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Old 05-03-2021, 11:13 AM   #1
JKY
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Default Transmission bearings

I replaced the 7118 and 7121 bearings in my transmission with the current production bearings from a major parts supplier. They were the Chinese bearings. 1,200 miles later they failed. Looking for a source to get good bearings that will last. Any help will be appreciated.

Thanks!
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Old 05-03-2021, 11:14 AM   #2
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

Brattons
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Old 05-03-2021, 11:26 AM   #3
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

As far as I know, the only thing available from most of the suppliers are still the junk bearings. However, a couple of months ago I purchased the 7121 bearings from, of all places, MAC's and they were the good 7121 bearings. I have no idea if they still have them but they might. The shorter bearing is hard to find, but you might call Steve Becker at Bert's Model A in Denver. He might even have some good used ones which are far preferable to the junk currently available.
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Old 05-03-2021, 11:53 AM   #4
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Jones View Post
As far as I know, the only thing available from most of the suppliers are still the junk bearings. However, a couple of months ago I purchased the 7121 bearings from, of all places, MAC's and they were the good 7121 bearings. I have no idea if they still have them but they might. The shorter bearing is hard to find, but you might call Steve Becker at Bert's Model A in Denver. He might even have some good used ones which are far preferable to the junk currently available.
I know Bert's had a limited supply of both bearings a couple of months ago. Not the same as listed in their catalog so ask for the "good ones" when you call Steve.

Last edited by Y-Blockhead; 05-04-2021 at 10:59 AM.
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Old 05-03-2021, 12:18 PM   #5
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

Many of the suppliers were not even aware a switch was made. Those that are aware say that is all that is available. This is probably the greatest dis-service ever done to the Model A kingdom. It is not a question of they may fail, they will fail. I don't think anyone is making a quality bearing. See the attached.

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File Type: pdf Trans Roller Bearings-rev-Z.pdf (160.8 KB, 164 views)
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Old 05-03-2021, 03:18 PM   #6
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Thanks Tom, I saw this last year and couldn't find the good bearings so I got and installed what I could find. This is the result. Touring season and the touring car is down.

I'm hunting for cross numbers for these and not having a lot of success.
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Old 05-03-2021, 03:46 PM   #7
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

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Originally Posted by JKY View Post
I replaced the 7118 and 7121 bearings in my transmission with the current production bearings from a major parts supplier. They were the Chinese bearings. 1,200 miles later they failed. Looking for a source to get good bearings that will last. Any help will be appreciated.

Thanks!
I put the same off shore bearings in about 1,000 miles ago. What is the first sign that they are failing ? Feel like my cherished time machine has become a time bomb.
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Old 05-03-2021, 03:47 PM   #8
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

I'd be willing to take a crack at ID'ing substitute possibilities if someone can post the specs.
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Old 05-03-2021, 05:01 PM   #9
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

Mullet,
It was noise in the tranny. Came in all of a sudden. Rattled it home and into the shop. Pulling it tomorrow night (I hope).
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Old 05-03-2021, 05:16 PM   #10
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

Thanks for all this info on the trans bearings. I was going to rebuild my spare transmission
this coming month. I will see if I can cross these numbers for good bearings.
Thanks again, John
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Old 05-03-2021, 05:58 PM   #11
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

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Mullet,
It was noise in the tranny. Came in all of a sudden. Rattled it home and into the shop. Pulling it tomorrow night (I hope).
Thanks for the come back. Please share details and photos of the post mortem.
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Old 05-04-2021, 09:41 AM   #12
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

A 1947 cross reference I have says the RA-135 Bower is the same as B7118 along with 99026 Hyatt, the B7121 is RA-136 Bower and 99028 Hyatt. Us V8 guys are having the same problem! I'm putting together two transmissions and using nice used bearings even though it goes against everything I learned over the years! Hope this helps, Dale.

Last edited by deuce5wndw; 05-04-2021 at 09:54 AM.
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Old 05-04-2021, 09:42 AM   #13
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

A 1947 cross reference I have says the RA-135 Bower is the same as B7118 along with 99026 Hyatt, the B7121 is RA-136 Bower and 99028 Hyatt. Us V8 guys are having the same problem! I'm putting together two transmissions and using nice used bearings even though it goes against everything I learned over the years! Hope this helps, Dale.
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Old 05-04-2021, 11:02 AM   #14
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

Try Van Pelt or Michael at 3rd Gen Auto.
Paul in CT
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Old 05-04-2021, 11:43 AM   #15
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

Quote:
Originally Posted by jayvee34 View Post
Thanks for all this info on the trans bearings. I was going to rebuild my spare transmission
this coming month. I will see if I can cross these numbers for good bearings.
Thanks again, John
Please let me know what you find. I'm having difficulty getting some that are American made.
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Old 05-04-2021, 07:48 PM   #16
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

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Originally Posted by 1931 flamingo View Post
Try Van Pelt or Michael at 3rd Gen Auto.
Paul in CT
I think the ones at 3rd Gen are the same as the others, unless he has some old stock somewhere.
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Old 05-04-2021, 09:40 PM   #17
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

Quote:
Originally Posted by deuce5wndw View Post
A 1947 cross reference I have says the RA-135 Bower is the same as B7118 along with 99026 Hyatt, the B7121 is RA-136 Bower and 99028 Hyatt. Us V8 guys are having the same problem! I'm putting together two transmissions and using nice used bearings even though it goes against everything I learned over the years! Hope this helps, Dale.
JKY, I am going with the Bower bearings listed above by deuce5wndw. I am familiar with the Bower Bearings, I have used them when I rebuilt several
8" & 9" rear ends. They have always been quality bearings.

Thanks, John

Hope they have not moved off shore!!
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Old 05-04-2021, 09:50 PM   #18
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

There was another post awhile back that listed some different interchange numbers:
https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showp...7&postcount=14

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrelliott View Post
The main shaft bearing #A7065 is 1-114119 SKF, 1 Side sealed 208SZ SKF and 1306 Federal. Counter shaft bearing short and Main drive gear bearing A7118-A is 24780 Timken, F93324 SKF, J24-1256 RHC, 93328 Hyatt, and J-24-1248 BCA Federal Mogal. Counter Shaft bearing long #A7121 is 94216 Hyatt, J201632 Bowers and J-24-1256 BCA Federal Mogal. Transmission Main Drive Gear Bearing #A7025 is 306P Timken, 1-114118 SKF, 1 side seald 306SZ SKF and 3208 ND
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Old 05-04-2021, 09:56 PM   #19
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Default Re: Transmission bearings


Model A Ford Transmission Roller Bearings
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Old 05-04-2021, 10:26 PM   #20
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

This site lists a ton of cross-references for A7118:
https://www.yoyopart.com/oem/1136319...ml#interchange

And for A7121:
http://www.kakapart.com/oem/partscro...r-j241256.html

Maybe one of these is available.

Here's a vendor selling a part that interchanges with A7118:
https://wellertruck.com/inventory/pa...earing/bearing

Here's someone on eBay selling 2 units that interchange with A7121:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/BCA-Bower-J...-/233596345459

Last edited by alexiskai; 05-04-2021 at 10:41 PM.
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Old 05-05-2021, 12:41 AM   #21
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

We can (OldcarBearings) here in Australia supply quality bearings for these transmissions either in Jap/euro/uk/usa brands check our website: www.aabearings.com.au
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Old 05-05-2021, 11:10 AM   #22
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

I happen to speak with Don Snyder yesterday and he said they have new corrected bearings so it hopefully availability isn’t a problem albeit bad ones are out there.

Check them to make sure. If you have defectives from them they will happily exchange them.
Despite a few issues now and then on parts we are fortunate to have the excellent vendors to us as in Snyder’s, Brattons , Berts, etc. Thanks to all of them for their hard work and tireless efforts to give us parts for the Model A’s .
Imagine if we didn’t have them?

Larry Shepard
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Old 05-05-2021, 11:20 AM   #23
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

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Despite a few issues now and then on parts we are fortunate to have the excellent vendors to us as in Snyder’s, Brattons , Berts, etc. Thanks to all of them for their hard work and tireless efforts to give us parts for the Model A’s .
Imagine if we didn’t have them?

Larry Shepard
I imagine there would be a lot more "Parts Cars"...
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Old 05-05-2021, 12:29 PM   #24
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

I hope that Snyders has found good bearings. (Yes I am thankful for them and Bert's, Brattons, et al). Let's see what Tom Endy thinks about them-hopefully he can evaluate them at some point.
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Old 05-05-2021, 03:01 PM   #25
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

These came from a different vendor and, to be fair, he told me what they were when I bought them. I took a chance and lost. Can't blame the vendor. I have some that are from Europe that the vendor, Model A Medic, says they use without any issues. I'm trying two pair from him. Be here Monday.
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Old 05-06-2021, 01:50 PM   #26
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

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The suggestion seems to be that all the primary vendors are knowingly selling bearings which will fail in 2,000 miles or so. This would probably qualify for serious legal action. There is no "be advised this bearing will fail" note in any of the vendor web sites. At this time there is no standard approved route to go if doing a quality rebuild on your trans. This really needs to be resolved.
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Old 05-12-2021, 12:25 AM   #27
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

According to my BOWER suppliers here in "Oz" BOWER have long since stopped manufac turing wound journal roller bearings B7118 (BOWER J24-1248) &B7121 (BOWER J24-1256) As have HYATT &RBC ALL we can source both here in Australia &overseas from bearing companies is KOBE which's chinese &both extremely poor quality (i.e. hardness of metal)&rollers are undersized , i was recently quoted by 2x different bearing suppliers one quoted in Berliss brand &would retail here for $92.40 each (B7118) & $169.40 EACH respectively (prices quoted are in AUD), i'd strongly advise/suggest to either buy them from/off Ebay or try United Bearing Company Texas.
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Old 05-12-2021, 11:51 AM   #28
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

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Originally Posted by Oldcarbearings View Post
According to my BOWER suppliers here in "Oz" BOWER have long since stopped manufac turing wound journal roller bearings B7118 (BOWER J24-1248) &B7121 (BOWER J24-1256) As have HYATT &RBC ALL we can source both here in Australia &overseas from bearing companies is KOBE which's chinese &both extremely poor quality (i.e. hardness of metal)&rollers are undersized , i was recently quoted by 2x different bearing suppliers one quoted in Berliss brand &would retail here for $92.40 each (B7118) & $169.40 EACH respectively (prices quoted are in AUD), i'd strongly advise/suggest to either buy them from/off Ebay or try United Bearing Company Texas.
Berliss is the brand that Most US parts vendors have been suppling and having issues with.
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Old 05-16-2021, 01:51 PM   #29
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

I have been looking into getting a Mitchell Synchro transmission and I got to thinking, #1 Does the Mitchell transmission use these same bearings and #2 have any members had issues with the Mitchell transmission due to these bearings?

BTW I just opened bearing from Snyder's and it is one of the ones you don't want. Part #A-7121
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Old 05-16-2021, 03:27 PM   #30
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

Attached article shows a disassembled transmission roller bearing. I don't believe any supplier has the old style quality bearings. Those that think they do are not aware they have been switched without their knowledge. Best bet is to look for used roller bearings in junk boxes at swap meet. The last few transmissions I overhauled that is what I used.

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File Type: pdf Defective Transmission Roller Bearing Design.pdf (107.2 KB, 72 views)
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Old 05-16-2021, 04:51 PM   #31
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

These bearings are used in v8s up to 42,maybe more. Ford # b 7118 A and
B 1721 A. Acording to the Ford parts manual. (28-42)I have found NOS ones from a V8 parts seller. As Tom said find used ones. I have found most do not go bad.

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Old 05-16-2021, 04:52 PM   #32
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Thanks Tom for posting that article. Yes, that is the same bearing as I have from Snyder's.
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Old 05-16-2021, 09:25 PM   #33
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The postage here from Australia to US is favourable,
ONLY problem is our costing from suppliers from overseas on both B7118&B7121,
We just can't compete with both EBAY Motors&vendors,
BUT BUYER Beware!!!!!.IF The cost/price is too cheap it'll be because more thank likely both B7118&B7121 are KOBE chinese made UNLESS they're N.O.S. Blatzer/Berliss/Bower/Ford/Hyatt/RBC.
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Old 05-23-2021, 09:31 PM   #34
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

I've been in NOS / surplus bearings for years, and was a third generation Ford worker. Ford primarily sourced bearings from Bower, they were local in Detroit. Most of the OLD Ford boxed bearings I have are Bower. There were some made with just the Ford script, I saved one from years ago.

Regarding Hyatt: Be careful, NDH Hyatt was shut down in 1986 except for the Sandusky plant that continued to bid OEM and government contracts, and the Clark plant, that was bought out by the employees, but failed within a few years. The Hyatt name (only) was bought by General bearing in 2013, and various Russian and Chinese bearings have been produced with the Hyatt name. General bearing has since been bought by SKF. Do not take this as an indication of quality.... just a demand for low cost, low quality bearings!

NDH Hyatt bearings were made in the USA or Canada, were stamped with the part numbers (in some cases marked with an electric pencil because the stamping equipment was getting worn out), and newer ones had the GM logo on the box. Older boxes said Delco Hyatt.

If it just says Hyatt and it's in a new box, it's an import. While there are still some NDH's in bulk packs that the boxes look like new, there aren't a lot. Mostly the very small ball bearings.

I do have a very limited stock of NOS Hyatt design bearings for these transmissions, as well as other NOS bearings. Patriot Bearing Supply - Cleveland.
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Old 05-24-2021, 08:27 PM   #35
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

Nothing like junk parts, in a not-so-easy accessible place like a tranny on a Model A Ford

Thanks 'friends' overseas. Takes the fun out of fooling with old cars.

Ought to make them replace these parts.
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Old 05-24-2021, 08:32 PM   #36
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Interesting history lesson about/regarding BOWER/FORD&HYATT,
The Bower journal wound roller bearings USED to be made in Mexico then China.Problem was the lack of hardness quality used by the chinese the metal was SO soft you could run a file across it.I/we've been in N.O.S./Surplus bearings here in 1st Nunawading Melbourne, Victoria, Australia for 48 yrs &now for 2 yrs in North Warrandyte Melbourne, Victoria Australia, Mr Roboto WHO did FORD use primarily/source there felt washer& oil seals from?.
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Old 05-24-2021, 08:33 PM   #37
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Further to my post the imports are KOBE chinese made .
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Old 05-25-2021, 04:59 PM   #38
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

Getting bearings anywhere is a gamble. Most I see on ebay are not boxed so we don't know. I can only assume the "new" bearings are the chinese trash. I'm still pulling that tranny slowly, but in my heart I know it's one or all of those three bearings.
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Old 05-26-2021, 05:49 AM   #39
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Let me repeat my advice to contact Steve Becker at Bert's Model A in Denver. Steve is VERY helpful and can probably help you out with sourcing replacement bearings.
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Old 05-26-2021, 10:25 AM   #40
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

Would bronze bushings work in place of the roller bearings? (in a transmission)
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Old 05-26-2021, 12:08 PM   #41
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

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Mr Roboto WHO did FORD use primarily/source there felt washer& oil seals from?.

He or someone else will correct me if I'm wrong but I believe it was Chicago Rawhide.
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Old 08-03-2021, 08:54 AM   #42
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Default Re: Transmission bearings

Does anyone know if this issue with the transmission bearing been solved?
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