"Big Brass Condensors"

[tubman]

I've had a couple of inquiries about how my project to make new "BBC" is coming along. The project has morphed from making a faux case in which to install some old condenser into producing a unit that uses modern technology and materials to produce a unit of superior functionality and reliability. I believe I have succeeded. I am now looking for a couple of more guys out there that can run a couple of my prototypes to make sure they are up to the challenge. What do you guys think?

[JSeery]

Looks nice, that's for sure.

[Fordors]

Very impressive! Any info on expected price?

[tubman]

Originally Posted by Fordors

Very impressive! Any info on expected price?

I'm looking to be in then $60 range. The way I'm doing it requires a whole bunch of hand labor. I want to stress that the objective here is to produce a unit that is more functional and reliable than anything currently available. If it looks nice, is just a coincidence.

[Tim Ayers]

Wow. Awesome. Great job.

[BUBBAS IGNITION]

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Be glad to test a few for ya ......... $60 is fair for a good one.....they need to be .36mfds to work well.....

[tubman]

Bubba,

How do you determine what the capacitance should be? Today, I checked a bunch of condensers I have in my shop, and got two distinct different results. I checked an original Mallory condenser, and it yielded it .377 mfd I then checked a modern condenser that was mounted on a converted SBC distributor I have, and it also read out at .352 mfd. I then tested four NOS '49-'51 I have in my stash, and all four read at .23 mfd. Two of these were NAPA Echlin, and the other two were Bluepoint brand, which I believe was also a quality product. (I have owned these components for at least 10 years). Why the difference? I think it may have to do with the use of dual point and other "ignition enhancements".

In the final analysis, I plan on offering a standard product with a .36 mfd capacitance condenser, and will also offer a companion unit with a .23 mfd condenser. We also plan to offer an option of a customer specified capacitor rating.

Thanks a lot for your help.

Tubman

[scooder]

That's a cool thing Tub, well done.
I'd also like to know what dictates the capacitance needed. Is it the coil? Points? Dwell? Combination of these? Something else?
Thanks,
Martin.

[petehoovie]

Is it vehicle specific? What application?....

[tubman]

When I was in high school in the '50's, I went to the "Big Wheel" speed shop on Lake Street in Minneapolis and bought a Mallory dual point conversion kit for my '51 Ford. This kit (which installed in the stock "Loadamatic" distributor) included a Mallory BBC that looked just like the the one I have now. Since the only change was dual points (I used the original coil, plugs and wires), the only conclusion I can come to is that the Mallory engineers figured out that the increased dwell required increased capacitence. Thus, I plan on offering .23 mfd units for single point distributors and .33 mfd units for dual point distributors. (.36 mfd are not available at the current time in a configuration I need.)

I would welcome any insight anyone can provide on this subject.

[flatheadmurre]

The ignition system is a LC circuit and can be calculated....or you hook it up to a scope and se when the ringing is kept in place the best.

Formula for calculating: f = 1 / (2*pi*(L * C)^0.5)

It´s as usual a compromise and you can´t have it be perfect at any rpm...

Checking metal migration between points will tell you if the cap value is ok to...evenly worn points with no metal buildup is what you want.

Metal buildup on positive or negative side of points indicate wrong cap value.

[tubman]

Mauritz,

That's good information and I will share it with my electronics guy (he has a scope and everything else one might need to check these things out). However, this is all beyond me. Tell me, what do you think about my theory of .23 mfd for single points and .36 mfd for dual points? Does that fit in with your thinking?

What do "L" and "C" represent in your equation?

Denny

[JSeery]

Originally Posted by flatheadmurre

The ignition system is a LC circuit and can be calculated....or you hook it up to a scope and se when the ringing is kept in place the best.

Formula for calculating: f = 1 / (2*pi*(L * C)^0.5)

I notice that the LC circuit is the part of the ignition system that is seldom if ever mentioned when discussing coils, points, condensers, ballast resistors, etc.

[flatheadmurre]

Denny it´s inductance of coil and capacitance of circuit.

It´s difficult to calculate it since all part of the circuit has values...even the wires and resistors....so it´s a start and then a scope is your friend when dealing with oscillation circuits.

[tubman]

Originally Posted by flatheadmurre

Denny it´s inductance of coil and capacitance of circuit.

It´s difficult to calculate it since all part of the circuit has values...even the wires and resistors....so it´s a start and then a scope is your friend when dealing with oscillation circuits.

Mauritz,

Do you have an opinion on dual points needing more capacitance than single points? All three dual point setups I have use .36 mfd condensers, while all single point (stock Ford) condensers I have are .23 mfd. I'm kind of a neophyte at this stuff, so It'd be nice to have the Ford and Mallory engineers to have done the design work for me.

Denny

[petehoovie]

@tubman - Do you recall the The Big Wheel Auto Stores A/Gas Dragster - 'The Big Wheel'? It once held the record for the fastest ET gas dragster. I remember watching it take on the fastest (at the time) Top Fuel Dragster - 'The Pandemonium' up at Minnesota Dragways in St. Cloud back in 1960. Needless to say, the 'Big Wheel' lost all three runs. Big Wheel Auto Stores were my parts stores of choice back then....

http://www.standard1320.com/BigYohns/BigYohns.html

[tubman]

Originally Posted by petehoovie

@tubman - Do you recall the The Big Wheel Auto Stores A/Gas Dragster - 'The Big Wheel'? It once held the record for the fastest ET gas dragster. I remember watching it take on the fastest (at the time) Top Fuel Dragster - 'The Pandemonium' up at Minnesota Dragways in St. Cloud back in 1960. Needless to say, the 'Big Wheel' lost all three runs. Big Wheel Auto Stores were my parts stores of choice back then....

http://www.standard1320.com/BigYohns/BigYohns.html

You bet. I remember it was driven by a guy named Bruce Norman ("Stormin' Norman" to his fans). A friend and I ran a '36 coupe with a '42 Merc engine in "D/Altered" back in those days, so I was there almost every Sunday. I was a great disappointment when the NHRA banned fuel. I remember the run between "Pandemoneum" owned by a guy name Bobby Langley (I think he was out of Texas). Those were the days. We ran a class record of 16.44 back then. I lived in Plymouth then (west suburbs) and went to Wayzata schools. "Champion Auto" on west Lake was our first stop on our way to town, but "Big Wheel" had all the good stuff.

(Edit " Sorry, bad memory; Bobby Langley ran the Scorpion" dragster (I saw it on my last visit to Garlit's museum). I think "Pandemonium" was out of Chicago. I do remember borrowing a torque wrench from Chris Karamesenes after we put a used set of Edelbrock heads on the '36 (we were so poor we didn't have one) He was a great guy, and I remember seeing he was still running Top Fuel several years ago when he was over 80!

Ahhh, the good old days. Were you from the Twin Cities are back then?

[petehoovie]

My all time favorite from back then - 'The SCAG' - It had a sound unique unto itself....

[tubman]

Yep, I remember that car very well. Sadly, Bob McGinley who owned and ran that car passed a couple of years ago. While we're at it, do you remember the "Continental Beacon" that ran "B/Gas" back in those days. It was unbeatable as I remember.

The "Big Yohns" posts are a treasure. He was the official photographer at Minnesota Dragways back in those days. I contacted him several years ago to see if he had any pictures of our "D/Altered" we ran back then. Sadly, he didn't have anything.

[petehoovie]

"Continental Beacon" that ran "B/Gas" back in those days" - No, I can't say I remember it....But that doesn't mean I didn't see it....

[petehoovie]

Excellent read > You'll have to blow this up to read it....

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