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Old 06-09-2021, 12:36 PM   #1
35 Rat
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Default 302 in a 35

Hello all,
I am putting a 302 in my 1935 5 window coupe rat rod. I have run into a few issues with it fitting in. I know some one out there has done this.. i was looking into getting a rear pan and pick up. any thoughts would be helpful.
Thanks
Andrea
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Old 06-09-2021, 12:46 PM   #2
JSeery
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

This site isn't going to be much help on late model engine installs or rat rods, LOL. The site is dictated to Ford flathead era vehicles with flathead engines. A number of us also like and build hot rods, both flathead and later engines. But, that is not this site. The HAMB does deal with a lot of later engine hot rods, but don't believe the term rat rod will be taken kindly there and there is a cut off on the engine dates. I would suggest a site dictated to later street rod types of modifications. But, someone might jump in here with an answer, who knows.

Now, all that said, I have done similar mods. Are you using the short front pump and pulley set? There is a big difference in overall length. The sets I am familiar with use the reverse direction on the rotation of the water pump. You may have to have an inset to the firewall to clear the rear of the engine. Rear sumps work fine, or like the double hump pans. I am more familiar with the 5.0 stuff than the 302s, but think they will interchange, again, you have to pay attention to the front cover and water pump set up. And it requires a different oil pickup tube/screen.

Last edited by JSeery; 06-09-2021 at 12:56 PM.
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Old 06-09-2021, 01:07 PM   #3
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

This is a ground up build so I can move/ change the fire wall when I go to put it in. I will look into a short front pump and pulley set. Thank you.. I apricate it !
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Old 06-09-2021, 01:15 PM   #4
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

Here is a video that shows the differences. The first part is just advertising BS, but the rest is informative. https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...tail&FORM=VIRE
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Old 06-09-2021, 01:21 PM   #5
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

Welcome to the FordBarn Forums 35 Rat.

Yeah, the site operator laid it out the desired focus here: https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showp...10&postcount=1

Wherever you go for answers, people might want to know:

Is this engine going into a real 1935 frame?

What do you plan to use for rear and suspension, steering, and front suspension?
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Old 06-09-2021, 02:09 PM   #6
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

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Try asking this on the HAMB
Paul in CT
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Old 06-09-2021, 03:30 PM   #7
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1931 flamingo View Post
Try asking this on the HAMB
Paul in CT
This is probably a good idea, but I will warn you DO NOT use the rodent reference over there; if you do, your thread will mysteriously disappear.
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Old 06-09-2021, 06:34 PM   #8
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSeery View Post
This site isn't going to be much help on late model engine installs or rat rods, LOL. The site is dictated to Ford flathead era vehicles with flathead engines. A number of us also like and build hot rods, both flathead and later engines. But, that is not this site. The HAMB does deal with a lot of later engine hot rods, but don't believe the term rat rod will be taken kindly there and there is a cut off on the engine dates. I would suggest a site dictated to later street rod types of modifications. But, someone might jump in here with an answer, who knows.

Now, all that said, I have done similar mods. Are you using the short front pump and pulley set? There is a big difference in overall length. The sets I am familiar with use the reverse direction on the rotation of the water pump. You may have to have an inset to the firewall to clear the rear of the engine. Rear sumps work fine, or like the double hump pans. I am more familiar with the 5.0 stuff than the 302s, but think they will interchange, again, you have to pay attention to the front cover and water pump set up. And it requires a different oil pickup tube/screen.
What's the difference in a 5.0 Ford engine and a 302 Ford engine?
Bill
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Old 06-09-2021, 06:39 PM   #9
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

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Originally Posted by bbrocksr View Post
What's the difference in a 5.0 Ford engine and a 302 Ford engine?
Bill
Just later in time with changes through the years. Different oil pan designs, different dipstick provisions, different front covers, water pumps, etc. As far as I know, most of the parts will mix and match, but I haven't worked on the old 289/302 enough lately to know that for a fact.

OK, dusted some of the cob-webbs out of my brain:

A change in the way the rotation assembly balanced, 28oz vs 50oz, so different front dampers and different flywheels.

Changed the rear seal to a one piece

Roller lifters and different camshaft

Change in the ignition firing order

Serpentine drive on the front

And of course all the ignition, computer control, fuel injection, etc, but a lot of this can be changed around if you pay attention to what your doing.

Last edited by JSeery; 06-09-2021 at 06:51 PM.
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Old 06-09-2021, 07:03 PM   #10
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSeery View Post
Just later in time with changes through the years. Different oil pan designs, different dipstick provisions, different front covers, water pumps, etc. As far as I know, most of the parts will mix and match, but I haven't worked on the old 289/302 enough lately to know that for a fact.

OK, dusted some of the cob-webbs out of my brain:

A change in the way the rotation assembly balanced, 28oz vs 50oz, so different front dampers and different flywheels.

Changed the rear seal to a one piece

Roller lifters and different camshaft

Change in the ignition firing order

Serpentine drive on the front

And of course all the ignition, computer control, fuel injection, etc, but a lot of this can be changed around if you pay attention to what your doing.
Crab or helmet?
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Old 06-09-2021, 07:30 PM   #11
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

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Originally Posted by KiWinUS View Post
Crab or helmet?
Crab, I know everyone loves the helmets, but I prefer the crab.
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Old 06-09-2021, 08:21 PM   #12
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

If it was mine, I'd prolly do a SBC or even a RedRam hemi instead. They both seem specially designed to fit an early Ford better than even a flathead. A SBF seems specially designed to not fit without some serious mutilation. 8^) Jack E/NJ
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Old 06-09-2021, 08:43 PM   #13
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

I would use a 1949 Studebaker Champion engine. Now there is a real rat rod engine. They will go almost 80 mph in stock form if the hill is steep enough.
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Old 06-10-2021, 10:15 AM   #14
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

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I would use a 1949 Studebaker Champion engine. Now there is a real rat rod engine. They will go almost 80 mph in stock form if the hill is steep enough.
Hell Pete . . . might as well go ALL THE WAY with a Buick Straight 8!
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Old 06-10-2021, 01:18 PM   #15
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

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Originally Posted by Bored&Stroked View Post
Hell Pete . . . might as well go ALL THE WAY with a Buick Straight 8!
That would be a good choice, super heavy to help keep the front end down.
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Old 06-11-2021, 10:46 AM   #16
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

SBC weight and size, front to back, is a better choice but number one is a Flathead!
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Old 06-11-2021, 11:34 AM   #17
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

Here are links to a couple threads on the HAMB






https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...-ford.1062725/

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...rewall.491282/

Last edited by deuce lover; 06-11-2021 at 11:40 AM.
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Old 06-11-2021, 03:21 PM   #18
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Default Re: 302 in a 35

Back in 1967 I put a 289 in my 1937 coupe. The engine was mated to the original '37 Ford three speed in the stock location. I also used the standard front sump oil pan. The firewall and front of the oil pan were modified to fit the engine in place. At that time, I did not even consider that there may be a different oil pan configuration that would allow the engine to fit with a little more clearance.

P.S. You may be able to see in my avatar where I have repaired the modification to the dash panel, (aka firewall), back to the original configuration.

Last edited by Zeke3; 06-11-2021 at 03:24 PM. Reason: added PS in memory of Gosfast.
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