The Ford Barn

WABOOM · 07-15-2018, 03:29 PM

Today I replaced my coil with an Echlin coil. Also found that my + wire for coil was almost completely broken. I replaced the wire all the way to the key. Since I had the coil bracket off I insulated the coil bracket with 1/8 rubber where it meets the head.
The car runs much stronger now and will rev up real good. Last weekend I had what I thought was severe vapor lock and almost didn't make it home on a leisurely Sunday drive. It no longer sputters out at higher rpms. Just wanted to let you guys know I had a good experience with a repair.

1934 · 07-15-2018, 03:51 PM

Very interesting! I've had old flatheads for many years, (a '36 sedan, '34 roadster, and now a '34 4-door). Always had 'vapor lock' issues, especially in parades on hot days! I finally broke down and got Skip Haney to rebuild a coil for me and, suddenly, there is no more of the dreaded vapor lock. Even when its 95 degrees and crazy high humidity I can drive all over the place, shut it off, and start it 5 mins. later- no problem! So now I'm wondering- was it really 'vapor lock', or just a bad coil?? Just sayin'......
Doug.

Ford Freak · 07-15-2018, 04:12 PM

Glad to hear you resolved it ! - F F

Mart · 07-15-2018, 05:58 PM

Does the coil need to be earthed? Not sure.

Glad it is running better, now, though.

They do say 90% of carb problems are probably ignition, and 90% of ignition problems are probably carb.

They also say that 87.5% of statistics are made up.

Mart.

Tinker · 07-15-2018, 08:36 PM

Always good to know what condition your condition is in. Old wire harnesses are always suspect. I like Sacramento ford for replacements. I'm sure there are others that deliver stock looking and wired color coded correct to ford schematics, just whom has delivered to me without issue. Nice stuff.

Geeez that sounds like a sell... but it was just a helpful avenue.

Nobody likes to rewire, but it's a must at some point. Not that hard if your using stock coded harnesses. Some you can make up with the right wire/braiding and tools. and grated it's way cooler to bolt on a blower or something.

...

Tinker · 07-15-2018, 08:42 PM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Mart

Does the coil need to be earthed? Not sure.

Glad it is running better, now, though.

They do say 90% of carb problems are probably ignition, and 90% of ignition problems are probably carb.

They also say that 87.5% of statistics are made up.

Mart.

60% of the time, it works every time

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrckYWFgl4s

19Fordy · 07-15-2018, 09:32 PM

Move you coil off the head with my home made coil bracket support for Ford and Merc engines. Direct bolt -on. I have one left, if interested.

Tinker · 07-15-2018, 10:34 PM

Coil is different isn't for these years? https://www.ebay.com/itm/1941-48-FOR...AAAOSwR2lZ0osL

If it matters. I have a few and I love the look of these years coils. Get yours rebuilt.

WABOOM · 07-15-2018, 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tinker

Coil is different isn't for these years? https://www.ebay.com/itm/1941-48-FOR...AAAOSwR2lZ0osL

If it matters. I have a few and I love the look of these years coils. Get yours rebuilt.

Mine is a '51

Tinker · 07-15-2018, 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WABOOM

Mine is a '51

Then a offset like posted is a decent idea. Good location and a bit off the engine heat.

Have your replaced the wiring yet?

WABOOM · 07-15-2018, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tinker

Then a offset like posted is a decent idea. Good location and a bit off the engine heat.

Have your replaced the wiring yet?

No. All the wing in the car is original, except this hot wire to the coil and probably the battery/starter cables.

Tinker · 07-15-2018, 11:12 PM

First thing on a new car for me is.... Compression then I do is flush the engine block and radiator (recore if needed). Rebuild the coil (skip). Replace the wires with a real stock replacement. Oil change and an mmo blast. Send bubba my dizzy, rebuild the carb (pick it out of a hat), and put some air in the tires along with some non eth gas in the tank. Engine rebuild as needed.

Short list but works okay for me. Ya pretty simple synopsis. But a decent start.

40 Deluxe · 07-15-2018, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WABOOM

Today I replaced my coil with an Echlin coil. Also found that my + wire for coil was almost completely broken. I replaced the wire all the way to the key. Since I had the coil bracket off I insulated the coil bracket with 1/8 rubber where it meets the head.
The car runs much stronger now and will rev up real good. Last weekend I had what I thought was severe vapor lock and almost didn't make it home on a leisurely Sunday drive. It no longer sputters out at higher rpms. Just wanted to let you guys know I had a good experience with a repair.

Question: Why did you insulate the coil bracket? The coil body has to be grounded to complete the circuit. Just try holding the coil in your hand while someone tries to start the engine.
Of course, it will still ground through the mounting bolts.

Tinker · 07-15-2018, 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 40 Deluxe

Question: Why did you insulate the coil bracket? The coil body has to be grounded to complete the circuit. Just try holding the coil in your hand while someone tries to start the engine.
Of course, it will still ground through the mounting bolts.

You sure about that?

WABOOM · 07-15-2018, 11:25 PM

Not only did I insulate the bracket but I also put 1/16 thick rubber all around the coil itself in the bracket. I did this to prevent heat transfer from the head to bracket and from the bracket to the body of coil.
I didn't know it needed to be ground. It must be getting ground right now from the negative wire going to the distributor. It runs great!

51 MERC-CT · 07-16-2018, 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WABOOM

Since I had the coil bracket off I insulated the coil bracket with 1/8 rubber where it meets the head.

Not necessary. Think about it, how did you insulate the bolts from grounding to the bracket?
Everything under the hood including the coil and insulation is going to reach an elevated temperature.
The wrap around the coil does not allow fan air to cool it.

Terry,OH · 07-16-2018, 06:48 AM

Your battery is connected - to ground and + to ignition?
If it is connected + to ground, you should relook at the coil wire connection and reverse. Having the coil connected with proper polarity will allow the coil to give proper high voltage output. Incorrect connection will result decreased output potential.
The coil gets its it ground through the distributor points so the wire to the distributor is the grounded side.
Are your spark plug wires the resistor type? If so you may want to consider the solid wire type without resistance. If you have the original Ford points and not a solid state replacement ignition solid core plug wires will allow longer distributor cap and rotor life and maximum voltage at the plugs.

34PKUP · 07-16-2018, 06:50 AM

Why would you wrap a coil with insulation? When heat is the enemy and you are preventing it from being air cooled?

WABOOM · 07-16-2018, 08:00 AM

The car is 6 volt Positive ground. The way the coil was wired is how I left it. Maybe it is wrong. Right now the - side of coil is going to the base of the distributor. Maybe it is wrong. Thanks for pointing this out.

As far as the rubber goes I was trying to prevent heat from transferring from the head to the coil. I'll take the rubber off if you guys suggest that too.

TJ · 07-16-2018, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 34PKUP

Why would you wrap a coil with insulation? When heat is the enemy and you are preventing it from being air cooled?

Absolutely correct. Coils get hot and you are holding the heat in which can reduce the life of the coil. Also if your Merc has the original wiring, the wiring is 67 years old. It's overdue for new wiring, especially the harness in the engine compartment. The old cloth/rubber insulation is probably ready to start falling off. Wiring that old is a recipe for disaster.

07-15-2018, 03:29 PM	#1
WABOOM Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Minnesota Posts: 347	I didn't have vapor lock Today I replaced my coil with an Echlin coil. Also found that my + wire for coil was almost completely broken. I replaced the wire all the way to the key. Since I had the coil bracket off I insulated the coil bracket with 1/8 rubber where it meets the head. The car runs much stronger now and will rev up real good. Last weekend I had what I thought was severe vapor lock and almost didn't make it home on a leisurely Sunday drive. It no longer sputters out at higher rpms. Just wanted to let you guys know I had a good experience with a repair. Last edited by WABOOM; 07-15-2018 at 09:35 PM.

07-15-2018, 03:51 PM	#2
1934 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Quebec, Canada Posts: 415	Re: I didn't have vapor lock Very interesting! I've had old flatheads for many years, (a '36 sedan, '34 roadster, and now a '34 4-door). Always had 'vapor lock' issues, especially in parades on hot days! I finally broke down and got Skip Haney to rebuild a coil for me and, suddenly, there is no more of the dreaded vapor lock. Even when its 95 degrees and crazy high humidity I can drive all over the place, shut it off, and start it 5 mins. later- no problem! So now I'm wondering- was it really 'vapor lock', or just a bad coil?? Just sayin'...... Doug.

07-15-2018, 04:12 PM	#3
Ford Freak Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Pittsford NY. USA Posts: 1,096	Re: I didn't have vapor lock Glad to hear you resolved it ! - F F

07-15-2018, 05:58 PM	#4
Mart Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Solihull, England. Posts: 8,744	Re: I didn't have vapor lock Does the coil need to be earthed? Not sure. Glad it is running better, now, though. They do say 90% of carb problems are probably ignition, and 90% of ignition problems are probably carb. They also say that 87.5% of statistics are made up. Mart.

07-15-2018, 08:36 PM	#5
Tinker Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: MN Posts: 7,053	Re: I didn't have vapor lock Always good to know what condition your condition is in. Old wire harnesses are always suspect. I like Sacramento ford for replacements. I'm sure there are others that deliver stock looking and wired color coded correct to ford schematics, just whom has delivered to me without issue. Nice stuff. Geeez that sounds like a sell... but it was just a helpful avenue. Nobody likes to rewire, but it's a must at some point. Not that hard if your using stock coded harnesses. Some you can make up with the right wire/braiding and tools. and grated it's way cooler to bolt on a blower or something. ... Last edited by Tinker; 07-15-2018 at 09:17 PM.

07-15-2018, 10:34 PM	#8
Tinker Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: MN Posts: 7,053	Re: I didn't have vapor lock Coil is different isn't for these years? https://www.ebay.com/itm/1941-48-FOR...AAAOSwR2lZ0osL If it matters. I have a few and I love the look of these years coils. Get yours rebuilt.

07-15-2018, 11:12 PM	#12
Tinker Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: MN Posts: 7,053	Re: I didn't have vapor lock First thing on a new car for me is.... Compression then I do is flush the engine block and radiator (recore if needed). Rebuild the coil (skip). Replace the wires with a real stock replacement. Oil change and an mmo blast. Send bubba my dizzy, rebuild the carb (pick it out of a hat), and put some air in the tires along with some non eth gas in the tank. Engine rebuild as needed. Short list but works okay for me. Ya pretty simple synopsis. But a decent start. Last edited by Tinker; 07-15-2018 at 11:36 PM. Reason: compression

07-15-2018, 11:25 PM	#15
WABOOM Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Minnesota Posts: 347	Re: I didn't have vapor lock Not only did I insulate the bracket but I also put 1/16 thick rubber all around the coil itself in the bracket. I did this to prevent heat transfer from the head to bracket and from the bracket to the body of coil. I didn't know it needed to be ground. It must be getting ground right now from the negative wire going to the distributor. It runs great!

07-16-2018, 06:48 AM	#17
Terry,OH Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 4,743	Re: I didn't have vapor lock Your battery is connected - to ground and + to ignition? If it is connected + to ground, you should relook at the coil wire connection and reverse. Having the coil connected with proper polarity will allow the coil to give proper high voltage output. Incorrect connection will result decreased output potential. The coil gets its it ground through the distributor points so the wire to the distributor is the grounded side. Are your spark plug wires the resistor type? If so you may want to consider the solid wire type without resistance. If you have the original Ford points and not a solid state replacement ignition solid core plug wires will allow longer distributor cap and rotor life and maximum voltage at the plugs. Last edited by Terry,OH; 07-16-2018 at 06:57 AM.

07-16-2018, 06:50 AM	#18
34PKUP Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 794	Re: I didn't have vapor lock Why would you wrap a coil with insulation? When heat is the enemy and you are preventing it from being air cooled?

07-16-2018, 08:00 AM	#19
WABOOM Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Minnesota Posts: 347	Re: I didn't have vapor lock The car is 6 volt Positive ground. The way the coil was wired is how I left it. Maybe it is wrong. Right now the - side of coil is going to the base of the distributor. Maybe it is wrong. Thanks for pointing this out. As far as the rubber goes I was trying to prevent heat from transferring from the head to the coil. I'll take the rubber off if you guys suggest that too.