the shoe can float and has an improvement of mechanical advantage, a person generally doesn't have to worry about arcing the shoes. The ones for rear brakes are generally fit with smaller diameter brake cylinders to give a more balanced overall braking action.

51woodie · 09-03-2018, 10:08 AM

I changed out the brakes on my '46 Super Deluxe to the 1-3/4 X 12" Bendix style brakes, which is the stock size for the car. I got the rear and front brake kits from Mac's. I later found that Boling Brothers sells them as well, and a little cheaper, as MAC's gets them from B-B. http://www.bolingbrothers.com/1937-1948/ The change over was pretty much plug and play. One thing to watch for is there may be some stamping/punch-out burrs on the backing plates where they fit over the axle/spindle "centering" lip. On the front spindles, you may (I did) have to do a bit of grinding around the top and possibly on the outer edges of the bolt hole lugs, to make sure the backing plates fit flat on the spindles. A bit of grinding may be needed on the rear axle flanges as well. I stuck some masking tape on the back side of the backing plates where they fit on, placed the plate and wiggled/twisted on the axle/spindle to check for interference. This gave me locations that I had to grind. I installed a new stock master cylinder, set up the brakes and they work very well. As my car is stock it has an oil bath air cleaner, and when I did a brake test, I got some chirping from the tires, but also some oil splashed out of the cleaner and was nicely distributed around the engine compartment by the fan!

Juergen · 09-03-2018, 10:41 AM

" Is it possible to use the post war shoes and mounting bolts on the 40 backing plates? This would make adjustments easier, and probably result in better brakes."

To answer one of your questions, it is not practical to convert the 40 backing plates to the Bendix style. The anchor bolts and springs are entirely different.

19Fordy · 09-03-2018, 10:55 AM

To add a little bit to Juergen's reply:
The 40 Lockheed wheel cylinder is also located higher up than the Lincoln Bendix.
It's a whole different configuration.

2manycars · 09-03-2018, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Juergen

" Is it possible to use the post war shoes and mounting bolts on the 40 backing plates? This would make adjustments easier, and probably result in better brakes."

To answer one of your questions, it is not practical to convert the 40 backing plates to the Bendix style. The anchor bolts and springs are entirely different.

I was asking if the 42 to 48 Lockheed brakes would work on the 40 backing plates.
I have decided to covert to Bendix Lincoln type brakes.

bobH · 09-03-2018, 01:08 PM

Good info posted... Will add that I don't think adjusting those early brakes is that big of deal. Just think about what you are trying to accomplish, and go for it.
Richard, Early V8 Garage, has posted detailed instructions on here, several times. I assume a search will turn it up. Or... just call Dennis or Richard at the EV8G, and ask for help.
Putting on 46-48 backing plates & shoes, would eliminate the need for that lower adjustment. I've had good luck finding those parts for free.
And another thing... Those early brakes (39-41) originally came with a 1-1/4 (big-end) wheel cylinder. My experience, & my opinion, changing that wheel cylinder to the 46-48 cylinder is an improvement. The 46-48 cylinder is 1-3/8. On my 47, some previous person had put on (new) early cylinders, the 1-1/4 variety. Once I changed them to 1-3/8, I had a noticeable improvement in braking.
Of course, none of my comments negate the improvement of Bendix-style front brakes.
To address one of the questions... converting the existing backing plate to Bendix... There was a person (I think in TX) that was doing this. It's almost like major surgery, but the point is, it CAN be done. The price is/was almost the same as buying the new MT kit. My opinion... not worth it, just buy the new kit.

2manycars · 09-03-2018, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 19Fordy

Nice looking 40. Are you 100% sure you are adjusting the 40 Lockheed brakes correctly? Re: Lincoln brakes: If your drums are truly "true" and not over .060 in. just buy the MT Products front and rear loaded backing plates and you are good to go. You can buy either backing plates with either the 1 3/4 in. or 2 in. brake shoes. To make the Lincoln backing plate fit flat against the spindle you have to grind away a small amount of metal from the top area of each spindle near the king pin. Use a die grinder. Easy to do. Go with the 2 in. If you do decide to buy the entire MT Lincoln kit with the easily removable drums. Be sure to use your old OEM FORD rear wheel bearings as the repro bearings may be imports of low quality. I bought the complete MT kit from Cornhuskers Rod and Custom. Owner goes buy the name "Krylon" on Fordbarn and HAMB. No complaints.

I have been adjusting the brakes as per the book, but whoever did this brake job some years ago might have set it up wrong. If I start with the lower pivot bolts set with the dots together, I cannot turn them down without binding, and in fact need to have the dots turned up a bit. The more I fuss with them, the more frustrated I get. The lining is also hard, and glazed, so I need to rebuild the complete system. I am also going to convert the front to Lincoln bendix brakes.
The photos are me with the car in 1964, and today.

2manycars · 09-03-2018, 01:16 PM

Thanks to all who responded. I am planning a complete overhaul of the brakes, with a Bendix front conversion.

bobH · 09-03-2018, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2manycars

I have been adjusting the brakes as per the book, but whoever did this brake job some years ago might have set it up wrong. If I start with the lower pivot bolts set with the dots together, I cannot turn them down without binding, and in fact need to have the dots turned up a bit. The more I fuss with them, the more frustrated I get. The lining is also hard, and glazed, so I need to rebuild the complete system. I am also going to convert the front to Lincoln bendix brakes.
The photos are me with the car in 1964, and today.

Another comment, another opinion.... Hard lining = nfg. You need soft lining for good brakes. Soft lining should not be a problem. My local relining guy, friction shop, seems to understand. And, when I ask for soft lining, he seems to know exactly what is needed to make fixed-anchor (Lockheed) brakes work.

19Fordy · 09-03-2018, 01:30 PM

2manycars; Your problem is worth solving before you spend the big dollars.
When you say,
"I cannot turn them down without binding," What exactly is is binding?
Is your emergency brake "On?"
Is your brake pedal "free play" adjustment correct?
Rub some chalk on your brake shoes,install the drums and road test the car to see what part of brake linings are contacting the drums.

With the brake drum removed, turn those "dots" and carefully examine what happens to the adjustment. Could it be that the brass inserts in the bottom anchor holes are incorrectly installed? The stock 40 brake drum lining was 1/5 of an inch thick according to the 1935-48 CHILTON's MANUAL, page 437. Check yours for variation on all your wheels. Also, could it be that your brake linings are oversize with the ends of the shoes rubbing against the drum surface and the middle of the shoes are not..

Post photos of your situation. It would be interesting to see and possibly solve right on this forum.

Finally, do a Fordbarn search "Adjusting 40 Ford brakes" Lots of good info and problem solving, like this:
https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...st+1940+brakes

Be sure to read all of this thread about adjusting 40 brakes.
https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...40+ford+brakes

Vintage Copper 47 · 09-03-2018, 01:54 PM

I upgraded to Bendix brakes when I first got my 47.. No regrets AT ALL!

2manycars · 09-03-2018, 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobH

Another comment, another opinion.... Hard lining = nfg. You need soft lining for good brakes. Soft lining should not be a problem. My local relining guy, friction shop, seems to understand. And, when I ask for soft lining, he seems to know exactly what is needed to make fixed-anchor (Lockheed) brakes work.

I also have a frictions dealer who has done relining on brake shoes for me when I ran my restoration shop. He has installed soft linings on my model A shoes for my tudor and my son's roadster pickup.

2manycars · 09-03-2018, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 19Fordy

2manycars; Your problem is worth solving before you spend the big dollars.
When you say,
"I cannot turn them down without binding," What exactly is is binding?
Is your emergency brake "On?"
Is your brake pedal "free play" adjustment correct?
Rub some chalk on your brake shoes,install the drums and road test the car to see what part of brake linings are contacting the drums.

With the brake drum removed, turn those "dots" and carefully examine what happens to the adjustment. Could it be that the brass inserts in the bottom anchor holes are incorrectly installed? The stock 40 brake drum lining was 1/5 of an inch thick according to the 1935-48 CHILTON's MANUAL, page 437. Check yours for variation on all your wheels. Also, could it be that your brake linings are oversize with the ends of the shoes rubbing against the drum surface and the middle of the shoes are not..

Post photos of your situation. It would be interesting to see and possibly solve right on this forum.

Finally, do a Fordbarn search "Adjusting 40 Ford brakes" Lots of good info and problem solving, like this:
https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...st+1940+brakes

Be sure to read all of this thread about adjusting 40 brakes.
https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...40+ford+brakes

I have been through all that. There is something wrong in the setup of these brakes. The wheel locks up if I turn the anchor bolt down, so the lining is grabbing the drum when it should be lowering it. I think the anchors are installed wrong. In a few weeks it will all come apart. I am done fighting with it for now. The guy who installed these brakes may not have known what he was doing. This car stopped much better when I bought it in 1964.

Steve in Denver · 09-03-2018, 04:09 PM

Along this same line of brake questions, I have a '36 with manual brakes. I have acquired a complete '39 front end and will be putting the Bendix backing plates on it. for the rear end, I have a set of '39 rear backing plates and the emergency brake cable set up.
Question is, will I need to do any centering when mounting the '39 plates on the '36 rear end?

Ggmac · 09-03-2018, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2manycars

I have been through all that. There is something wrong in the setup of these brakes. The wheel locks up if I turn the anchor bolt down, so the lining is grabbing the drum when it should be lowering it. I think the anchors are installed wrong. In a few weeks it will all come apart. I am done fighting with it for now. The guy who installed these brakes may not have known what he was doing. This car stopped much better when I bought it in 1964.

Sounds like something's wrong BUT don't forget , we were a lot stronger back then !

Steve in Denver · 09-03-2018, 05:41 PM

Sorry, I could not see my initial posting, now I can figure out how to delete this one.

russcc · 09-03-2018, 06:36 PM

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I suggest you talk to Ray Helgers in RI. He will tell you that properly adjusted stock '40 brakes will put you through the windshield. But they need to have good quality, preferably old type brake linings, not the modern stuff that doesn't stop no mater how hard you jump on the pedal. Ray 401 635 4849, Wed. thru Sat. 8AM to Noon.

Ken/Alabama · 09-03-2018, 07:30 PM

I take a piece of 80 grit sticky back sand paper made for the air file and stick it the the inside of the drum then with the shoe in hand dust the lining surface with black paint. Then work the shoe back and forth in the drum. You will see immediately that the shoe isn't making full contact. Keep working it untill it does. Yes it's time consuming but it's always worked for me. My 40 will slide the tires.

2manycars · 09-03-2018, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken/Alabama

I take a piece of 80 grit sticky back sand paper made for the air file and stick it the the inside of the drum then with the shoe in hand dust the lining surface with black paint. Then work the shoe back and forth in the drum. You will see immediately that the shoe isn't making full contact. Keep working it untill it does. Yes it's time consuming but it's always worked for me. My 40 will slide the tires.

Mine used to slide the tires in the 60's,but with the current setup, it could not slide the tires on grass.
Big project comming up. I will have it stopping well when I am done.
Photo from 1969.

ford38v8 · 09-04-2018, 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken/Alabama

I take a piece of 80 grit sticky back sand paper made for the air file and stick it the the inside of the drum then with the shoe in hand dust the lining surface with black paint. Then work the shoe back and forth in the drum. You will see immediately that the shoe isn't making full contact. Keep working it untill it does. Yes it's time consuming but it's always worked for me. My 40 will slide the tires.

That's a good method, but it is imperative to wear a dust mask, and to do the job outside, preferably on damp soil to hold the asbestos dust down. Care must also be taken in the handling of asbestos contaminated clothing. Asbestos is commonly found in dirt, and harmless unless, and only if it's dust is inhaled.

jrvariel48 · 09-04-2018, 02:51 AM

MT puts out a nice set up! I got rid of the old system and now I can stop!!

Steve in Denver · 09-04-2018, 08:15 AM

Do you still have the Wide 5 wheels? I know that disc all the way around are available for the standard 5 on 5 wheels.

Ken/Alabama · 09-04-2018, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Kennedy

Do you still have the Wide 5 wheels? I know that disc all the way around are available for the standard 5 on 5 wheels.

The 40 doesn't have the Wide Five pattern

Jack E/NJ · 09-04-2018, 02:10 PM

I'm just hoping Flathead Ted will soon release a Lockheed floater kit after he's done testing his prototypes. Jack E/NJ

1931 flamingo · 09-04-2018, 02:50 PM

Bill: How old are the hoses??
Paul in CT

2manycars · 09-04-2018, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1931 flamingo

Bill: How old are the hoses??
Paul in CT

I dont know when they were changed last, Paul, but they look fairly new. I am planning a complert overhaul of the brakes in a few weeks, so time will tell.

russcc · 09-04-2018, 06:46 PM

If you use the original Lockheed brakes, replace the lining with NOS ones. Fred Wilner at SSO in MN, Nelson Pease, Pease Antique Parts in Palmer MA, and Ray Helgers in RI will likely have the good old linings. Ray's son, Ray III told about a '40 he put new brakes in and it wouldn't stop worth a darn. It wouldn't even lock up the wheels. Ray got a set of NOS ones from his dad's NOS parts, put them in, and it stopped like it should, and locked up the wheels when he got on it hard.

2manycars · 09-05-2018, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by russcc

If you use the original Lockheed brakes, replace the lining with NOS ones. Fred Wilner at SSO in MN, Nelson Pease, Pease Antique Parts in Palmer MA, and Ray Helgers in RI will likely have the good old linings. Ray's son, Ray III told about a '40 he put new brakes in and it wouldn't stop worth a darn. It wouldn't even lock up the wheels. Ray got a set of NOS ones from his dad's NOS parts, put them in, and it stopped like it should, and locked up the wheels when he got on it hard.

Thanks. I will look to see if my shoes have rivet holes. I have the machine to install them.

09-02-2018, 05:01 PM	#1
2manycars Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Eastern CT Posts: 2,732	Lockheed brake frustrations When I drove my 40 in the 60's, I could lock up all four wheels in a quick stop. Now I feel like fred flintstone. I have been fussing with the annoying lower mount adjustments, and not much improvement. I notice that the post war Lockheed brakes did not use the lower cam adjustment, but used a differnt shoe and mounting bolt. Supposedly these centered themselves. Is it possible to use the post war shoes and mounting bolts on the 40 backing plates? This would make adjustments easier, and probably result in better brakes. Or should I just spend the big bucks and convert to Bendix self energizing brakes? There are probably 4 times as many cars on the roads as there was in the 60's and we did not have cell phones, texting, and infotainment systems to make the roads more dangerous, so I think good brakes are more important than ever. __________________ Bill www.brauchauto.com

09-02-2018, 05:08 PM	#2
JSeery Member Emeritus Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Wichita KS Posts: 16,132	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations Interesting question, I know very little about the Lockheed brakes, there may be some others that can provide some adjustment help. But that said the Bendix brakes are a definite improvement over the Lockheed brakes, and much easier to adjust.

09-02-2018, 06:47 PM	#3
V8COOPMAN Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: East Shore of LAKE HOUSTON Posts: 11,113	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations You mention "spending the BIG BUCKS...." ! You only need to spend about $400 on the two front backing plates. The old Ford drums work with the Bendix brakes. The rear LOCKHEED brakes work just fine in conjunction with the Bendix fronts. You MAY need to properly size the M/C to work with the Bendix brakes. DD __________________ *Click Links Below* __ ▼ *'35-'36 W/8BA & MECHANICAL FAN* *T5 W/TORQUE TUBE*

09-02-2018, 07:06 PM	#4
Fred A Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Encino California, near Burbank Posts: 935	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations Just out of high school, as a big spender, paid $600 for a nice '40 business coupe. Dad was away on a movie location and on return dictated that I leave the coupe in the drive until I installed Zephyr brakes. Lucky they were common in the low buck yards and were quickly torched off at the axles. He really knew his brakes. Still taking his advice. Good Luck: Fred A

09-02-2018, 10:18 PM	#5
hotcoupe Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: imperial,mo Posts: 694	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations I'm planning to use Lincoln brakes (front & rear) on my '37 1/2 ton. I have '40 brakes on it now and I just don't feel confident, especially the way people drive today. Just consider the worst case scenario, what's it going to cost if you tag the guy in front of you. Tom

09-03-2018, 09:37 AM	#7
Darrell S Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Everett WA Posts: 346	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations Are the Lockheed brakes from 40 different from the brakes on the 48? Are the Lincoln brakes an improvement over the 48's also?

09-03-2018, 09:44 AM	#10
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,431	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations The Lockheed type have less mechanical advantage than the Bendix design but they can be made to work as good as when they were new. The best way to start out is to have the shoes matched up to the drums but the old shoe arc grinders are hard to find now days. The government wanted folks to turn them in when they were threatening a ban on the toxic fibrous type of asbestos such as was used in steam pipe insulation and any form that was ground down such as brake shoe lining dust. A lot of shops did that recall plus the modern Bendix types rarely needed arcing anyway so most shops didn't use them anymore. When they are properly fit to the drums, they are easy to adjust. On drums that are worn out to the limits, a thicker lining was installed then arced down for better fit. If a person starts with new drums, it can make the job easier but the shoes would have to be hand fit if a person has no access to an arcing machine. All this makes the M/T Lincoln style types look better all the time. Since the shoe can float and has an improvement of mechanical advantage, a person generally doesn't have to worry about arcing the shoes. The ones for rear brakes are generally fit with smaller diameter brake cylinders to give a more balanced overall braking action.

09-03-2018, 10:41 AM	#12
Juergen Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 500	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations " Is it possible to use the post war shoes and mounting bolts on the 40 backing plates? This would make adjustments easier, and probably result in better brakes." To answer one of your questions, it is not practical to convert the 40 backing plates to the Bendix style. The anchor bolts and springs are entirely different.

09-03-2018, 01:08 PM	#15
bobH Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: so cal, placerville, vegas Posts: 1,394	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations Good info posted... Will add that I don't think adjusting those early brakes is that big of deal. Just think about what you are trying to accomplish, and go for it. Richard, Early V8 Garage, has posted detailed instructions on here, several times. I assume a search will turn it up. Or... just call Dennis or Richard at the EV8G, and ask for help. Putting on 46-48 backing plates & shoes, would eliminate the need for that lower adjustment. I've had good luck finding those parts for free. And another thing... Those early brakes (39-41) originally came with a 1-1/4 (big-end) wheel cylinder. My experience, & my opinion, changing that wheel cylinder to the 46-48 cylinder is an improvement. The 46-48 cylinder is 1-3/8. On my 47, some previous person had put on (new) early cylinders, the 1-1/4 variety. Once I changed them to 1-3/8, I had a noticeable improvement in braking. Of course, none of my comments negate the improvement of Bendix-style front brakes. To address one of the questions... converting the existing backing plate to Bendix... There was a person (I think in TX) that was doing this. It's almost like major surgery, but the point is, it CAN be done. The price is/was almost the same as buying the new MT kit. My opinion... not worth it, just buy the new kit. Last edited by bobH; 09-03-2018 at 01:14 PM.

09-03-2018, 01:16 PM	#17
2manycars Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Eastern CT Posts: 2,732	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations Thanks to all who responded. I am planning a complete overhaul of the brakes, with a Bendix front conversion. __________________ Bill www.brauchauto.com

09-03-2018, 01:30 PM	#19
19Fordy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Coral Springs FL Posts: 10,941	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations 2manycars; Your problem is worth solving before you spend the big dollars. When you say, "I cannot turn them down without binding," What exactly is is binding? Is your emergency brake "On?" Is your brake pedal "free play" adjustment correct? Rub some chalk on your brake shoes,install the drums and road test the car to see what part of brake linings are contacting the drums. With the brake drum removed, turn those "dots" and carefully examine what happens to the adjustment. Could it be that the brass inserts in the bottom anchor holes are incorrectly installed? The stock 40 brake drum lining was 1/5 of an inch thick according to the 1935-48 CHILTON's MANUAL, page 437. Check yours for variation on all your wheels. Also, could it be that your brake linings are oversize with the ends of the shoes rubbing against the drum surface and the middle of the shoes are not.. Post photos of your situation. It would be interesting to see and possibly solve right on this forum. Finally, do a Fordbarn search "Adjusting 40 Ford brakes" Lots of good info and problem solving, like this: https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...st+1940+brakes Be sure to read all of this thread about adjusting 40 brakes. https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...40+ford+brakes Last edited by 19Fordy; 09-03-2018 at 01:57 PM.

09-03-2018, 01:54 PM	#20
Vintage Copper 47 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: The sleepy San Fernando Valley Posts: 394	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations I upgraded to Bendix brakes when I first got my 47.. No regrets AT ALL! __________________ WALT "We sleep safe in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm". "Old enough for the experience & too young to know better"

09-03-2018, 04:09 PM	#23
Steve in Denver Senior Member Join Date: May 2017 Posts: 566	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations Along this same line of brake questions, I have a '36 with manual brakes. I have acquired a complete '39 front end and will be putting the Bendix backing plates on it. for the rear end, I have a set of '39 rear backing plates and the emergency brake cable set up. Question is, will I need to do any centering when mounting the '39 plates on the '36 rear end?

09-03-2018, 05:41 PM	#25
Steve in Denver Senior Member Join Date: May 2017 Posts: 566	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations Sorry, I could not see my initial posting, now I can figure out how to delete this one.

09-03-2018, 06:36 PM	#26
russcc Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,871	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) I suggest you talk to Ray Helgers in RI. He will tell you that properly adjusted stock '40 brakes will put you through the windshield. But they need to have good quality, preferably old type brake linings, not the modern stuff that doesn't stop no mater how hard you jump on the pedal. Ray 401 635 4849, Wed. thru Sat. 8AM to Noon.

09-03-2018, 07:30 PM	#27
Ken/Alabama Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Alabama Posts: 3,260	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations I take a piece of 80 grit sticky back sand paper made for the air file and stick it the the inside of the drum then with the shoe in hand dust the lining surface with black paint. Then work the shoe back and forth in the drum. You will see immediately that the shoe isn't making full contact. Keep working it untill it does. Yes it's time consuming but it's always worked for me. My 40 will slide the tires.

09-04-2018, 02:51 AM	#30
jrvariel48 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: New Jersey Posts: 1,425	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations MT puts out a nice set up! I got rid of the old system and now I can stop!!

09-04-2018, 08:15 AM	#31
Steve in Denver Senior Member Join Date: May 2017 Posts: 566	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations Do you still have the Wide 5 wheels? I know that disc all the way around are available for the standard 5 on 5 wheels.

09-04-2018, 02:10 PM	#33
Jack E/NJ Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,173	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations I'm just hoping Flathead Ted will soon release a Lockheed floater kit after he's done testing his prototypes. Jack E/NJ

09-04-2018, 02:50 PM	#34
1931 flamingo Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: new britain,ct 06052 Posts: 9,390	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations Bill: How old are the hoses?? Paul in CT

09-04-2018, 06:46 PM	#36
russcc Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,871	Re: Lockheed brake frustrations If you use the original Lockheed brakes, replace the lining with NOS ones. Fred Wilner at SSO in MN, Nelson Pease, Pease Antique Parts in Palmer MA, and Ray Helgers in RI will likely have the good old linings. Ray's son, Ray III told about a '40 he put new brakes in and it wouldn't stop worth a darn. It wouldn't even lock up the wheels. Ray got a set of NOS ones from his dad's NOS parts, put them in, and it stopped like it should, and locked up the wheels when he got on it hard.