problem with laycock

[foxfire42]

The Laycock was just installed. Tested the solenoid and it worked. All the wiring and switch tested OK. When I took it on a test drive it felt like I was starting out in High gear instead of low. I finally got up to speed and switched it on. There was no noticeable change in RPM's. I switched it off and still no change. I can only conclude that the OD was engaged when I started out even though I had not yet switched it on. Prior to the test drive the solenoid could be heard clicking on and off when it was tested.

I only installed the wiring per a previous post. That's about where my ability ends. Is there any way of taking it out of OD if that's the problem? How can it be engaged with no power to the solenoid?

[Kurt in NJ]

If you dissconnect the wire to solenoid it should go out of OD, if not there is a internal problem, perhaps sticking solenoid or valve, ----power at solenoid
+overdrive, no power at solenoid no overdrive,
Laycock overdrive has a internal pump to make pressure, the solenoid opens a valve, oil pressure pushes piston that moves cone clutch shifting from direct to overdrive

[foxfire42]

I have another solenoid I can try. It sounds like I just might have internal issues.

[daveymc29]

Don't back it up until you solve this. You could very well destroy the unit.

[Y-Blockhead]

Originally Posted by daveymc29

Don't back it up until you solve this. You could very well destroy the unit.

Is that true for the LayLock? I thought that was only for Borg-Warners.

I have a Gear Vendors in my '55 Ranchwagon. The Gear Vendor is basically the same as a LayLock. I have had no problems with reverse.

[Dick M]

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Try putting a ground wire from the OD unit to the frame. It might help.

[foxfire42]

I have not backed it up. When I picked it up from the shop that installed it I noticed it was backed into a stall. If the unit was engaged without power and they backed it up that might be the end of the beginning.

If it was ruined will it still back up or the engine rev but not move?

[Tanglfoot]

You need to replace the O rings in the solenoid especially the ones inside on the piston. Also you must have the correct grade of oil I use 75W90 any heavier and it will not change gear.
Good luck

[Big hammer]

Originally Posted by foxfire42

I have not backed it up. When I picked it up from the shop that installed it I noticed it was backed into a stall. If the unit was engaged without power and they backed it up that might be the end of the beginning.

If it was ruined will it still back up or the engine rev but not move?

Umm .... A shop installed it....what do/did they say about your problem?
If they broke it, they need to fix or replace it!

[foxfire42]

The OD was purchased used not a recent conversion. I've had it for about 5 years stored in the garage. It's possible it was defective when purchased but after all this time I no longer know who it was purchased from. That wouldn't matter anyway as it's a crap shoot buying anything like that used. I doubt the shop did anything wrong. They are pretty conscientious and I've had lots of work done by them.

[California Travieso]

Originally Posted by foxfire42

The OD was purchased used not a recent conversion. I've had it for about 5 years stored in the garage. It's possible it was defective when purchased but after all this time I no longer know who it was purchased from. That wouldn't matter anyway as it's a crap shoot buying anything like that used. I doubt the shop did anything wrong. They are pretty conscientious and I've had lots of work done by them.

Given the unknown status of the overdrive, I would imagine the garage would have bench tested it before putting it in so they could make sure it worked or to make any repairs necessary before putting it in the vehicle.

David Serrano

[daveymc29]

I cannot answer your question on whether the car will move if in reverse, All the literature I have read on these boxed caution to never ever ever back up with it engaged. I have had them on Austen Healey's and a Jaguar and known several folks with them in Volvos. they are all basically the same OD. There are some rollers that will go up a ramp and explode the housing they are contained in. I believe that is the same thing that will transpire if you drive backwards with the Borg Warner unit engaged. You may get lucky and the car just stop, but from all the cautions with the repair manuals and owners manuals I think that is wishful thinking. All of them come with the activating power going through a lock-out switch on the transmission so that electricity to the solenoid is disrupted anytime reverse is engaged. I put a switch on the transmission tower that was disconnecting the power to the solenoid anytime the tranny was in reverse. I drilled and tapped the end of the right rear shift rail housing on the tower and installed the switch there after making sure that was the correct place. Then after installation I tested the continuity through that with and installed a "grain of wheat" light bulb just visible to me that told me anytime I had power to the solenoid as a reminder to no go into reverse if it was lighted, which it never was. I found those OD'd to be very hardy units when I was younger and had them in cars with excess of 150 HP and a much younger and maybe even dumber driver. Never had a problem with them over many thousands of hard miles racing where there was no race.

[Dick Steinkamp]

"Operation when reverse gear is engaged will cause fatal damage to the OD unit internals. "

From this article...

http://www.vclassics.com/archive/laycock.htm

The cars I've owned with a Laycock de Normanville OD all had a lockout switch built into the transmission so that the OD would only engage in specific gears (in my Volvo and Daimler only in 4th. In my MGB in third and fourth). This not only eliminated the problem of accidental engagement in reverse, but also eliminated the potential problem of engagement in the lower gears where torque multiplication could damage the OD unit.

If installed in a Model A, I would rig up some sort of switch or I would certainly forget to disengage the OD when backing up.

[Boston Bruce]

What kind of oil are you using? When you first install the unit and fill it with oil in sometimes takes a few miles for the oil to circulate around and for the OD to engage/disengage consistently. FWIW, I use straight 40 weight oil.

[foxfire42]

Thanks all for the great information and cautions. I know the shop researched the lubricant to put into it. I will verify Tuesday what they used. The shop is primarily a transmission to differential business but have gone into working under the hood because of demand.

[Dick M]

10-30W oil works just fine.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

The most common problem of NO SHIFT, is LOW on oil. Use A.T.F.!!!!!
GOD, everybody is using ALL KINDS OF OIL!!!---Anyone tried EXTRA VIRGIN OLIVE OIL?----LOL
TRUST ME, I know what I'm talking about, sometimes I give good proven advice & NO ONE listens, why do I bother???? I could be NAPPING with the Dog.
Bill W.

[Big hammer]

Bill I listen to you! And I always read what you have to say!

[Mike Peters]

Originally Posted by Big hammer

Bill I listen to you! And I always read what you have to say!

Same here. It's just hard to hear what people are thinking on the internet. If they don't type it out, you don't know. We love ya, Bill.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Originally Posted by Mike Peters

Same here. It's just hard to hear what people are thinking on the internet. If they don't type it out, you don't know. We love ya, Bill.

Mike,
If "everybody" LOVES me, how cum NOBODY comes by? I'm not DANGEROUS & my Dog's FRIENDLY
Anybody have a car problem that we "might" help you with
Bill W.