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Old 01-18-2022, 04:43 AM   #1
woofa.express
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Default Woofa Express looking for help.

Woofa Express needs help.

Woofa.Express, my ,28 ute, has never run perfectly since I had a major service. What turned out to be a service was a partial strip and rebuild. The workshop was a well-known and deservedly respected. The old gentleman principle even did white bearing pours. He had rebuilt the engine in my Tourer and that has run perfectly for years. Well he had sold his workshop at Dookie, Vic, and whilst he was on premises when this was serviced he was not consulted.
Well now the performance has deteriorated. It starts so well, idles well and cruises well but keeps missing and back firing and is jerky when accelerating at any speed. Always.
Fuel consumption less than 10 mpg. Spark plugs black in short time, much blacker than Al Jolson’s dial. Even when mixture is screwed to full lean. Have changed main jet and needle and seat, that’s what I had on hand. Carby doesn’t have venturi.
Have substituted the coil for a known serviceable one. Plugs are modern long reach NPK BP5ES. Done less than 2,000 miles. Do I have the correct ones? I substituted the original plugs by adding a reducer bush. Both supplied by Snyder’s.
I feel exhausted and am asking for help. And in anticipation, thank you.
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Old 01-18-2022, 09:07 AM   #2
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

Loping at idle and stuttering or hesitating during drive? My experience was a leaking intake manifold gasket. Pitched the gland type rings and went with flat gasket and solved problem. May not be your issue but probably worth a look.
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Old 01-18-2022, 09:14 AM   #3
Kurt in NJ
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

No Venturi?, what carburetor?
Checked point gap?
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Old 01-18-2022, 09:18 AM   #4
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

What carburetor are you running? Here is what I would do if it was my car. I would go back to the stock spark plugs. Then I would try a known good carburetor from a friend, or if funds are not a problem, buy one. The low mileage and the black plugs are an indication that the carburetor is running rich or that the plugs are too cold. If the borrowed carburetor solves the problem then I would look at the float level in the original or perhaps a leaky gasket or other reason the carburetor is running rich.

The only other thing I can think of is that the ignition timing is off. Check the point gap and then check the timing. You don't have to change the timing to check it. If it is correct then don't mess with it. Otherwise, try a new condensor. If the condensor is marginal then it can cause missing.
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Old 01-18-2022, 10:42 AM   #5
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

Try substituting the carb from your tourer, if that doesn't help try substituting the spark plugs.
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Old 01-18-2022, 12:53 PM   #6
J Franklin
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

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I was thinking a manifold leak also, but I wouldn't see how getting rid of the manifold rings would help on the intake side unless they weren't installed properly.
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Old 01-18-2022, 01:28 PM   #7
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

Intake was slightly warped. One gland had “smooshed” (technical term) and leaked. She runs out right since.
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Old 01-18-2022, 02:47 PM   #8
J Franklin
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

On my car the gland rings are only on the exhaust manifold.
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Old 01-18-2022, 04:52 PM   #9
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.


1928 Ford Model A Ute - woofa.express
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Old 01-18-2022, 10:32 PM   #10
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

Try a different condenser
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Old 01-18-2022, 11:31 PM   #11
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fullraceflathead View Post
try a different condenser
x 2
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Old 01-19-2022, 01:10 AM   #12
woofa.express
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

Solved or mostly so.

I substituted the plugs in Woofa Express for the plugs in Olive. Well what an improvement. I also took the carby as well but will wait for a cool day to change. That carby was rebuilt some time ago and Olive has always been a superb performer. Whilst it is going much much better now I will have Woofer’s rebuilt. Along with other suggestions you readers have made I will try a new condenser and maybe a new coil aswell.
The non performing plugs were purchased from Snyders and I never believed I needed to research them. (The plugs that is not Snyders). They simply didn’t perform. NPK BP5ES. The picture below is not the same specs but are the same concept. Long reach with reducing bush to accommodate the smaller diameter of the plug.
I am well aware there is considerable expertise amongst you all and I thank all of you who have made suggestions.
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File Type: jpg Screen Shot 2022-01-19 at 16.54.53.jpg (6.1 KB, 4 views)
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Old 01-19-2022, 02:15 AM   #13
dave in australia
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

Woofa, I run Champion W20 plugs that are available from REPCO without an issue, although that is down here in chilly Vic. No need for adaptors etc.
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Old 01-19-2022, 02:43 AM   #14
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

You said the plugs were getting black. Give them a good clean especially deep down inside. Maybe with a few long wires from a wire brush. Unfortunately mechanics no longer have plug cleaning machines to sand blast them. I really like the old two piece plugs that can be separated for cleaning.
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Old 01-19-2022, 08:25 AM   #15
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

Gary.

Some friendly advice.

Before changing or rebuilding parts, look at how the car is driven.

If you have a good running carburetor which starts fouling plugs DO NOT start changing parts.

If you take it apart be sure to put parts back in proper place.

All Model As that I have driven over the years will foul plugs if idled alot and driven for many SHORT trips where engine never gets warmed up.

Extended idling and short trips will quickly foul plugs. These exact same plugs will work just fine if I extend the drive time and add some more driving at 45 to 55 MPH when plugs start to foul.

As an example I now use Champion W18s and drive the car for many short trips in town usually.

These plugs will foul if I never go over 30 MPH and idle the engine alot ( 15 20 minutes at a time). The plugs get black on the white insulator inside the plug.

Carbon on the steel outer rim of plug is not a problem as long as insulator is tan colored.
Again Idling will change the plug reading.

I drive the car on a very similar route every time in a ten or twelve mile circle with ten or 15 minutes of idling at the start then ten miles of 35 MPH with 2 miles in the middle at 55 MPH. I might drive the same route several times a day ... sometimes just once.

Some days there is more idling that other days. These are days when plugs are more likely to foul. If I leave out the 2 miles of 45 to 50 it is more likely plugs will foul.

If I make several trips that day with out the two miles of 45 to 50 the plugs might foul.

If I make 2 or 3 trips including the 45 o 50, one right after the other, that day the plugs will run very clean.

So every once and while I take it on a 10 or 15 mile trip at 45 to 50 trip with no idling.

Another example:

From 1962 until 1970 I drove the car 50 miles round trip 7 days a week for 40,000 miles and plugs never fouled. The plugs always used were Champion C16C later Champion changed number to W16Y. In 1979 W16Y was discontinued.

In 1970 when we moved to town the plugs started to foul.

This is when I figured out that the short trips at slow speeds were fouling the plugs and I added some trips at 45 or 50 MPH every now and then.

Old timers called it "blowing out the carbon."

Now that I AM an oldtimer I can say this!!

Eventually I changed to W18s. But still need to make some runs at 45 to 50 occasionally as mentioned above.

The normal position for the GAV Gas Adjustment Valve is 1/4 turn after warmup. If engine is cold 1 turn or so for startup.

If engine starts and dies and will not stay running try 1 1/2 turns while engine is warming up.


At 20 below ZERO more GAV for longer time may be needed!

If choke is pulled for more than 2 or 3 seconds engine will be flooded!

On UTube I see videos of someone pulling choke when engine is not turning. The choke does not work if engine is not turning.

Last edited by Benson; 01-19-2022 at 09:16 AM.
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Old 01-19-2022, 09:02 AM   #16
nkaminar
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

Spark plugs have different heat ratings. Cold plugs have short insulators that carry the heat away easily. Hot plugs have long insulators that restrict carrying the heat away. As Benson talked about above, hotter plugs are used for an engine that is not driven hard and colder plugs are used for an engine that is driven hard. Having a thermostat helps warm up the engine that is just driven around town and will help to keep the plugs from getting fowled. The NPK BP5ES plugs look like they may be cold plugs and could fowl easily just by looking at the size of the plug and the length of threads.

See https://www.fordgarage.com/pages/bru...kplugnotes.htm
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A is for apple, green as the sky.
Step on the gas, for tomorrow I die.
Forget the brakes, they really don't work.
The clutch always sticks, and starts with a jerk.
My car grows red hair, and flies through the air.
Driving's a blast, a blast from the past.

Last edited by nkaminar; 01-19-2022 at 09:09 AM.
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Old 01-19-2022, 09:27 AM   #17
Benson
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

A person can not depend on standard published heat range tables for the NGK BP5ES in this case because adapters are used.

Using the adapters adds a second "interface" ie additional threads and steel to path for heat to transfer from sparkplug to the cylinder head. This changes the heat range of the NGK BP5ES making it hotter.
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Old 01-19-2022, 09:32 AM   #18
nkaminar
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

True. I like the standard 7/8-inch plugs for the Model A. That is what was used originally and seems to work the best.

I see a notice that Larry Brumfield, who wrote the article mentioned above on spark plugs and heat range has died. When an old man dies a lot of knowledge dies with him.
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A is for apple, green as the sky.
Step on the gas, for tomorrow I die.
Forget the brakes, they really don't work.
The clutch always sticks, and starts with a jerk.
My car grows red hair, and flies through the air.
Driving's a blast, a blast from the past.
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Old 01-19-2022, 09:41 AM   #19
Benson
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nkaminar View Post
True. I like the standard 7/8-inch plugs for the Model A. That is what was used originally and seems to work the best.

I see a notice that Larry Brumfield, who wrote the article mentioned above on spark plugs and heat range has died. When an old man dies a lot of knowledge dies with him.
Yes I posted the information that I got from Ahooga about Larry today on both Ford Barn and the other website.
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Old 01-19-2022, 10:13 AM   #20
Benson
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Default Re: Woofa Express looking for help.

Gary,

About post 15. Nothing that I wrote here is meant to demean any one person.

My hope is to help the new guys and those who might not know this info.
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