Water in your Gas ? - Solutions ?

[DougVieyra]

Bill (post # 20) - congratulations on your good luck. I drive my Model A's daily, so there is no 'gas sitting for prolonged periods' issue with my water-in-gas problem. I live on the Pacific Ocean (well, not actually ON the ocean), in a cool northern climate, so there is no excessive humidity problem. There is only 'water-in-the-gas' problem.

Aside from the possibility of the water doing metal damage further down the road, the water in the gas does not seem to bother the performance of the gas in running my machine.

- Doug Vieyra, Proud owner of TWO 'water manufacturing devices'.

[huddy]

You could go to the local airport and see if they will sell you Avgas. There's definitely no ethanol in it, and it has PLENTY of lead for top end lubrication. 100LL avgas (100 octane "low lead") has way more lead than was in regular car gas. Downside is that it's quite expensive, and way more octane than you need.

Another option is to see if a boat place will sell you marine gas. I believe that's the only source of non-ethanol gas in the PRC.

Fortunately even though I live in the People's Republic of Noo Yawk, I am able to purchase non-ethanol gas (altho it's high test and fairly pricey) which I use in my '30 Coupe. It seems to like it.

Don't discount the "water ethanol removal process" I outlined in post #7. It's simple and really does work. I think you could combine this method with one of those water filtering funnels (see Amazon Funnel) which would catch the water/alcohol mixture.

Good luck.

[TerryH]

As I have said before, even though none of us like it, real problems with crap gas are apparently very selective as to whom it really bothers. It is such a non-problem here in S. Calif., that it is not even a topic a our local club.

[CarlG]

Originally Posted by TerryH

As I have said before, even though none of us like it, real problems with crap gas are apparently very selective as to whom it really bothers. It is such a non-problem here in S. Calif., that it is not even a topic a our local club.

Same here in Alaska.
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Oh, wait, there is no Ethanol in our gasoline!

[DougVieyra]

Doing a Google Search regarding the negitive side-effects of Ethanol in gasoline, I found this report on a Marine forum:
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"For what it's worth, my boat mechanic who is a Merc dealer told me that the ethanol in the gas is what's eating up the rubber gaskets and other parts. He was the one who originally suggested the marine Stabil. "

Methanol and Ethanol -
"Both of these alcohols can be derived from fossil fuels and biomass. Ethanol is produced via fermentation and methanol from synthesis gas. They both have a higher octane rating compared to gasoline and are already being used in many countries. Unfortunately, due to their chemical properties they cannot be transported in existing gas pipelines. Both are very corrosive because Halide ions chemically cause corrosivion to fuel systems, rubber hoses and gaskets, aluminum, and combustion chambers. Therefore, it is illegal to use fuels containing alcohol in aircraft (although at least one model of ethanol-powered aircraft has been developed, the Embraer EMB 202 Ipanema). Ethanol also corrodes figerglass fuel tanks such as used in marine engines. For higher ethanol percentage blends, and 100% ethanol vehicles, engine modifications are required. http://www.digtheheat.com/Biofuel/ethanol.html "

"Gas generators and small engines have some serious problems looming with the influx of ethanol-blended fuel replacing pure gasoline in most gas stations. This influx is unavoidable at the pump - just try to find a gas pump that doesn't have a sticker saying "May Contain Up To 10% Ethanol". October 2010 should bring not only an increase in ethanol from 10 to 15%, but also a phaseout of the remaining exemptions for some kinds of gas stations. It will be ethanol for all."

"Ethanol's tendency to pull water from the air and its tendency to dissolve rubber and plastic parts pose the biggest problems for these kind of engines, especially if you tend to leave the fuel in the machine for long periods of time (like with stand-alone emergency generators that run on gas). The longer the fuel sits, the more water collects, which causes phase seperation of the fuel and leaves you with a tank full of poor-octane gas with a layer of water-alcohol sitting on the bottom of the tank. That's not a good situation for a generation machine that may have to be relied upon to provide emergency or support power at any time."
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There are LOTS more sites on the web that pretty much say the same thing. Facts for us all to ponder. I can get gas without ethanhol at a local petroleum wholesaler here in Eureka - but at a $2.50 premium over the normal price of a gallon of gas. I have not yet tried either the avaition gas approach, or the Marine gas distributor - but I am sure that both will be about the same $2.50 premium over the nomal price for a gallon of gas. Welcome to George Orwells world.

- Doug Vieyra - Eureka, Calif

[Y-Blockhead]

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Interesting that they point out that "both have a higher octane rating compared to gasoline" but neglect to mention that ethanol has LESS BTU's than gasoline so it takes more ethanol to do the same amount of work as gasoline. That's why gas mileage sucks on cars these days.

[Fred S]

[QUOTE=pgerhardt;953732]During College I worked on the flight line at Danbury Airport. Every morning we smeared this paste that changed color in contact with water on the end of a very long dip stick and we had to test the under ground gas storage tanks for water. We had to keep a written log of our findings. Even with all these precautions you would never even get into a plane without first draining some gas out of the bottom of each tank (most planes have at least two) to check for water. I can't imagine they would put ethanol in aviation gas.[/QUOTE

I got my private pilot's license in 1965, long before we had corn gas, and I also doubt if any is in aviation fuel now. It was customary on landing to have the tanks topped off, to eliminate as much air space as possible, which could turn into condensation on the fuel tank walls, especially overnight when the temperature would drop. Back then, we also drained gas out of the bottom of each tank, to eliminate any possible water, before taking off.

[Russell in Tulsa]

Doug, Have you thought about using a drip leg under the gas shut off valve under the dash? Don't remember who posted the device but it would trap any water and rust as it leaves the tank I believe. Would need to be emptied as described for the airplane situation mentioned above.
Just my thought, not a guarantee.

[CarlG]

How about using one of these?

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

If your car sits a long time, with corn gas, "maybe" a good idea to rock the car, before starting, to slosh the gas around & MIX IT UP? I Like the iron sediment bowl, with the water drain cock on the bottom. I drove Minerva 400 to 500 miles a month with corn gas, BUT never had water in the sediment bowl. "MAYBE" just the LUCK of the PAWNEE?
Bill W.

[Tim B.]

I suspect some of the problem is with the contents of the tank at the station you are buying gas from. I don't see any sounding rods at any of the new stations or cashiers checking tank levels for water.

When I worked pumping gas in High School (a long, long time ago) I had to check the storage tank for gas and water level every day. Not just to see how much gas but also how much water was in the gas (especially after there was a delivery). I had to coat the rod with some stuff that turned color when exposed to water and would show the water level. When it got to a certain level the liquid on the bottom of the tank got pumped out. Some loads we got had a crap load of water especially when they were drawing off the bottom of the supply tank at the tank yard. That's how they got rid of their water.

[Ford_Freddie]

Maybe it would help to add some smokefree two stroke engine oil to the gas. It is very anticorrosive. Furthermore I ask myself if it could be a lubricant for the throttle shaft.

[rocket1]

I use a half a quart of diesel fuel per 10 gallons of gas in the tank it helps combat the ethanol's corroding properties.

[ian Simpson]

Originally Posted by TerryH

As I have said before, even though none of us like it, real problems with crap gas are apparently very selective as to whom it really bothers. It is such a non-problem here in S. Calif., that it is not even a topic a our local club.

My experience is that the problems with ethanol related gas depend very much on the refinery/supply chain from which it comes. Locally we had ethanol laced gas from one supplier back in the 70's, our 1979 Volvo would not run reliably if I used it.

Similarly, both our 1975 MG and our 1928 Ford would not run well on one particular national brand of gas purchased at our closest gas station. Therefore, I would fill them with non-ethanol fuel from a local refinery and all was well. However, that refinery has been shut down with some maintenance problems for the last several weeks, and I was forced to use another brand of fuel. Despite my initial reservations, I have found no problems with this brand, both cars run as they did with the non-ethanol gas.

Moral of my story? If your car does not run well on ethanol corrupted gas, try another brand.

[Alaska Jim]

If it is really water from the ethanol in your gas, it is called Phase -separation it happens mostly from fuel that is in a vehicle (or fuel storage tank at gas stations ) for extended periods of time. this water will not re-suspend itself with any additives and the tank will have to be drained cleaned. good thing that it is easy on a model A. the use of fuel stabilizers and or marvel mystery oil or seafoam does help prevent this. when I store my vehicles over the winter, I completely fill the tank and add the appropriate amount of stabile fuel stabilizer. you can also use the marine version of the stabile product. it supposedly has a bit more "stuff" in it than the regular automotive application. the best is to try to find a station where there is no ethanol blend these stations exist in many parts of most states ( maybe not Calif. ) the cost is a little more.