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Old 03-23-2018, 06:38 PM   #21
modelAsteve
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

Go with what ever is on sale!
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Old 03-23-2018, 07:00 PM   #22
Jeff/Illinois
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

I use ZDDP in the '69 Mach 1, because it has a high performance engine.

I don't worry about that in the Model A or the '36 Ford we own with a flattie.
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Old 03-23-2018, 07:07 PM   #23
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

The main reason for using diesel oil, at least as told by oil engineers, is the higher level of additives to protect the engine from bad chemicals that form. The A is more likely to develop more bad chemicals because of storage and the lack of active crankcase ventilation. In storage you get moisture condensing on the metal which can then go into the oil and make up acids.

This all also goes back to my assertion that most guys change their oil too often at more financial cost and more detriment to the environment. So by using oils with additives you can safely leave the oil in the car for years or thousand miles with no worry. Plus I have never heard of an engine going bad because someone went too long between changes. Quite frankly if you A engine fails it is because something was not built right (with the rare exception to the guys putting thousands of miles a year on their cars).

Oh ya I like facts.
http://www.machinerylubrication.com/...l-engine-oils-
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Old 03-23-2018, 10:16 PM   #24
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

Diesel grade engine oils entrain particulate matter better,and have a higher shear and load factor than gasoline grade oils.The higher shear and load factor is way more important for flat tappet engine than the zinc in my opinion,even though diesel grade engine oils have a reasonably high zinc factor already (except for the latest CARB tier 4 engine spec).A higher load factor and better particulate suspension (entrainment,the oils ability to keep debris in suspension instead of depositing it) aids in protecting main bearings.A higher shear factor means the oil is less likely to be pushed off the surface during contact,like tappets.Diesel grade oil has superior detergent factors too,which greatly reduce sludge buildup.

in the end its like ice cream,as long as you have some when you want it the flavor isnt important...
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Old 03-24-2018, 05:16 AM   #25
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

Rail, that is not true.

If I cant get my vanilla or coffee then ice cream is just not the same!
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Old 03-24-2018, 08:03 AM   #26
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

I HAVE seen engines destroyed by NOT changing oil, just adding when it gets LOW. The oil gets contaminated with WATER/ACIDS/GASOLINE/CARBON/ETC!
OHV-V-8s would plug up the drain back holes in the heads, fill the valve covers, suck oil through the valve guides & starve the lower end!!!
Some would NOT change the oil, just change the filter & add a quart. One guy bragged about going 100,000 MILES, on 3 oil changes!!(COMPLETE IDIOT!)
Some cars with hydraulic lifters will tell you your oil needs changing, by their lifters ticking slightly, on a cold start. If you run your oil TOO LONG, it will start to consume MORE oil than usual!
Schools should have a MANDATORY Class, in COMMON SENSE REASONING!
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Old 03-25-2018, 02:44 PM   #27
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

OK so are we done here? Obviously not because while there are articles disparaging the use of diesel oil (Rotella 15-40) for reasons stated there has been no evidence of engine damage from it's use to substantiate those claims. Surely you would think that with all Model A owners using this product someone would have come forward to claim engine damage resulting from the use of diesel oil. Don't misunderstand my rant, I respect science, research and people who are knowledgeable in the oil product disciplines. I just don't see any proof about their conclusions regarding diesel oil use in the Model a Ford at this time.
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Old 03-25-2018, 07:21 PM   #28
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

Quote:
Originally Posted by Railcarmover View Post
Diesel grade engine oils entrain particulate matter better .....A higher load factor and better particulate suspension (entrainment,the oils ability to keep debris in suspension instead of depositing it) aids in protecting main bearings. ... Diesel grade oil has superior detergent factors too,which greatly reduce sludge buildup.
>>aids in protecting main bearings

If you have a filter.
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Old 03-25-2018, 09:39 PM   #29
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

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>>aids in protecting main bearings

If you have a filter.
Higher load factor and entrainment..it keeps debris in suspension,instead of depositing them on bearings and the like,the higher load factor stands the pounding just a little bit better..how much? who the hell knows..full flow filtration is the way to go,no matter what oil you use.
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Old 03-25-2018, 10:03 PM   #30
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

I always use some 'Lucas' in with my oil. Great for cold starting Babbitt bearings. Also use a little Marvel Mystery Oil in the gas a well.
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Old 03-25-2018, 10:30 PM   #31
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

The following article by Mr. Andy Weideman of the Rocky Mountain Model A Club should be of interest to readers of this thread. He recommends against using diesel oil suggests the use of synthetic oil. Read why here :

http://rmaford.org/wp-content/blogs....C_Mar_2012.pdf
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Old 03-25-2018, 10:52 PM   #32
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

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The following article by Mr. Andy Weideman of the Rocky Mountain Model A Club should be of interest to readers of this thread. He recommends against using diesel oil suggests the use of synthetic oil. Read why here :

http://rmaford.org/wp-content/blogs....C_Mar_2012.pdf
This paper is 6 years old; out of date and full of factual errors.

YMMV.

.
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Old 03-26-2018, 08:01 AM   #33
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

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Originally Posted by BILL WILLIAMSON View Post
Did everyone hear the suggestion they WANTED to hear?--LOL
Bill Laffin'
Bill I love these kinds of posts to see why everybody does something different and the original question goes unanswered... lol
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Old 03-26-2018, 10:31 AM   #34
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

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Originally Posted by Jim/TX/GA View Post
This paper is 6 years old; out of date and full of factual errors.

YMMV.

.
"Curious minds want to know!":

In the interest of contributing to our knowledge, can you (1) update those out-of-date items and (2) point out and correct those factual errors?

Thanks!
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Old 03-26-2018, 11:33 AM   #35
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

Boy did this confuse the heck out of me!!!
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Old 03-26-2018, 12:39 PM   #36
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

All anyone needs to do is call the Shell Helps Line and find out what Shell says about their Rotella T 15w40 being used in a antique gas engine. 1-800-661-1771.
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Old 03-26-2018, 07:10 PM   #37
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

Quote:
Originally Posted by BILL WILLIAMSON View Post
I HAVE seen engines destroyed by NOT changing oil, just adding when it gets LOW. The oil gets contaminated with WATER/ACIDS/GASOLINE/CARBON/ETC!
OHV-V-8s would plug up the drain back holes in the heads, fill the valve covers, suck oil through the valve guides & starve the lower end!!!
Some would NOT change the oil, just change the filter & add a quart. One guy bragged about going 100,000 MILES, on 3 oil changes!!(COMPLETE IDIOT!)
Some cars with hydraulic lifters will tell you your oil needs changing, by their lifters ticking slightly, on a cold start. If you run your oil TOO LONG, it will start to consume MORE oil than usual!
Schools should have a MANDATORY Class, in COMMON SENSE REASONING!
Bill W.
Bill a local farmer that always bought a new full sized Ford or Mercury, was too tight to spring for an oil change all he would do was add oil until about 50,000 miles then trade it in. Problem came when word got around and nobody wanted his cars and the local dealers would run him off, they didn't want them either. And the guy was worth millions, he wasn't broke
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Old 03-26-2018, 08:21 PM   #38
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

One issue I found with the article is omission of the API shear factor information,the oils ability to resist shear is what protects cylinder walls,not some hoo hah about oil burning..Shear is a measurement of the oils ability to lubricate in thin film high load applications,Like diesel engine cylinder walls and flat tappet engines..ZDDP comments are the talk of snake oil salesmen,the guys who sell the high dollar custom oils, they revel in the zinc issue....ask them to show actual failure directly attributable to a lack of zinc and the bullshit goes into high gear,they like to question your intelligence,how dare you question this well believed bullshit story about flat tappets and zinc and why you have to buy the 30 bucks a quart miracle they hustle..the bullshit detector went off when they cited AMS oil..BTW,they also cite Les Andrews..a fine man,a member of my club and a top notch technical writer,but no petroleum engineer.
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Old 03-26-2018, 08:46 PM   #39
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Wink Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff/Illinois View Post
I use ZDDP in the '69 Mach 1, because it has a high performance engine.

I don't worry about that in the Model A or the '36 Ford we own with a flattie.
[B] Like Jeff, in my '69 Mustang I use an oil containing ZDDP, Castrol Racing Oil. The previous owner of my Vicky used Mobil 1. I personally spoke with his engine rebuild mechanic who said he only recommended that regular Chevron 30w be used.

As that brilliant Cuban Mechanical Engineer, Ricky Ricardo said, "¿Quién sábe?

Bill [\B]
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Old 03-26-2018, 10:43 PM   #40
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Default Re: Model A Times Article About Not Using Diesel Oil

The EPA issue with non-gasoline engine oil is the non-low friction additives. Motorcyclist have had these issues for years. Friction reducing additives are good for high gas mileage, but not so good for oil bath clutch plates.

Rosella for my A? It is a good oil and was on sale, so yes, I pick up a couple gallon jugs.
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