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Old 03-22-2012, 06:50 AM   #1
ken ct
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Default M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

Disagreement on whats correct carb for late 38 + all of 39. Chandler Grove or Ford or Ford-Holley. Evidently the Club published 38-39 book says different. ??????? ken ct.
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Old 03-22-2012, 07:39 AM   #2
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

I always believed C-G from 38 til early 39, then 91-99. I do stand to be corrected.
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Old 03-22-2012, 08:01 AM   #3
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Thanks 52. ken ct
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Old 03-22-2012, 08:27 AM   #4
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

The engineering release forms from Ford's Archives shows that the Chandler-Groves carburetor was released for partial production on March 30, 1937, which I suspect is much earlier than most folks realized.
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Old 03-22-2012, 08:38 AM   #5
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

Also, keep in mind that sometimes even the books are wrong . The guy who wrote that book (Gary Mallast sp?) could have been wrong or at least not 100% correct on what he wrote in that book . It has happened before and will again even on those new books the V8 Club is allowing to be published or reprinted these days
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Old 03-22-2012, 09:28 AM   #6
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Well ive rebuilt and sold dozens of CG to people with pristine 39's and have never heard a complaint from any of them that concourse judgeing knocked points off for having the wrong carb. Are all these people wrong.You know trailer queens want only whats completely correct for there boxed toys.And they pay a premium price for them as supply of CG is very small out there.Like to hear from Gary Mallest on this subject. ken ct
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Old 03-22-2012, 11:04 AM   #7
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Ken,
I'd have to go with Kube.
I invite the customer to decide and suggest he discuss with Gary Mallast the
'38 advisor from the V8 club or Mike Kubarth. A look at the date etching on the glass
of the vehicle in question as well as early vs late or later features is a good way
to pin down what's right and not right.
Charlie ny
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Old 03-22-2012, 11:28 AM   #8
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

Thanks Charlie, ken ct. I just talked to Allen Darr in Wa. ,He is the club advisor for 39-40 fords. He says Chandler Groves was used on all 39's and were marked 91-99 so i have to assume the Chandler Groves that were not numbered were early production ones,that is late 38's. when they replaced the Stromberg 97's.on the early 38's.

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Old 03-22-2012, 12:50 PM   #9
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

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Originally Posted by ken ct View Post
.You know trailer queens want only whats completely correct for there boxed toys. ken ct
If it's documentation that you can show them that you're after, the official Ford parts book is pretty good. As you can see, it shows Chandler-Grove in '38 and "91-99" in 39-41. Ought to be pretty convincing documentation I would think. Of course, Ford specified the Holley 94 (Ford "59") to replace all of them beginning in '32. Highlights are for my car.
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Old 03-22-2012, 01:38 PM   #10
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There are many mistakes in the green bible and there were CG that were marked 91-99 i have 1 of them.The rest of the ones i have have NO # on them.ken ct. I guess its up to the judges frame of mind and their not always right either.I'll leave it up to the buyer as to which one he wants so if its wrong as far as the judge its on there shoulder not mine. so be it. ken ct.
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Old 03-22-2012, 01:52 PM   #11
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry


So, how about a hypothetical question; What if someone discovered a “barn find” original ’39 Ford (any body style) that was a low mileage, mid to late year production car, with a CG carburetor on it (but with documentation found in the glove box) that the same dealer that sold the car replaced whatever carburetor was on the car (when it was delivered from the factory) with the CG carburetor, just prior to it being stashed in a barn for its long nap. Would it pass muster under the scrutiny of the EFV8 Concourse and/or Dearborn Judges? I’m just curious as I prefer function over questionable or proven originality. I’m actually running a Model 21-29 on our ’39 CS, as I did not have a CG or a Model 91-99 available. Correct carburetor or not, the ’39 CS runs just fine. But I guess that doesn’t count when being judged…
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Old 03-22-2012, 04:47 PM   #12
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So, how about a hypothetical question; What if someone discovered a “barn find” original ’39 Ford (any body style) that was a low mileage, mid to late year production car, with a CG carburetor on it (but with documentation found in the glove box) that the same dealer that sold the car replaced whatever carburetor was on the car (when it was delivered from the factory) with the CG carburetor, just prior to it being stashed in a barn for its long nap. Would it pass muster under the scrutiny of the EFV8 Concourse and/or Dearborn Judges? I’m just curious as I prefer function over questionable or proven originality. I’m actually running a Model 21-29 on our ’39 CS, as I did not have a CG or a Model 91-99 available. Correct carburetor or not, the ’39 CS runs just fine. But I guess that doesn’t count when being judged…
No they dont care,it will run fine with almost anything on them,If i was the judge in your case i would deduct points a 21-29 carb was only used on 42 only fords and mercs. I have the correct one if you want to pay the piper. lol there pricy.ken ct.
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Old 03-22-2012, 04:54 PM   #13
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

Ken, I don't care what a judge thinks, I'm my own judge and as long as our cars/trucks run well, I'm fine with that. Vic
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Old 03-22-2012, 05:15 PM   #14
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

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If it's documentation that you can show them that you're after, the official Ford parts book is pretty good. As you can see, it shows Chandler-Grove in '38 and "91-99" in 39-41. Ought to be pretty convincing documentation I would think. Of course, Ford specified the Holley 94 (Ford "59") to replace all of them beginning in '32. Highlights are for my car.
However, there is no indication as to who built the 91-99's.
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Old 03-22-2012, 05:23 PM   #15
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Ken,
What the hell happened to Mike Kubarths' reply....it was there this
morning........................................was n't it ?
Charlie ny
PS
By the way the '52 Olds Rochester 4 brl carb on my stroker Flathead
appears to be exactly the correct carb for my '41 1/2 ton
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Old 03-22-2012, 06:35 PM   #16
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Ken, I don't care what a judge thinks, I'm my own judge and as long as our cars/trucks run well, I'm fine with that. Vic
Im the same way Vic,i run a 47-48 glass bowl FP on my 36 completely wrong but thats what i want on it. also duals w/o mufflers.Its some customers that have the problem. ken ct.
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Old 03-22-2012, 06:38 PM   #17
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Ken,
What the hell happened to Mike Kubarths' reply....it was there this
morning........................................was n't it ?
Charlie ny
PS
By the way the '52 Olds Rochester 4 brl carb on my stroker Flathead
appears to be exactly the correct carb for my '41 1/2 ton
Hey Charlie it looks right to me too. lol ken ct.Aint this fun. he he.
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Old 03-22-2012, 08:27 PM   #18
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Hey Ken, Do you mind if I chime in on the 91-99 debate. I've been working on 39 Fords for about 25 years and collecting all kinds of parts for all of that time. I have about 15-20 of the 91-99 carburetors and I have never seen a Chandler Groves with that designation. There certainly were a variety of these carbs, some have 91-99 in a circle, some just the number in the usual place but most also have an H which I always thought meant Holley. The only other clear anomaly has to do with the cast base of these carbs. Walt Dupont posted a picture the other day of what he thought was an aftermarket carb. Fully half of my 91-99's have that base and the others the more traditional "arrow" base. I have even a variation of the more rounded carb base with some metal removed in some areas for some purpose. Perhaps it was for weight, to lessen heat transfer, or to save on manufacturing materials, who knows. However, they exist and are factory made not altered by someone tinkering in their garage. You are the most knowledgeable guy I know about carburetors, I almost want to drive down and show you my collection of 91-99's. AND I found a couple more of the early fuel pumps. Thanks for listening, Toby Lampert
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Old 03-22-2012, 09:09 PM   #19
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Out of 5 CG's i have only 1 of them says 91-99 on the side.Others are blank there.Would be interested in the pumps only if they have the off-set inlet and outlet. And its like a 1/2" diff in the levels not 1/16" like the common ones,and have the "T" handle petcock on them.I would also buy any glass bowl pumps that say"AC" in big letters on the top section.let me know what you have. ken ct Thanks Toby. I have both styles of bases also arrows and scalloped. ken ct.
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Old 03-23-2012, 01:34 AM   #20
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

Toby, the fact that you've never seen a CG with 91-99 should be a clue as to the scarcity of the animal.

Chandler Groves 94 was in mixed production with Strombergs for 1938. Not early, not late, but mixed. CG 91-99 and Ford 91-99 were mixed in production for 1939. There MAY have been a few unmarked CGs make it into early 1939 production, and there MAY have been a few CG 91-99s make it into early 1940 production. There has been no documentation to date that specifically denies those very slim possibilities, but to avoid Concourse day controversy, many if not most guys would rather not push the envelope without documentation, as to do so would surely cost some points. So, for '38, what is known to be correct is a CG or a Stromberg, for '39, a CG 91-99 or a Ford 91-99, both of which may have had an F, an H, or without either.

There is a theory that the 91-99s within a circle* were not original equipment on early '39s. There has been no documentation of this, it is just a theory, and both types are considered correct. It would be helpful if anyone could offer Pro or Con to this theory, and especially if anyone had in his possession a CG having a 91-99 within a circle.

*The circle, or "coin" model designations continued beyond the early years, as the body of the carburetor remained interchangeable while the controls evolved to suit the model year. Model designations on the molds could be easily changed out to a different "coin" as the production need arose, thereby gaining full use of older molds. This production method was particularly useful in the manufacture of service replacement carburetors for previous model years than those in current production.
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Old 03-23-2012, 05:44 AM   #21
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

Interesting thread and reply's, similar to what I was dealing with cab wood on my 39 P/U. I had to order 38 cab wood, seems Ford used up what they had and then changed thing's again

What is the longest year span Ford ever kept a part or design with out changeing it again year to year I'm learning why alot of these Ford guy's have no hair.
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Old 03-23-2012, 05:49 AM   #22
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Your theory seems to hold some water 38,i know there seems to be many more CG that are blank on the drivers side than 91-99's CG.Im going to go with the "what ever the customer wants he gets" deal,that way it takes the mistake out of my hands when he makes the choice.Thanks for your opinion 38. ken ct.
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Old 03-23-2012, 05:55 AM   #23
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Interesting thread and reply's, similar to what I was dealing with cab wood on my 39 P/U. I had to order 38 cab wood, seems Ford used up what they had and then changed thing's again

What is the longest year span Ford ever kept a part or design with out changeing it again year to year I'm learning why alot of these Ford guy's have no hair.
Dont know on that Fuel Pumps from late 36 to 40 did not change,thats a 4 1/2 yr run w/o a change,maybe those would be in the running? lol ken ct. And for such a long run WHY are these so hard to find???
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Old 03-23-2012, 06:05 AM   #24
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My 36 UTE has a Chandler Grove on it,is it not correct?
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Old 03-23-2012, 07:59 AM   #25
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My 36 UTE has a Chandler Grove on it,is it not correct?
I would say not correct,in my opinion should be a #48 or #97 strom. Most likely a 97. ken ct. or as was an option in 36 an 81 strom. at least in the states.

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Old 03-23-2012, 10:09 AM   #26
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Slightly off-topic but I acquired a Chandler-Groves carburetor for a Lincoln. It had Chandler Groves, 91-99, and on the back LZ. I restored it, then put it on the LZOC site, and it went to England!

Here 'tis, sans the base:


Here 'tis, fresh from ebay:


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Old 03-23-2012, 10:21 AM   #27
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"However, there is no indication as to who built the 91-99's"
I think all of these things in my pile of parts have the builder designation on the right side of the main bowl /body casting near the bottom of the accel pump...H for Holley, F (usually in script) for the minority built by Ford.
I also have 3 CG carbs, provenance and exact age unknown...2 are Holley built, one is Ford built.
I think that all of the top and bowl castings except 59 type passed out of the parts supply quickly, as Ford simply substituted the later versions culminating with the 59. The CG types had minor metering differences in the bleed holes on nozzle bars, at least, on the others I think just about all the change was in bowl vent locations and none of the changes precluded use on the older models as replacement parts.
Most of these carbs have passed through the hands of commercial rebuilders during their lives, and were rebuilt in huge batches with all the parts reassembled in random combinations, so a high percentage of core carbs are not really representative of anything in particular.
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Old 03-23-2012, 11:05 AM   #28
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So, in conclusion, one can surmise (based on the information herein) that, at best, the evidence is inconclusive with respect to exactly identifying the correct (if that is even a proper term to use in this situation) factory installed carburetor for late production '38 as well as most production '39's. Additionally, as noted, most carburetors in question (over the last 70+ years) have been rebuilt at least once and could have possibly (most likely) been rebuilt using myriad components that were/are interchangeable with several types of carburetors used in Ford production at that time. If, in fact, this preponderance of evidence holds true, does that negate the loss of points in judging, relevant to the question of correctness with respect to the carburetor? Just curious…
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Old 03-23-2012, 11:11 AM   #29
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39portlander,

In response to your earlier question, three candidates come to mind, both of 17 years of use (1932-48) without change, namely the front wheel bearings, V-8 starter motors and universal joints.
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Old 03-23-2012, 11:12 AM   #30
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Wheel lug nuts would be another candidate.
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Old 03-23-2012, 11:12 AM   #31
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Judging is based on what the factory was supposed to have used the day the car was assembled...though that may be hard to figure out. Problems that have accumulated since that day, including Ford replacemant parts, do not affect what judging involves! There are probably a lot of legitimate variants of parts reaching assembly plants a bit earlier or later than judging standards, but judging would still be based on what the judging book says!
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Old 03-23-2012, 11:31 AM   #32
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Judging is based on what the factory was supposed to have used the day the car was assembled...though that may be hard to figure out. Problems that have accumulated since that day, including Ford replacemant parts, do not affect what judging involves! There are probably a lot of legitimate variants of parts reaching assembly plants a bit earlier or later than judging standards, but judging would still be based on what the judging book says!
My point exactly! Even with little or no factual proof, the judging criteria will penalize a participant if his vehicle does not conform to their standards (right or wrong)... In my opinion, that practice severely diminishes the value of judging for correctness...
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Old 03-23-2012, 12:02 PM   #33
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91A 2106 retainer for the rubber brake lines would be my guess as the longest
used part number.The prefix indicates 1939(hydraulic brakes first year) and is
still a good number from Ford!Kind of a horse shoe clip.The B7A 2457 A brake
pad(1957) was used up until recently.Now when you look up a part you need
the VIN number because of the frequency of changes.......
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Old 03-23-2012, 12:06 PM   #34
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And when you get down to the nitty gritty its all up to the Judge. And who wrote up the judgeing standards ,people like you and me. ken ct.
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Old 03-23-2012, 12:50 PM   #35
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91A 2106 retainer for the rubber brake lines would be my guess as the longest
used part number.The prefix indicates 1939(hydraulic brakes first year) and is
still a good number from Ford!Kind of a horse shoe clip.The B7A 2457 A brake
pad(1957) was used up until recently.Now when you look up a part you need
the VIN number because of the frequency of changes.......
The FL1A oil filter and the 9 inch rear end?
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Old 03-23-2012, 01:13 PM   #36
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Ken,
What the hell happened to Mike Kubarths' reply....it was there this
morning........................................was n't it ?
Charlie ny
PS
By the way the '52 Olds Rochester 4 brl carb on my stroker Flathead
appears to be exactly the correct carb for my '41 1/2 ton
Looks like he bailed out on you Charlie. It's called edit/delete/cut and run, etc. Some guys do this when they realize they have posted something that could be construed as incorrect or maybe they can't take the heat of the information posted by others who may have better information to present. JMHO
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Old 03-23-2012, 02:40 PM   #37
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John, as we all know, anyone that represents themselves, to be the indisputable expert on any subject, is only subjecting themselves to scrutiny from those that may question the validity of their alleged expertise. It’s when they claim to have garnered the (so called irrefutable knowledge and information) through years of exhaustive research, but repeatedly decline request from questioners to present the sources of that research (for verification). That simply serves to further diminish the validity of their previous statements, which they ascertain to be factual beyond any doubt. In my opinion, those individuals are engaging in a game of self-aggrandizement that ultimately results to their own detriment.
This pastime we take part in is supposed to be a hobby, which by definition is; an activity or interest perused and engaged in primarily for pleasure. My take on that is to not take these things (judging and correctness of parts, etc.) too seriously. Right or wrong, as Henry built it or otherwise, I enjoy driving our cars and hold no rancor for those that would rather restore a vehicle to a level far beyond what any production car of the era could have or would have achieved. I enjoy looking at those vehicles as well, and fully appreciate the amount of work and dedication that went into creating it. The question of the correctness of a carburetor or most any other part on the vehicle never comes to mind.

I think I'll go out for a drive... Vic
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Old 03-23-2012, 03:18 PM   #38
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There are many mistakes in the green bible . . . I guess its up to the judges frame of mind and their not always right either.
Even though the "Green Bible" may not always be accurate, it is documentation. I actually used it to avoid a loss of points in judging my car at the EFV8 Western National Meet when the judges said my front spring should have a cover like the back one. I showed them my "Bible" that had no parts listing for such a cover on the front spring of my car. What could they do? They had no choice. They could hardly argue with the green bible. That had to leave me the points.

So, right or wrong, the green bible is still great documentation to support your position at judging time.
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Old 03-23-2012, 09:33 PM   #39
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

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John, as we all know, anyone that represents themselves, to be the indisputable expert on any subject, is only subjecting themselves to scrutiny from those that may question the validity of their alleged expertise. It’s when they claim to have garnered the (so called irrefutable knowledge and information) through years of exhaustive research, but repeatedly decline request from questioners to present the sources of that research (for verification). That simply serves to further diminish the validity of their previous statements, which they ascertain to be factual beyond any doubt. In my opinion, those individuals are engaging in a game of self-aggrandizement that ultimately results to their own detriment.
This pastime we take part in is supposed to be a hobby, which by definition is; an activity or interest perused and engaged in primarily for pleasure. My take on that is to not take these things (judging and correctness of parts, etc.) too seriously. Right or wrong, as Henry built it or otherwise, I enjoy driving our cars and hold no rancor for those that would rather restore a vehicle to a level far beyond what any production car of the era could have or would have achieved. I enjoy looking at those vehicles as well, and fully appreciate the amount of work and dedication that went into creating it. The question of the correctness of a carburetor or most any other part on the vehicle never comes to mind.

I think I'll go out for a drive... Vic
Vic, all good points and well said.

As for taking a drive....I can honestly say whenever I am driving or riding in an early Ford Flathead powered V8 I am totally in my glory. Not too many other things I do or have done can compare.
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Old 03-24-2012, 09:47 AM   #40
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John talking about glory you have to tell Vic about my duals. G.M.
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Old 03-24-2012, 11:19 AM   #41
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I like to use my car as a time machine to take me back to 1947 every time I get in it and it usually works pretty good as long as I keep it totally authentic original and know that it is. That way I get the exact experience driving it now that I would get driving it then. So, I avoid having anything on the car or in the car that would "destroy the illusion" for me and I've found that almost any intrusion that's not authentic will do that. It's like the scene from the movie "Somewhere In Time" where Christopher Reeves has so authentically reproduced his life as it would have been in a former time that he actually traveled back in time to that time that he recreated. It was all going so well until he pulled a penny out of his vest pocket from his future time. That was it. The end of his illusion that he was never able to get back. That's part of the reason I try so hard for authenticity. The other motive was just to see how close I could get for judging - a kind of "Mr. Everest" attempt for me. Now that I've done that I've relaxed a little on the smallest minute details but still must preserve my "illusion" for pleasure driving.
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Old 03-24-2012, 02:21 PM   #42
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Henry, you hit the nail on the head. The guys who need radial tires and modern radios should read you post again. And the judging thing also. My car will never be judged, as it's not going to be restored in my lifetime, but I can count on one hand the incorrect items other than cosmetics, and it's certainly more authentic than the Fords of my youth!
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Old 03-24-2012, 04:01 PM   #43
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I have an original '39 Standard coupe - came from Minnesota.
Chassis number indicates it was assembled in the 3rd week of '39 production - Oct 1938. The firewall is a stamping carried over from 1938 with a swage in it, so the wiring loom cover is unable to be attached flush because of that swage, consequently it does not have one.
Wonder what the Judges would make of that.
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Old 03-24-2012, 07:21 PM   #44
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With respect, that date is when the engine was built, not when it was assembled into a chassis. That mating could be weeks or even months later, depending on inventory levels and shipping distances from a single engine manufacturing source (Dearborn in your example).
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Old 03-24-2012, 07:32 PM   #45
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Henry, you hit the nail on the head. The guys who need radial tires and modern radios should read your post again.
Yeah, if you haven't done the "Bias Ply Boogie" you haven't driven before 1960. It's part of the total authentic experience that "takes you back." Regarding modern radios - my favorite "unwind" each night is to take a cruise in "Old Henry" with my little Chihuahua "Pepe" and listen to the AM radio station that plays old radio shows from the 30's and 40's for 30-60 minutes. And have the signal fade in and out and a little "crackle" static now and then. Now, that's really "going back." You just can't get back any other way.
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Old 03-24-2012, 07:38 PM   #46
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Henry, the old car radio is the catalist that makes the whole experience come alive. You can tune the hum out of the radio, listening to oldies, and thinking that at any minute you might here the news of the attack on Hawaii.
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Old 03-25-2012, 02:26 PM   #47
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Henry, the old car radio is the catalist that makes the whole experience come alive. You can tune the hum out of the radio, listening to oldies, and thinking that at any minute you might here the news of the attack on Hawaii.
Alan, wouldn't it be Korea on the radio... remember, he's driving a Post WWII car... How's this for nostalgia?

I found this placard in the storage area underneath the back seat in our '39 LC. Turns out, the original owner was an Air Raid Warden on the East end of Long Island, following the attack on Perl Harbor. Back to the Future
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Old 03-25-2012, 11:42 PM   #48
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Vic, let's see now... "Old soldiers never die..."
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Old 03-26-2012, 05:16 AM   #49
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All this hasd done will get me to look at my collection of carbs and try to see what I have. I know I have a 91-99 that was sent to me by a friend that was rebuilt not long ago.
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Old 03-26-2012, 05:40 AM   #50
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Well at least it accomplished something Kerk,lol ken ct. [More confusion]
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Old 03-26-2012, 06:31 AM   #51
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Vic, let's see now... "Old soldiers never die..."

That quote was from General MacArthur's farewell speech to Congress, after he was relived from duty by President Truman in 1951, during the Korean conflict, a more appropriate reference for a “time traveler” in a ’47 Ford.
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Old 03-26-2012, 07:13 AM   #52
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All this hasd done will get me to look at my collection of carbs and try to see what I have. I know I have a 91-99 that was sent to me by a friend that was rebuilt not long ago.
Kerk, these posts have convinced me that those who THOUGHT they knew all there was to know about the supposedly correct carburetor(s) used in production for these year early Fords actually didn't quite know all they were professing to know to begin with. It also puts more doubt in my mind that those who may be judging these vehicles for concourse correctness do not have the knowledge to correctly judge these vehicles as far as which carburetor is 100% correct for each vehicle model and year of manufacture in question here. It also convinces me that the books already written and possibly those that are in the process of being written are not or may not be correct regarding this subject. Therefore, I totally agree with Vic Piano....and that is...put the carburetor that you prefer to have on your vehicle (hopefully that's the one that gives the best performance) and drive that vehicle for your own enjoyment and never mind what the judges or self proclaimed experts say about what's correct and what's not....N E X T
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Old 03-26-2012, 11:14 AM   #53
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Everybodys entitled to their own opinion even you. After 50 some posts nobody is in agreement,judges have been wrong,books have been wrong,and people have been wrong,The customer gets what he asks for that way im not resonsible for his mistake. ken ct.Hes supposed to know whats right for his car.
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Old 03-26-2012, 11:39 AM   #54
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Well painted carburetors are not correct either but you do that don't you? At least you did to a NOS one I sent you a few years back when I didn't know any better.
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Old 03-26-2012, 12:09 PM   #55
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Ken, would you agree that your summation of the situation lends credence to my aforementioned position with respect to judging in general? Unfortunately, there are few, if any, people alive today that had first hand experience with the vehicles that we are interested in. To further the point, as has been noted, even some of the books and reference material (published by FoMoCo as well as others) are at best contradictory in many areas, making it virtually impossible for anyone to make the blanket statement that a particular part, etc. was/is the only correct piece on a particular vehicle. Vic
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Old 03-26-2012, 12:19 PM   #56
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John, There is no disagreement on the judging field. None with the club books either. There is only confusion by individuals and among those who would wish their own carburetor to be accepted without point deduction. Those who wish certainty for correctness without point deduction should re-read post # 20. Others can just install the carb that works for you!

Ken, considering that this thread has gone so far off subject, your 50+ post statement is meaningless. To place the onus on the customer with your carburetor sales is a good decision in any case, and should be adhered to by other vendors as well. Nobody should have to rely on a salesman regarding correctness, nor should that salesman be put in that position. You continue to sell carburetors, and warranty function not correctness, and you'll sleep better.
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Old 03-26-2012, 12:40 PM   #57
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I agree with you and Vic,too many parts have been changed around on these things over the yrs and a lot is lost in the translation over the yrs.Too many opinions in the pot spoil the soup.ken ct. Im done with it. ken ct. "kens ford carburetors"
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Old 03-27-2012, 11:38 AM   #58
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My guess for the longest run of a part is the fly wheel ring gear. It was used from 32-48 without a change.
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Old 03-27-2012, 03:26 PM   #59
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My guess, Most common and longest running.....
72000 series, cotter pins ranging from 1/16" x 3/8" to 5/32" x 1 3/4" Model T?........... till ?
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Old 03-27-2012, 03:51 PM   #60
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Well painted carburetors are not correct either but you do that don't you? At least you did to a NOS one I sent you a few years back when I didn't know any better.
If i didn't clear coat them,people like you would leave there finger prints all over the bare porous pot metal,would you rather have a rebuilt with finger prints all over it or one W/O ken ct.
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Old 03-27-2012, 04:18 PM   #61
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Ken, I'm with 37coupe on that one. We know you want to make 'em look purdy, but... ......Clearcoat?


forgive me, I recently got hung up on these stupid emoticons!
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Old 03-27-2012, 05:23 PM   #62
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Uncle Max puts a nice finish on his rebuilt 97's and it's not painted or sprayed on.
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Old 03-27-2012, 06:49 PM   #63
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The acid I use creates a barrier coating, impervious to fuel and mineral deposits.
Kind of a grey-green-pewter color and should last another 70 years.
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Old 03-27-2012, 11:40 PM   #64
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Henry, the old car radio is the catalist that makes the whole experience come alive. You can tune the hum out of the radio, listening to oldies, and thinking that at any minute you might here the news of the attack on Hawaii.
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That quote was from General MacArthur's farewell speech to Congress, after he was relived from duty by President Truman in 1951, during the Korean conflict, a more appropriate reference for a “time traveler” in a ’47 Ford.

OK guys, let's get the history straight. In 1947 I wouldn't have heard the news of the attack on Pearl Harbor which was 6 years earlier in 1941. Neither would I have heard news about the Korean War which didn't begin until 1950. What I might have heard in 1947 were:


"Chuck" Yeager pushing his Bell X-1 past "Mach 1" to break the sound barrier

Howard Hughes perfoming the maiden (and only) flight of the "Spruce Goose", the largest fixed-wing aircraft ever built

And, of course, the death and funeral of our founder, Henry Ford.

Oh, and what about the movies? "Miracle on 34th Street", "Gentlemen's Agreement", "Life with Father", "The Fugitive", "The Secret Life of Walter Mitty", and "The Bishop's Wife". Now there's some real news.
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Old 03-28-2012, 01:15 AM   #65
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Uncle Max puts a nice finish on his rebuilt 97's and it's not painted or sprayed on.
It didn't seem to bother you when you were buying an 81 off me.Dont bother reading my posts if you dont like what i do. ken ct.
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Old 03-28-2012, 06:36 AM   #66
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The acid I use creates a barrier coating, impervious to fuel and mineral deposits.
Kind of a grey-green-pewter color and should last another 70 years.
Hi Uncle Max, I have seen that nice looking finish on carburetors you have rebuilt for several of my friends. I would like to send you two carburetors that have been previously rebuilt but unfortunately finished by another method that does not look as good as the finish you do on your rebuilds. I'm planning to run these as duals on my Avatar car in the near future and would like them to have the same outer finish appearance. Right now the outer finish looks completely different on these two carburators. Will be sending you a pm/email explaining all the details on this Thanks in advance for your help!
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Old 03-28-2012, 06:59 AM   #67
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OK guys, let's get the history straight. In 1947 I wouldn't have heard the news of the attack on Pearl Harbor which was 6 years earlier in 1941. Neither would I have heard news about the Korean War which didn't begin until 1950. What I might have heard in 1947 were:


"Chuck" Yeager pushing his Bell X-1 past "Mach 1" to break the sound barrier

Howard Hughes perfoming the maiden (and only) flight of the "Spruce Goose", the largest fixed-wing aircraft ever built

And, of course, the death and funeral of our founder, Henry Ford.

Oh, and what about the movies? "Miracle on 34th Street", "Gentlemen's Agreement", "Life with Father", "The Fugitive", "The Secret Life of Walter Mitty", and "The Bishop's Wife". Now there's some real news.
Old Henry...Thanks for the history corrections regarding previous posts. I knew we were involved in Korea after 1947 because I remember hearing things about the beginning of this war in school and from my parents around 1950 but did not associate all of those other happenings with the year 1947.
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Old 03-28-2012, 08:01 AM   #68
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My reference to Korea on the '47's radio was because December 7, 1941 was prior to the '47 being built. Anything that happened after the car was built, right up to and including today, could have been listened to on the '47's radio. As another point of interest, '47 was also the year the microwave oven was introduced, and the first food cooked in it was popcorn...
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Old 03-28-2012, 08:18 AM   #69
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Actually it was a chocolate bar that melted in an engineers shirt pocket,this was when microwaves were accidently founded to be usefull for cooking.
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Old 03-28-2012, 09:01 AM   #70
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And, how about the transistor? There's another biggie for 1947.
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Old 03-28-2012, 09:24 AM   #71
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Actually it was a chocolate bar that melted in an engineers shirt pocket,this was when microwaves were accidently founded to be usefull for cooking.
What was the engineer doing inside the microwave, eating popcorn perhaps?LOL
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Old 03-28-2012, 09:28 AM   #72
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I got the impression the entire laboratory room was one big microwave oven,lucky his eyes didn't pop out. He didn't like popcorn,he was a chocoholic.
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Old 03-28-2012, 09:46 AM   #73
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I got the impression the entire laboratory room was one big microwave oven,lucky his eyes didn't pop out. He didn't like popcorn,he was a chocoholic.
Are you sure it wasn't caramel... that goes better with popcorn...
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Old 03-28-2012, 10:36 AM   #74
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You guys are cracking me up ....and having been an engineer and working for 'Corporate America' my entire career makes it even funnier. I can actually invision the chocolate bar melting in the pocket scenario. I have seen similar funny things happen during my days of working on product development projects
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Old 03-28-2012, 11:01 AM   #75
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Good illustration of the difference between scientists and normal human beings, too! The guy realized he had stumbled into something of possible utility...I would have just been annoyed at having chocolate all over my pen and shirt.
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Old 03-28-2012, 11:07 AM   #76
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It got my curiosity going so I Googled it and found this:
A Brief History of the Microwave Oven

Like many of today's great inventions, the microwave oven was a by-product of another technology. It was during a radar-related research project around 1946 that Dr. Percy Spencer, a self-taught engineer with the Raytheon Corporation, noticed something very unusual. He was testing a new vacuum tube called a magnetron (we are searching for a picture of an actual 1946 magnetron), when he discovered that the candy bar in his pocket had melted. This intrigued Dr. Spencer, so he tried another experiment. This time he placed some popcorn kernels near the tube and, perhaps standing a little farther away, he watched with an inventive sparkle in his eye as the popcorn sputtered, cracked and popped all over his lab.


According to this information it took place in '46, not '47... Maybe the guy that wrote this also published Ford Parts Catalogs...
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Old 03-28-2012, 11:36 AM   #77
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His young lab assistant was named Redenbacher ,Orval Redenbacher I believe.
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Old 03-28-2012, 12:05 PM   #78
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On the magnetron...search books on WWII involving the development of electronic warfare and physics. The magnetron was the basis of radar as well as the "Radar Range"!
We have a book by one of the English mad scientists, and in the early days he was making experimental magnetrons in his lab himself!
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Old 03-28-2012, 01:12 PM   #79
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His young lab assistant was named Redenbacher ,Orval Redenbacher I believe.


Yeah, his wife’s name was Betty Croker and their dogs name was Jiffy Pop
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Old 03-28-2012, 04:23 PM   #80
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In the early 60s a manufacture of fans and small appliances asked me to take a prototype micro oven home for the weekend to evaluate it and see what I thought about it. Saturday morning I decided I would make some soft boiled eggs. I put a couple in the micro wave and pushed the button and in 2 seconds they exploded. There wasn't anything that looked like an egg and no trace of shells. This oven had a small mesh stainless steel screen over the glass and took 2 or 3 hours with a tooth brush to clean it. G.M.
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Old 03-28-2012, 04:52 PM   #81
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

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Yeah, his wife’s name was Betty Croker....
Didn't she invent the croker sack?
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Old 03-28-2012, 07:47 PM   #82
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The "candy bar in the shirt pocket" story demonstrates the difference between Engineers and Day Laborers. Any ditch digger would instinctively know not to put his candy bar in his pocket!
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Old 03-28-2012, 08:10 PM   #83
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The "candy bar in the shirt pocket" story demonstrates the difference between Engineers and Day Laborers. Any ditch digger would instinctively know not to put his candy bar in his pocket!
Yea it shows you how smart engineers are,duh. ken ct
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Old 03-29-2012, 06:38 AM   #84
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

GM, I wish you would have told this earlier, About 5 years ago, I blew an egg up in a motel oven, only it was already boiled. You could have saved me some embarrassment.
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Old 03-29-2012, 08:43 AM   #85
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Cecil, I'm not sure it's true or not but I once heard a guy who lives in Connecticut put his Poodle in the microwave trying to dry the poor puppies fur real quickly and....well...the rest of the story is too sad to tell........but I did hear he was not an engineer though
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Old 03-29-2012, 08:56 AM   #86
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How did we get from a "Disagreement on what's the correct carb for late 38 + all of 39", to microwave oven's and dumb engineers?
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Old 03-29-2012, 11:25 AM   #87
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How did we get from a "Disagreement on what's the correct carb for late 38 + all of 39", to microwave oven's and dumb engineers?


It may well be that this is a rhetorical question (not intended to receive a response) but, in case it isn't here it is in a nutshell:

#6 ken ct explains why the original question - that owners of "trailer queens" want completely correct parts for their "boxed toys."

#11 Vic Piano responds to hangups about authenticity with: "I prefer function over questionable or proven originality" and "I don't care what a judge thinks, I'm my own judge and as long as our cars/trucks run well, I'm fine with that. Vic " in #13.

#16 ken ct agrees with "Im the same way Vic,i run a 47-48 glass bowl FP on my 36 completely wrong but thats what i want on it."

#41 I explain why, in addition to judging, I go for authenticity with "I like to use my car as a time machine to take me back to 1947 every time I get in it and it usually works pretty good as long as I keep it totally authentic original and know that it is" and "my favorite 'unwind' each night is to take a cruise in 'Old Henry' and listen to the AM radio station that plays old radio shows from the 30's and 40's for 30-60 minutes" in # 45.

#46 ford38v8 suggests that while listening to the 1947 radio shows on my radio taking me back to 1947 "any minute you might here the news of the attack on Hawaii."

#47 Vic Piano corrects with "wouldn't it be Korea on the radio... remember, he's driving a Post WWII car."

#64 I correct both with "OK guys, let's get the history straight. In 1947 I wouldn't have heard the news of the attack on Pearl Harbor which was 6 years earlier in 1941. Neither would I have heard news about the Korean War which didn't begin until 1950. What I might have heard in 1947 were:

"Chuck" Yeager pushing his Bell X-1 past "Mach 1" to break the sound barrier

Howard Hughes perfoming the maiden (and only) flight of the "Spruce Goose", the largest fixed-wing aircraft ever built

And, of course, the death and funeral of our founder, Henry Ford.

#68 Vic Piano added: "'47 was also the year the microwave oven was introduced."


#69 37 Coupe explained how microwaves were discovered: "it was a chocolate bar that melted in an engineers shirt pocket ."

#82 ford38v8 comments: "The "candy bar in the shirt pocket" story demonstrates the difference between Engineers and Day Laborers. Any ditch digger would instinctively know not to put his candy bar in his pocket! "

#83 ken ct levels the final blow with "Yea it shows you how smart engineers are,duh. ken ct"

And that's how we got from point A to point Z in a nutshell.
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Old 03-29-2012, 11:49 AM   #88
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

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Originally Posted by Old Henry View Post

It may well be that this is a rhetorical question (not intended to receive a response) but, in case it isn't here it is in a nutshell:

#6 ken ct explains why the original question - that owners of "trailer queens" want completely correct parts for their "boxed toys."

#11 Vic Piano responds to hangups about authenticity with: "I prefer function over questionable or proven originality" and "I don't care what a judge thinks, I'm my own judge and as long as our cars/trucks run well, I'm fine with that. Vic " in #13.

#16 ken ct agrees with "Im the same way Vic,i run a 47-48 glass bowl FP on my 36 completely wrong but thats what i want on it."

#41 I explain why, in addition to judging, I go for authenticity with "I like to use my car as a time machine to take me back to 1947 every time I get in it and it usually works pretty good as long as I keep it totally authentic original and know that it is" and "my favorite 'unwind' each night is to take a cruise in 'Old Henry' and listen to the AM radio station that plays old radio shows from the 30's and 40's for 30-60 minutes" in # 45.

#46 ford38v8 suggests that while listening to the 1947 radio shows on my radio taking me back to 1947 "any minute you might here the news of the attack on Hawaii."

#47 Vic Piano corrects with "wouldn't it be Korea on the radio... remember, he's driving a Post WWII car."

#64 I correct both with "OK guys, let's get the history straight. In 1947 I wouldn't have heard the news of the attack on Pearl Harbor which was 6 years earlier in 1941. Neither would I have heard news about the Korean War which didn't begin until 1950. What I might have heard in 1947 were:

"Chuck" Yeager pushing his Bell X-1 past "Mach 1" to break the sound barrier

Howard Hughes perfoming the maiden (and only) flight of the "Spruce Goose", the largest fixed-wing aircraft ever built

And, of course, the death and funeral of our founder, Henry Ford.

#68 Vic Piano added: "'47 was also the year the microwave oven was introduced."


#69 37 Coupe explained how microwaves were discovered: "it was a chocolate bar that melted in an engineers shirt pocket ."

#82 ford38v8 comments: "The "candy bar in the shirt pocket" story demonstrates the difference between Engineers and Day Laborers. Any ditch digger would instinctively know jnot to put his candy bar in his pocket! "

#83 ken ct levels the final blow with "Yea it shows you how smart engineers are,duh. ken ct"

And that's how we got from point A to point Z in a nutshell.
A really great summary Henry . I'm just glad I didn't get named as a perpetrator or a perpetuater of this massively confusing post that was originally posted to clarify the use of correct carburetors on certain year vehicles
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Old 03-29-2012, 12:47 PM   #89
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John, you're as guilty as the rest of us. Just look at that ugly chocolate stain on your shirt.
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Old 03-29-2012, 03:53 PM   #90
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Ha ha ha....LOL Alan, no chocolate on the pocket of this chocoholic EE. Now I did ruin several real nice shirts and my wife never forgave me for that. I was a 'rebel without a cause' type engineer who flatout refused to wear a nurdish plastic pocket protector filled with everything imaginable of which a detailed list of those typical items would be more than I care to type here My shirts were mostly all ruined by forgetting to put the cover on black ink felt tip pens that I unknowingly stuck in my shirt pocket tip facing down and by the time I realized that my shirt would have a football sized stain from the bottom of the pocket to my belt line. That happened to one nice shirt the first time I wore it to work
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Old 04-02-2012, 02:55 PM   #91
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Default Re: M.Kube,Charlie,NY,52Henry

I don't know, it was easy enough for me to follow it... But I'm not an Engineer...LOL
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